Saddam is gone – what about the god of the Bible???

Frank - justing wondering how you feel oppressed if you do not believe? I don't feel and have never felt oppressed - by God.

Frank Apisa- I hear where you are coming from, but IMO, you are comparing apples with oranges. The Iraqi people had no choice- they were under the yoke of Saddam, and could not get away if they wanted.

People can choose whether or not to believe in a God.

I don't feel and have never felt oppressed - by God.
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Me, neither!

I've never heard Christianity from that view.

I have heard Catholicism described that way (by recovering Catholics). IMO, the people who teach this type of fear about God are horrid!

It depends who is defining the God of the Bible, and how they do it. BTW, New Testament or Old Testament?

Thank you to everyone who has responded so far.

*****

Husker

You wrote:

"Frank - justing wondering how you feel oppressed if you do not believe? I don't feel and have never felt oppressed - by God."

RESPONSE: Where did you get the idea that I feel oppressed by this god?


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Phoenix

You wrote:

"People can choose whether or not to believe in a God."

RESPONSE: But the ones who do "believe" in this god -- often people who had little real choice since the "belief" was drummed into them from early childhood -- are often people who are convinced they will only gain "salvation" if they toe the line. I don't think it is apples and oranges at all. We can discuss this further if you want.

*****

Sofia

You wrote:

"I don't feel and have never felt oppressed - by God.
______________________
Me, neither!

I've never heard Christianity from that view.

I have heard Catholicism described that way (by recovering Catholics). IMO, the people who teach this type of fear about God are horrid!"

COMMENT:

Well, millions upon millions of people do -- and billions have over the years.

As a point of interest, what do you see as the punishment, if any, for people who do not obey the laws of your god? Or is your opinion that it does it not matter what you do here on Earth?

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VioletLake

You wrote: "It depends who is defining the God of the Bible, and how they do it. BTW, New Testament or Old Testament?":

COMMENT: Are there two different gods in the Bible???

I feel fortunate in that I was never pressured by my parents to accept or reject God. They taught me nothing regarding spirituality. It was a long interesting road that led me to my atheistic stand of today. I hope you all can be as content with your beliefs as I am.

Frank, the god of the Old Testament is very different from the god of the New Testament.

Anyway, the key to your assertion depends on who is interpreting the Bible. As you know it can be interpreted in many different ways, some more liberal & rational than others.

Frank--
For a point of reference to you, I'm a Christian.
I believe very strongly that it is not my place to consider the judgement of others' souls, or their relationship to God.

I do believe that I will account to Jesus Christ for the decisions and choices I have made. This is enough for me to consider, without worrying about anyone else. I trust Him as a worthy judge.

edgar, my experience was similar, although I'm still not sure if I believe in god or not, and not sure what god is for that matter. Back to interpretations of ancient books...

The transition from the way that I was raised to my religious views now, developed over a 10 year period from age 14-24. All along the way, I made conscious choices, and modified my views as I matured.

Frank
Were you not the author of what you have written? These things you said were just...?? opinions? beliefs..?? feelings..?? or just conjecture to start a discussion? So if you are asking me "Where did you get the idea that I feel oppressed by this god" It's none of the above right?

Are there a great many Christians (don't include Catholics) expression feelings of oppression? Or is that your opinion? :wink:


ps
do you always answer questions with questions

Yes, I was the author.




I spoke of the feelings of the people "sucking up to the god of the Bible." I am not one of them -- so obviously I am not one of the people who feel threatened or oppressed by the god -- which is why I asked: "Where did you get the idea that I feel oppressed by this god? "

BTW, I do not always answer questions with questions -- as you can easily see from this posting.



Most Christians, including Catholics, do not express feelings of oppression. I understand and acknowldge that.

Most Iraqis did not express feelings of oppression under Saddam Hussein either!

The Iraqis were too terrified to do so -- although now that they are out of the clutches of that monster, I suspect you will hear all sorts of talk about how they felt oppressed -- and how they were terrified to speak up.

That is the point of my posting, Husker.

If we could get the monster god of the Bible off the necks of the people, I suspect you would find many of them feeling relief; expressing elation; and acknowledging that they felt oppressed back when the god was making his list and checking it twice.

Whatta ya think?

Oops, another question! :wink:

A worthy task, Frank; getting 'the God of the Bible off the necks of the people'. Since He is not there in the first place, freeing them from this preposterous thought will be easy.

I will help you.

I think it's up to the person to make their own reality.

Frank, it sounds like you have some unresolved issues concerning religion. Are you atheist? Disgruntled Catholic? What interpretation of the Bible are we talking about?

BTW, you know what people say about Jewish mothers & Italian mothers? What are atheist mothers like?

I'm an agnostic -- and have been since about age 25. I'm 66 now.

I have no unresolved issues -- really!



I have a library of 15 different Bibles -- Jewish, Protestant, and Catholic.

I'm not trying to be nasty here, but I have studied them all fairly carefully over the years -- and I can tell you that the god described in them is one of the most vicious, vengeful, murderous, barbaric monsters ever concocted.

If you see the god of the Bible in any other light -- it might be that you are in denial about what the Bible says about its god. Or, you may simply choose to disregard what the Bible says about the god -- and just make up a god as you go along.

But if you or anyone else thinks that the god is not a fear provoking god -- you are kidding yourselves. The god is more terrifying that Saddam could ever hope to have been.

IMHO, the god of the New Testament isn't a fear provoking god.

What about the god of the New testament do you see as vicious, vengeful, murderous, & barbaric? Please enlighten me.

I'll accept your help, Sofia.

Tell you what! Let's try an experiment.

My guess is that no Iraqi back when Saddam was in power would ever stand up to him and tell him that something he did was barbaric and absolutely wrong.

Since you think your god is not as bad as Saddam, suppose we give you a chance to speak to your god and tell him that something he did was wrong.

Let's see...what shall we choose.

Okay -- here is something.

In Exodus, the god of the Bible had Moses and Aaron go into Egypt and confront Pharaoh about the Hebrews Pharaoh held in slavery. The god told Moses that he was going to inflict several plagues on Egypt in order to get Pharaoh to release the Hebrews -- but the god also told Moses that he was going to "harden" Pharaohs heart, so that Pharaoh would not comply immediately. The god told Moses he wanted to show Pharaoh how powerful he (the god) was.

So the god caused incredible suffering among the commoners of Egypt in order to show-off for Pharaoh -- and he made sure that Pharaoh would not relent -- by hardening the King's heart. And then finally, the god did what he came to do in the first place.

But before getting to that -- let me point out that the god, just a few pages earlier in the Bible, created the universe. He created our planet, our sun, the other 250 billions suns in our galaxy and the hundreds of billions of other galaxies that we presently know about -- and he scattered them over an area so vast (which he also created) that light takes billions of years to traverse.

So the god could just as easily gotten the Hebrews out of Egypt by picking them up and carrying them out. Or, he could have given Pharaoh the most excruciating ear ache anyone ever had -- and told him the earache would not relent for one second until every last Hebrew was freed from captivity.

But instead, what the god did -- and what he planned to do all along -- was to slaughter all the first-born tiny innocent infants of Egypt. Every last one of them! And the first born calves, foals, and other animals of the country. Murdered a bunch of babies and new born animals.

I think that sucks.

Don't you?

Since you are not afraid of your god, Sofia, why not tell him how much that sucks. Tell him only a barbarian would do something like that. Tell him it was murderous and disgusting. Really give him lots of noise about it.

Why not do that right here in A2K so we can listen in.

Then we will give all these other people who say their god is not terrifying a chance to follow up your lead.

That's Old Testament, Frank. What about the New Testament?

Apparently I posted my comments at the same time you were posting yours.

Violet -- you seem to think the Bible has two gods in it.

It doen't -- and if you think there are two, you are wrong.

Jesus specifically endorsed everything in the Old Testament.

Matthew 5:17

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the law...Of this much I assure you: until heaven and earth pass away, not the smalles letter of the law, not the smallest part of a letter shall be done away with..."

And when Jesus speaks of his Father who is in Heaven -- and whe Jesus says My Father and I are one -- just what dol you think he is saying, Violet?

If I say something about the god of the Bible -- I am speaking of the god of the Bible -- the god of the Old Testament and the god of the New Testament.

And I think I've already told you what I think about that god.

But since you insist that there is nothing to fear from the god of the Bible -- why not take me up on what I wrote to Sofia.

Tell your god that he was murderous and a barbarian when he slaughtered all those children.