Liberal Hypocrisy about Intelligent Design

Here is an example of the Bible where you can twist it to your liking. Bible thumpers have selected verses to interprete their prejudices for ages.
I like Christians but I have worries about the Bible Thumpers so below is forthose Thumpers.

Reference: King James Version

Isaiah 14:
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning!
How art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart,
a) I will ascend into heaven,
b) I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:
c) I will sit also upon the mount of the Congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 d)I will ascend above the heights of the clouds:
e)I will be like the most High.


COMPARISON:

OLD TESTAMENT
1) Isaiah 14:12
How art thou fallen from heaven
O Lucifer, son of the morning!
(Note: Lucifer is Latin for bright.)

NEW TESTAMENT
Revelation 22:16
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star. (How arrogant, naming himself after such a lustrous heavenly body!)

OLD TESTAMENT
2) Isaiah 14:13 I will ascend into heaven


NEW TESTAMENT
Luke 24:51
And it came to pass, while he blessed them, he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven. Mark 16:19
So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

OLD TESTAMENT
3) Isaiah 14:13
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:

The stars of God are the Israelites. (See Numbers 24:17 "...there shall come a Star out of Jacob,...")

Genesis 15:5
And he brought him forth abroad, and said,
Look now towards heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him,
So shall thy seed be.

Deuteronomy 10:22
Thy fathers went down into Egypt with threescore and ten persons, and now the LORD thy God hath made thee as the stars of heaven for multitude.

NEW TESTAMENT
Matthew 19:28
And Jesus said unto them,
Verily I say unto you,
That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his the glory, ye also shall sit upon thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

OLD TESTAMENT
4) Isaiah 14:13
I will sit also upon the mount of the Congregation, in the sides of the north.
[Note:
a) Mt. Ophel, just south of the Temple Mount, has been identified as Mt. Zion. Jesus as a child sat in the Temple.
b) Location of the Last Supper is just north of (Mt. Zion?)]

Psalm 48:2
Beautiful for situation, the joy of the whole earth, is mount Zion, on the sides of the north, the city of the great King.

NEW TESTAMENT
Luke 2:46
And it came to pass, that after three days they found him in the temple, sitting in the midst of the doctors, both hearing them, and asking them questions.

Matthew 26:20
Now when the even was come, he sat down with the twelve.

Luke 22:14
And when the hour was come, he sat down, and the twelve apostles with him.

5) Isaiah 14:14
I will be like the most High.

God says He is the first and the last in the following passages:-

OLD TESTAMENT
Isaiah 41:4
Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he.

Isaiah 44:6
Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of Hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.

NEW TESTAMENT
Jesus says that he is the first and the last in the following passages:-

Revelation 1:11
Saying, I am the Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and untoLaodicea.

Revelation 1:17
And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

Revelation 22:13
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.

God's garments are sprinkled with blood in the following passage:-

OLD TESTAMENT
Isaiah 63:3
I have trodden the wine press alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.

Jesus' garment is dipped in blood in the following passage:-

NEW TESTAMENT
Revelation 19:13
And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

OLD TESTAMENT
In Isaiah, new heavens and new earth are mentioned in the following passage:-

Isaiah 66:22
For as the new heavens and new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.

NEW TESTAMENT
In Revelation, a new heaven and a new earth are mentioned in the following passage:-

Revelation 21:1
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away: and there was no more sea.

OLD TESTAMENT
God is the bridegroom of His people in the following:-

Isaiah 62:5
For as a young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee: and as the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall thy God rejoice over thee.

NEW TESTAMENT
Jesus is the bridegroom of his followers in the following:-

Matthew 9:15
And Jesus said unto them, Can the chilren of the bridechamber mourn, as long as the bridegroom is with them? but the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken from them, and shall they fast.

Mark 2:19.
And Jesus said unto them, Can the children of the bridechamber fast, while the bridegroom is with them? as long as they have the bridegroom with them, they cannot fast.
20. But the days will come, while the bridegroom shall be taken away from them, and then shall they fast in those days.

Luke 5:34.
And he said unto them, Can ye make the children of the bridegroom fast, while the bridegroom is with them?
35. But the days will come, when the bridegroom shall be taken away from them, and then shall they fast in those days.

Revelation 19:7.
Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
9. And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.

Revelation 20:9.
And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.

Isaiah 14:19
"But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch,..."
Note: The image of Jesus on the cross confirms it for there is no gravesite of him.

Jesus fits the descriptions of Lucifer almost to a T.
So is Jesus God or Lucifer?

e_brown,

Gay seems to be the new words for the kids. I have even heard the comment, "My computer is being gay."

Gay is the only adjective my daughter and her friends use.

Everything and everyone is gay.

I am trying to remember what word we used when I was a kid. Showing my age here but the last thing I remember is groovy.

I don't think "gay" = "groovy" the way kids are using it...

I don't know why we are so prejudiced against gays since we have evolved from them, not monkeys. One of our earliest ancestors was a gay with a permanent erection: HOMO ERECTUS.

lol

D'artagnan,

I realize gay doesn't = groovy. For the life of me, I can't think of what phrase we would have used when I was that age. The only phrase I could readily think of being used at all by my peers at the time was groovy.

Quote: I don't know why we are so prejudiced against gays since we have evolved from them, not monkeys. One of our earliest ancestors was a gay with a permanent erection: HOMO ERECTUS.


ROFLMAO - the first one this week! Thanks for the good laugh, JLN.

Talk72000, I had no idea the Bible could be interpreted to make Jesus and Lucifer seem like the same person, but I am not surprised after seeing the way the writers of the NT quote verses out of context to make it appear that Jesus fulfilled OT "prophecies."

Momma Angel, abortion is not the issue here and I don't know why you even brought it up.

The question is whether God was an incompetent or unintelligent designer who failed to realize that the pelvic opening needs to be larger than the head which must pass through it, or if he was malicious enough to deliberately make the birth canal too small in order to punish some women with excruciating pain, and refuses to change the design even though it causes millions of innocent babies and mothers to die during childbirth.

Which is it?

I do not think that my children need to be taught Jewish creation myths in science class as if it were factual information. Nor do I think they need to be taught that Ebonics is an acceptable alternate to using standard English. As I recall, California decided that kids should be taught in their native language instead of having to learn the language of their adopted country. That plan is unworkable when you have students with dozens of different languages and no one qualified to teach in them. We have enough problems trying to understand each other when we speak the same language; let's not complicate matters.

He could have made cavernous vaginas, but I think you'd be alotmore pissed about that.

There are other parts of the female body that would still do the trick just fine.

What it really is, is that the kingdom which God rules over is a spiritual one, and the powers which the spirit world has to act in this physical realm which we live in are very limited.

I Wrote:



Maybe you should read this again, Terry. My point was not abortion. My point was in the abortion issue the biggest argument seemed to be the taking away of the woman's choice.

I merely pointed out that it appears those that do not want ID taught are taking away someone's choice.

Our public schools also take away the choice to teach satanism. Do you know why?

Which, of course, doesn't have a whole lot to do with the topic of this thread.

What you do want, C.I.? I mean you have been offered compromise after compromise. Oh, no, wait. I already know what you want. You told me. You want total freedom from religion.

Terry:

I am glad you noticed that Biblical text can be twisted to whatever you like, all you need is to know the text, where they are located and then quote chapter and verse. The Thumpers have been doing that for ages and got away with it for people did not take the Bible seriously so they were ignorant of the tricks of the Thumpers.

talk72000,

That's a pretty broad brush. If you think all you need to know are where the verses are located and then quote them chapter and verse, you are mistaken.

And if you want to be really fair about it, what of the ones on these threads that point to one specific verse and not accept anyone else's understanding of that verse because it does not agree with what the (original) poster of the verse believes it says.

Some may use tricks, talk72000. I can't and won't deny that. I just think it's unfair to lump everyone into one category, don't you?

Tanakh

Isaiah 14:
12 How art thou fallen from heaven,
O Day Star, son of the Morning!
How art thou cut down to the ground,

Isaiah 14:
12 How are you fallen from heaven,
O Shining One, son of the Dawn!
How are you felled to earth,

Isaiah 14:12 (KJV with Hebrew)
"How art thou fallen from heaven,
O Helel, son of Shahar!
how art thou cut down to the ground,
which didst weaken the nations!"


Remeber, Helel was the morning star, and his father Shahar was god of the dawn.

"How you are fallen from heaven,
O Day Star, son of Dawn [i.e., Helal, son of the god Shahar]!
How you are cut down to the ground,
you who laid the nations low!
You said in your heart,
`I will ascend to heaven;
I will raise my throne above the stars of El; I will sit on the Mount of Assembly on the heights of Zaphon [the sacred mountain of El where the Assembly of the Gods met in council].
But you are brought down to Sheol, to the depths of the Pit" (Isaiah 14:12-15).

In his fallen state, Helal was known as Azazel, the earth-bound demon to whom the Israelites gave as a yearly sacrifice on the Day of Atonement a "scapegoat" that was sent into the wilderness for Azazel after another goat had been sacrificed before the mercy seat of Yahweh:

"[Aaron] shall take from the congregation of the people of Israel two male goats for a sin offering . . . and Aaron shall cast lots on the two goats, one lot for Yahweh and the other lot for Azazel. Aaron shall present the goat on which the lot fell for Yahweh, and offer it as a sin offering; but the goat on which the lot fell for Azazel shall be presented alive before Yahweh to make atonement over it, that it may be sent away into the wilderness to Azazel" (Leviticus 16:5,7-10).

Shachar 'Dawn'
Shalim's twin twin and one of the first, if not only, pair of gracious gods, the children and cleavers of the sea. They were born of El and Athirat or her female companion. The new family builds a sanctuary in the desert and lives there for eight years. According to Isaiah 14:12, he is the father of Helel or Lucifer, the 'light-bringer', usually taken to mean the morning-star.
HELEL: Erroneously identified with Satan and Lucifer. The Light Bringer, the Morning Star. Son of Shachar. Helel once attempted to take the Throne of the Supreme "God", but failed (another myth concerning Venus's place as the last star in the sky each morning, as if trying to defy the Sun). This is the very Myth which spawned the Christian Myth of the War in Heaven (see -ISAIAH 14: 12, which in Hebrew, says "Helel", and not "Lucifer").
SHACHAR: "Dawn". "God" of dawn. Either a son of Asherah, or of Rohmaya. According to -ISAIAH 14: 12, He is the father of Helel (who has been erroneously identified with Satan and Lucifer) the Light-Bringer and Morning Star.



Saphon, the sacred mountain of El.
Mt. Saphon, also known as Mt. Casius, is located just north of Ugarit, a Canaanite city located in northern Palestine during the 13th and 14th centuries BCE about half a mile inland near the tip of Cyprus.

Baal (also called Baal-Zephon (Saphon), Hadad, Pidar and Rapiu (Rapha?) - 'the shade')
The son of El, the god of fertility, 'rider of the clouds', and god of lightning and thunder. He is 'the Prince, the lord of earth', 'the mightiest of warriors', 'lord of the sky and the earth' (Alalakh). He has a palace on Mt. Zephon. He has a feud with Yam. His voice is thunder, his ship is a snow bearing cloud. He is known as Rapiu during his summer stay in the underworld.
Mt. Zephon
Either the mountain is deified and holy, godlike in proportion, or El has a pavilion there. It has recesses within which Baal holds his feast. Baal had his first house of cedar and brick there, as well as his second house of gold, silver, and lapis-lazuli.
YHWH AL: 'YHWH' was simply part of the Canaanite pantheon. He was a Son of 'AL' ("El"); and he was part of the court of 'AL' ("El") as cupbearer along with Baal. Later, as the National "God" of 'YSHRAL' (Israel), 'YHWH' was equated with 'AL' ("El"), and Asherah became His wife.

http://cc.usu.edu/~fath6/bible.htm

Now what are Canaanite gods Helel (Day Star) and Shahar (Dawn) doing in the Jewish Tanakh?
What is Zaphon, a mountain in syria doing in the Jewish Tanakh?

The Isaiah text 14:12 was obviously copied from the original polytheistic Canaanite religion.

The Bible is bunk.