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Timeline: 1 to 1500 C.E.

 
 
JPB
 
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 04:54 pm
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 1,807 • Replies: 23
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subculture of one
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 05:18 pm
Just off the top of my head, how about the Jewish revolt 66-70 ce destruction of the 2nd temple and the Jerusalem church.

64ce Nero persectutes Christians for burning Rome.

1054ce official split between Roman and Byzantine Christianity.

Maybe a small mention of the Renaissance, which pretty much paves the way for the Reformation?

Just my 2cents. Now I'm off to teach early Papacy!

Good Luck

Sub

edit- oops! just saw mention of Nero and the temple... nevermind on those! And maybe a mention of Augustine of Hippo?
Lay investiture, simony, indulgences, Cluny? Sorry, now I'm going afield...
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spendius
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 05:28 pm
Hey subbie-

I just love your user name.

Loved the other shite too.

Are you a lady.(Some hopes eh?)

You're avvies not bad as well.

Which pub do you frequent?
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JPB
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 06:03 pm
subculture_of_one wrote:


1054ce official split between Roman and Byzantine Christianity.

Maybe a small mention of the Renaissance, which pretty much paves the way for the Reformation?

...


I'll definately add these two, thanks!
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subculture of one
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 06:48 pm
Muhuhaha! Thanks for the compliment spendius (that was pretty well worded for a really evolved microbe! Shocked )

Fella, not lady (sorry)
and I was hoping that my humble input would be well received. I have a tendancy to get off-topic in my classes.

The only pubs I've frequented as of late are in the Detroit, Ann Arbor, and Kalamazoo areas.


Another note: I like to mention the 'Cadaveric Council' of 897ce- Pope Stephen VI, digs up one of his predecessors- Formosus, dresses him in his Papal robes, puts him on trial then throws his body in the Tiber!


Sub
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 07:26 pm
Since they are 8th graders, you should probably point out that there is no zero year. Thus, a person born in 10 B.C.E. would be only 19 in 10 C.E.
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Merry Andrew
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 07:27 pm
I was pretty much going to say what subculture has already said, particularly as regards 70 c.e. and the Jewish revolt against Rome. As this is the begining of the Jewish diaspora into Europe it can't be ignored.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 07:41 pm
Quote:
1500s - Protestant rebellion against Catholic doctrine, focus should be on Bible, not word of the Pope.


This misses about three centuries of significant history, and one of the biggest religious brouhahas in European history. You need to look up the Avignon Popes, the Great Schism, the Anti-Pope, the abuse of Simony (which spurred on Marin Luther and his ilk--a simple statement that the Reformation was a rebellion against Catholic doctrine is incredibly naive). Also check out Jan Hus, who was burned as a heretic more than a century before the rise of Martin Luther. Martin Luther himself is one of history great, bizarre crackpots, obsessed with scatalogical references--constantly commenting that this or that great idea came to him while in the privy, and claiming to have defeated Satan in farting battles.

Barbara Tuchmann's The March of Folly has what could be characterized as the best brief discussion of the self-destruction of the Papcy in years leading up to the Protestant Reformation. An interesting read, although dicey in many of its historical contentions, is William Manchester's A World Lit Only by Fire. Although i consider it to be in many respects a slapdash job, he concentrates on Martin Luther versus the Emperor Charles V, who was also the Spanish King Carlos, and therefore the most powerful man in his world. The antecedants of the Protestant reformation are in incredible series of monumental blunders of policy by the Popes, and the alleged "Anti-Popes" (at the height of the folly, there were three competing Popes). They sold indulgences (forgiveness for sins) in a practice known as simony, and when it reached the point that notorious and unscrupulous tax farmers were sent out to sell the indulgences, the Germans rebelled, and rallied around Luther--in fact, Luther was conducted to the Imperial Diet at which he confronted the Emperor Charles by German knights not only dedicated to protecting him from the Emperor and his agents, and those of the Pope, but also pledged to kill Luther if he recanted before the Emperor.

Check out those two books--you're missing the greatest soap opera in modern European religious history. Look up the Borgias, as well, and Francis I of France. Check out some of the early "heretical" sects such as the Albigensians and the Waldensians. Lots of intrigue, foolishness, fanaticism and depravity--a tale that can't be beat.
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ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 07:42 pm
Set up for the vatican, Constantine oks construction of basilica, 315.

http://sg.travel.yahoo.com/guide/europe/holy_see/history.html
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Merry Andrew
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 07:45 pm
Oh, yes, the Albigensians. They can't be ignored, either. Thanks for reminding me, Set.
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JPB
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 10:42 pm
Thanks! I need to sort through all this, but from the first read of Set's post I think that's what I need to cover next week. This week only brings me to the Reformation but does not cover it, which is why its a simple statement at the end. If I'm right about what you provided, Set, you've saved me a ton of work for the next lesson.

I'm just back from a long meeting so I'll dig deeper tomorrow.

Thanks again.
0 Replies
 
real life
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 Nov, 2005 11:41 pm
Re: Timeline: 1 to 1500 C.E.
J_B wrote:


Well for starters, none of the Bible translations you mention (KJV, NIV, RSV, NRSV, etc) existed in the first 15 centuries.

Also your dates for the writing of the gospels are much too late. Start with Mark around 50 or a little earlier and Matthew and Luke before 70.

Letters of Paul were considered scripture well before the death of the apostles.

Also you might mention that the earliest translations of New Testament books into languages other than the original occurred fairly early.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 01:44 am
I miss a bit nearly all of how Europe became Christian - Irish mssionaries, for instance, Charlemagne etc.

I might have overlooked it, but the Waldenses, Anabaptists, Hus should be mentioned, too, as 'early reformists'.
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 02:15 am
I've always enjoyed reading of the Defenestration of Prague. http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Sparta/5414/DefPrague.htm

A fitting disposition for a clergyman of any faith. There are stories which aver the ditch to have been full of manure. Too good to be true, I guess.

Actually, there have been as many as three defenestrations. But I favor the one in 1618, which marked the beginning of the Thirty Years War.
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subculture of one
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 08:27 am
Y'know... This is great! History is _such_ a mine field! There are SOOOOOO many things that could be dealt with... though I guess I didn't realize that they were 8th graders.... I would cut over half of the stuff out then Razz .

I teach at a 'higher' ed level and I have to cut stuff out to keep the amount of glazed staring down to a minimun. History is important... But we (me) tend to get a little carried away when we try to convey it to others.

This is why my wife asks me for '5 cent' versions of history if we are watching a movie or tv show that assumes in-depth historical knowledge... Confused

In any event... You may want to use C.A.Ts after you teach them this stuff and ask them what they felt the important topics were.

Sub
0 Replies
 
subculture of one
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 08:28 am
Y'know... This is great! History is _such_ a mine field! There are SOOOOOO many things that could be dealt with... though I guess I didn't realize that they were 8th graders.... I would cut over half of the stuff out then Razz .

I teach at a 'higher' ed level and I have to cut stuff out to keep the amount of glazed staring down to a minimun. History is important... But we (me) tend to get a little carried away when we try to convey it to others.

This is why my wife asks me for '5 cent' versions of history if we are watching a movie or tv show that assumes in-depth historical knowledge... Confused

In any event... You may want to use C.A.Ts after you teach them this stuff and ask them what they felt the important topics were.

Sub
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 12:03 pm
Right, 13 and 14 year olds. They will probably pick the 'no year zero' as the high point Smile

The way I'm going to present this is to have a picture of a large tree with Judaism as the trunk, the first branching occurs at year 1 with Judaism on one major branch (eventually branching into Conservative, Orthodox, and Reform) and early Christianity on the other which branches off into Eastern Orthodox at ~ 1000 C.E. and the main branch branching further into the various Protestant groups beginning with the Reformation and branching upward from there (Lutherans, Anglican/Episcopal, Calvanists and branches, Puritans and branches, etc). We also have a side limb for Islam even though it isn't truly a branching off of either Judaism or Christianity. There is also a large timeline along two walls where we'll plug in the events that I'll be highlighting from what I have here.


Also, I only have 15 - 20 minutes to cover this so the oral part will be the 'big' events. I'm definitely going to add the Jewish revolt leading up to the destruction of the second temple and although I have a number of sources for the dates of the early gospels, I'll explain that scholars differ as to the exact age and they might have been earlier. I also want to add more about Christianity spreading throughout Europe and a mention of the beginning of the construction of the basilica. I'll also add the Great Schism, the Popes of Avignon and the Anti-Pope(s).

I think I'll give them a handout for the timeline, but we all know what happens with handouts when there's no quiz :wink:

Good points about the early translations and versions of the bible coming later, real life.


Set, I'll definitely check out those books. Its too much info for the kids, but I'm fascinated by this stuff so I'll read them for myself.

I appreciate all the feedback and I'm taking notes for the Reformation and beyond for next week. Keep the ideas coming, it really is fascinating.
0 Replies
 
dagmaraka
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 12:14 pm
might be better to focus on fewer things in more depth- i mean, for 13 year olds. if you're going to spill all of those years and events on their heads, they will drown in them.

defenestration of prague indeed is cool. as is the hussite movement, that preceded Martin Luther by 100 years or more and burning of John Huss (or Jan Hus) at stake, despite pledges of immunity by Sigismund of Luxemberg.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 12:29 pm
We were 12 or 13, when heard for the first time of the Prague defenstration in history at school: you bet, it was "replayed" frequently :wink:
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JPB
 
  1  
Reply Thu 10 Nov, 2005 12:45 pm
Is this thread showing up still? I can only get to it by clicking on my name from another post.
0 Replies
 
 

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