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Was This A Fair Sentence?

 
 
smog
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:00 pm
Don1 wrote:
These are the same age "CHILDREN" that the USA tries as adults for murder when it suits them, why is it that if they commit murder at this age they are adults but if they are lucky enough to get their bone home suddenly they are helpless children?

Because in this case the children weren't the ones doing the illegal action, really. The grown woman was. That's why the kids aren't on trial. Also, I didn't say they were "helpless children", but they are indeed still children. And further, you even said it yourself, depending on a number of circumstances, children can be tried for crimes to face the same punishments as adults would, "tried as adults". This doesn't assume that they necessarily are adults; those children just get the same punishments, based on their actions, on a case-by-case basis. Anyway those are rare circumstances, especially compared to the total population. The number of children who could potentially be taken advantage of by adults is much greater (like, pretty much all children could be) and should be treated differently.

Even if those boys wanted to have sex with her, they might not have been thinking clearly because of the influence of substances. And even if, all substances aside, they just couldn't wait to do her, she still should have known better than to have sex with them. And she certainly should not have provided the substances to influence those kids.

The fact that you would even group the kids in this case in with murderers troubles me, I must say. And if you won't recognize that a child possibly being coerced into sex with an adult isn't substantially different from a child killing another person, well, then this post won't affect you at all anyway. I probably should have given you that warning ahead of time.
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smog
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:03 pm
(For the record, I don't know if I actually agree with the ruling in this case. But I know that I wouldn't want that woman anywhere near my kids, and if I found she had sex with them and however many of their friends, I would certainly want her punished as much as the law allowed. Anyway, mainly, I'm just trying to argue the opposing viewpoint here, partly for fun, and partly because some people seem to be taking her side too quickly, I think. So don't read too much into the "troubles me" comment; that was mainly part of my taking that side, I guess, and it doesn't actually trouble me all that much. But if I really, firmly believed in what I was writing, that seems like some kind of device that I would use. I dunno. Just trying stuff out.)
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Don1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:21 pm
Kenneth Bianchi one of the so called "Hillside stranglers" who with his cousin raped and murdered about a dozen women and tossed their bodies around the hills of Los Angeles didn't get this long a sentence Smog, and you think a woman that voluntarily spread her legs for a lucky 15 year old should get more prison time than Bianchi?

If you are not a judge smog you should consider a career in law you are certainly qualified.
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smog
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:32 pm
Don1 wrote:
If you are not a judge smog you should consider a career in law you are certainly qualified.

Is that supposed to be an insult? You've already made it quite clear how you feel on this topic, so I can only assume that it is.

As I said, I don't even think I agree with the sentence, but I wanted to argue the position. But whatever, I'm done here now.
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Don1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:40 pm
smog wrote:
Don1 wrote:
If you are not a judge smog you should consider a career in law you are certainly qualified.

Is that supposed to be an insult? You've already made it quite clear how you feel on this topic, so I can only assume that it is.

.


No it isn't meant to be an insult, if I were talking to you face to face you wouldn't have thought that, it is the written word that often sounds harsh when it is not meant to be, if I offended you I apologise.
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smog
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:44 pm
It's all right. I always overreact when I'm getting involved in discussions about opinions, even when the opinion I'm so vigorously defending isn't actually my own opinion, as in this thread. It's definitely a flaw and something I need to work on. You also should forgive me; I've been away from A2K for several months, so I'm just starting to get back into the whole forum way of things. But yeah, we're cool, no worries.
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Don1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:49 pm
Your handle seems to suggest that you are from my little bit of the world smog, whereabouts are you from?
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smog
 
  1  
Reply Mon 21 Nov, 2005 11:52 pm
I live in Chicago. We've got our share of smokestacks! Heh. Well, not so much anymore, actually...
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Don1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Nov, 2005 12:16 am
smog wrote:
I live in Chicago. We've got our share of smokestacks! Heh. Well, not so much anymore, actually...


You're a bit removed from our smokestacks in Lancashire then? I would have thought that being on the edge of the biggest freshwater lake on this planet you would have no problem with smog, being the windy city and all.
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smog
 
  1  
Reply Tue 22 Nov, 2005 12:40 am
I actually named myself after Bill Callahan, the musician who goes by the name Smog. Even though he wasn't born in the US, I still consider him a Chicago musician. And he apparently lived in England for part of his childhood. So I guess that's the Smog/England/Chicago connection we were looking for. Heh. Read more about him here. As for the city of Chicago, it had smoke during the days of the meat packing industry and all that, but no real smog problems. And I guess we've sufficiently moved this thread off course enough that I should probably head out for the night.
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oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 8 Dec, 2005 06:17 pm
Re: Was This A Fair Sentence?
rodeman wrote:
'Cool Mom' Gets Prison for Sex With Students
From Times Wire Reports


A woman who authorities said had sex with high school boys during alcohol- and drug-fueled parties has been sentenced in Golden to 30 years in prison, officials said.

Silvia Johnson, 41, of Arvada, described herself to investigators as a "cool mom" who "was never popular with classmates in high school" and who was beginning to feel like one of the group.

Johnson pleaded guilty to two misdemeanor counts of sexual assault and nine felony counts of contributing to the delinquency of a minor.



I don't know whether it is fair, but I agree that the sentence should be the same as a guy who did the same thing.

I recall some fuss on the news about a pretty blonde teacher getting probation for having sex with students. I think the legal argument was that she would be victimized in prison because of her beauty, and the judge bought the argument.

(I could have some of the details wrong though, as it was a week or so ago and I haven't been following it closely.)
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oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 8 Dec, 2005 06:47 pm
Re: Was This A Fair Sentence?
oralloy wrote:
I recall some fuss on the news about a pretty blonde teacher getting probation for having sex with students. I think the legal argument was that she would be victimized in prison because of her beauty, and the judge bought the argument.

(I could have some of the details wrong though, as it was a week or so ago and I haven't been following it closely.)


http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/11/22/teacher.sex


I don't think she would have been treated so leniently if she didn't look like this:

http://wizbangblog.com/images/lafave_debra_bike2-thumb.jpg
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Wilso
 
  1  
Reply Thu 8 Dec, 2005 07:48 pm
She should have got the same sentence that a man would get under the same circumstances. I've got no idea of the "normal" sentence for that sort of crime in the US.
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