0
   

Rove was the source of the Plame leak... so it appears

 
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 08:16 am
Novak from 2003

Quote:
http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/09/29/novak.cia/

...Novak said Monday that he was working on the column when a senior administration official told him the CIA asked Wilson to go to Niger in early 2002 at the suggestion of his wife, whom the source described as "a CIA employee working on weapons of mass destruction."

Another senior administration official gave him the same information, Novak said, and the CIA confirmed her involvement in her husband's mission.


In his column, Novak attributed the information about Plame's involvement in Wilson's trip to Africa to two unnamed senior administration officials.

"They asked me not to use her name, but never indicated it would endanger her or anybody else. According to a confidential source at the CIA, Mrs. Wilson was an analyst, not a spy, not a covert operative and not in charge of undercover operators," Novak said.

The Washington Post quoted a "senior administration official" in a story Sunday as saying that two top White House officials disclosed the identity of Wilson's wife in calls to at least six Washington journalists. Novak was the only recipient of the information who published it, the Post reported....


It would seem that the stories do not, in fact, match.

Don't take Luskin and Rove's carefully timed press release as gospel, lash, you'll regret it, lol

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 08:18 am
Lash wrote:
$1000 donation makes her loyalties clear. As it did with Dan Rather and several other "unbiased" reporters.

.


No record of Dan Rather ever giving money to any party on FEC.gov

Joseph Wilson however gave $1000 to Bush for election on 5/20/1999

I guess that proves Wilson's loyalties since he gave $1000 to Bush.

Quote:
WILSON, JOSEPH C IV
WASHINGTON, DC 20007
JCWILSON INTERNATIONAL VENTURE

BUSH, GEORGE W
VIA BUSH FOR PRESIDENT INC.
05/20/1999 1000.00 99034574225
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 08:19 am
Nah. They're saying the same thing.

You just keep trying to make it say something different.

Stop the madness!!!


<hee hee>
0 Replies
 
Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 08:33 am
Lash, how do you prefer your crow, sauteed, baked or fried? LOL
0 Replies
 
goodfielder
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 08:35 am
Newsflash! It's official! White House declares truth IS relative!
0 Replies
 
pngirouard
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 08:52 am
That Wilson might be partisan in the eyes of some makes sense. After all, his family was attacked and both his career and that of his wife were put in jeopardy. But what about quintessential partisan Rove? Wilson makes no secrets about his contempt for an administration that tried to destroyed him. And Rove appears more and more the one who was the pivotal figure in trying to discredit Wilson. Yet Rove and his Boss were proven wrong when they still went ahead in still alledging that Iraq had nuclear ties to Niger which we all know to be an utter lie given both the report of Wilson and subsequent findings.

Yet he served well under Bush's father and his service record was exemplary according to Bush senior. In 1991 he contributed to both presidential campaign. After all from 1988 to 1991, he was the Deputy Chief of Mission at the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad, Iraq. And during 'Desert Shield' he was the acting Ambassador and was responsible for the freeing of several hundred American hostages. Lets not forget that he replaced the discredited ambassador of the time, April Glaspie, who left somewhat under a cloud of incompetence.

Rove's only claim to fame is to be Bush's election architect and a ruthless political operative whose mo is character assassination at all costs. He's the executioner.

People attacking Wilson's partisanship should look in their own backyard. Rove's motivation in this case was never about the higher ground but about gutter politics and character assassination. Wilson told the facts as they were. It displeased the administration. They decided to take him down and his wife. End of story. Whether he acted in a criminal fashion, we will only later. But he acted inappropriately and showed the current administration for what it is: more interested in its power grab than in the interest of America. That's how dictatorships act all around the world.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:01 am
http://writ.news.findlaw.com/dean/20050715.html

Earlier in the thread I have made mention several times to the fact that Rove and others could be facing serious problems from the Espionage angle.

Now we see a little more about how that could unfold.

Quote:
It Appears That Karl Rove Is In Serious Trouble
By JOHN W. DEAN
----
Friday, Jul. 15, 2005

As the scandal over the leak of CIA agent Valerie Plame's identity has continued to unfold, there is a renewed focused on Karl Rove -- the White House Deputy Chief of Staff whom President Bush calls his political "architect."




Newsweek has reported that Matt Cooper, in an email to his bureau chief at Time magazine, wrote that he had spoken "to Rove on double super secret background for about two min[ute]s before he went on vacation ..." In that conversation, Rove gave Cooper "big warning" that Time should not "get too far out on Wilson." Rove was referring, of course, to former Ambassador Joe Wilson's acknowledgment of his trip to Africa, where he discovered that Niger had not, in fact, provided uranium to Iraq that might be part of a weapons of mass destruction (WMD) program. Cooper's email indicates that Rove told Cooper that Wilson's trip had not been authorized by CIA Director George Tenet or Vice President Dick Cheney; rather, Rove claimed, "it was … [W]ilson's wife, who apparently works at the agency on [WMD] issues who authorized the trip." (Rove was wrong about the authorization.)

Only the Special Counsel, Patrick Fitzgerald, and his staff have all the facts on their investigation at this point, but there is increasing evidence that Rove (and others) may have violated one or more federal laws. At this time, it would be speculation to predict whether indictments will be forthcoming.

No Apparent Violation Of The Identities Protection Act

As I pointed out when the Valerie Plame Wilson leak first surfaced, the Intelligence Identities And Protection Act is a complex law. For the law to apply to Rove, a number of requirements must be met.

Rove must have had "authorized access to classified information" under the statute. Plame was an NCO (non-covered officer). White House aides, and even the president, are seldom, if ever, given this information. So it is not likely Rove had "authorized access" to it.

In addition, Rove must have "intentionally" -- not "knowingly" as has been mentioned in the news coverage -- disclosed "any information identifying such a covert agent." Whether or not Rove actually referred to Mrs. Wilson as "Valerie Plame," then, the key would be whether he gave Matt Cooper (or others) information that Joe Wilson's wife was a covert agent. Also, the statute requires that Rove had to know,a as a fact, that the United States was taking, or had taken, "affirmative measures to conceal" Valerie Plame's covert status. Rove's lawyer says he had no such knowledge.

In fact, there is no public evidence that Valerie Wilson had the covert status required by the statute. A covert agent, as defined under this law, is "a present or retired officer or employee" of the CIA, whose identity as such "is classified information," and this person must be serving outside of the United States, or have done so in the last five years.

There is no solid information that Rove, or anyone else, violated this law designed to protect covert CIA agents. There is, however, evidence suggesting that other laws were violated. In particular, I have in mind the laws invoked by the Bush Justice Department in the relatively minor leak case that it vigorously prosecuted, though it involved information that was not nearly as sensitive as that which Rove provided Matt Cooper (and possibly others).

The Jonathan Randel Leak Prosecution Precedent

I am referring to the prosecution and conviction of Jonathan Randel. Randel was a Drug Enforcement Agency analyst, a PhD in history, working in the Atlanta office of the DEA. Randel was convinced that British Lord Michael Ashcroft (a major contributor to Britain's Conservative Party, as well as American conservative causes) was being ignored by DEA, and its investigation of money laundering. (Lord Ashcroft is based in South Florida and the off-shore tax haven of Belize.)

Randel leaked the fact that Lord Ashcroft's name was in the DEA files, and this fact soon surfaced in the London news media. Ashcroft sued, and learned the source of the information was Randel. Using his clout, soon Ashcroft had the U.S. Attorney in pursuit of Randel for his leak.

By late February 2002, the Department of Justice indicted Randel for his leaking of Lord Ashcroft's name. It was an eighteen count "kitchen sink" indictment; they threw everything they could think of at Randel. Most relevant for Karl Rove's situation, Court One of Randel's indictment alleged a violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 641. This is a law that prohibits theft (or conversion for one's own use) of government records and information for non-governmental purposes. But its broad language covers leaks, and it has now been used to cover just such actions.

Randel, faced with a life sentence (actually, 500 years) if convicted on all counts, on the advice of his attorney, pleaded guilty to violating Section 641. On January 9, 2003, Randel was sentenced to a year in a federal prison, followed by three years probation. This sentence prompted the U.S. Attorney to boast that the conviction of Randel made a good example of how the Bush Administration would handle leakers.

The Randel Precedent -- If Followed -- Bodes Ill For Rove

Karl Rove may be able to claim that he did not know he was leaking "classified information" about a "covert agent," but there can be no question he understood that what he was leaking was "sensitive information." The very fact that Matt Cooper called it "double super secret background" information suggests Rove knew of its sensitivity, if he did not know it was classified information (which by definition is sensitive).

United States District Court Judge Richard Story's statement to Jonathan Randel, at the time of sentencing, might have an unpleasant ring for Karl Rove. Judge Story told Randel that he surely must have appreciated the risks in leaking DEA information. "Anything that would affect the security of officers and of the operations of the agency would be of tremendous concern, I think, to any law-abiding citizen in this country," the judge observed. Judge Story concluded this leak of sensitive information was "a very serious crime."

"In my view," he explained, "it is a very serious offense because of the risk that comes with it, and part of that risk is because of the position" that Randel held in DEA. But the risk posed by the information Rove leaked is multiplied many times over; it occurred at a time when the nation was considering going to war over weapons of mass destruction. And Rove was risking the identity of, in attempting to discredit, a WMD proliferation expert, Valerie Plame Wilson.

Judge Story acknowledged that Randel's leak did not appear to put lives at risk, nor to jeopardize any DEA investigations. But he also pointed out that Randel "could not have completely and fully known that in the position that [he] held." Is not the same true of Rove? Rove had no idea what the specific consequences of giving a reporter the name of a CIA agent (about whom he says he knew nothing) would be--he only knew that he wanted to discredit her (incorrectly) for dispatching her husband to determine if the rumors about Niger uranium were true or false.

Given the nature of Valerie Plame Wilson's work, it is unlikely the public will ever know if Rove's leak caused damage, or even loss of life of one of her contracts abroad, because of Rove's actions. Dose anyone know the dangers and risks that she and her family may face because of this leak?

It was just such a risk that convinced Judge Story that "for any person with the agency to take it upon himself to leak information poses a tremendous risk; and that's what, to me, makes this a particularly serious offense." Cannot the same be said that Rove's leak? It dealt with matters related to national security; if the risk Randel was taking was a "tremendous" risk, surely Rove's leak was monumental.

While there are other potential violations of the law that may be involved with the Valerie Plame Wilson case, it would be speculation to consider them. But Karl Rove's leak to Matt Cooper is now an established fact. First, there is Matt Cooper's email record. And Cooper has now confirmed that he has told the grand jury he spoke with Rove. If Rove's leak fails to fall under the statute that was used to prosecute Randel, I do not understand why.

There are stories circulating that Rove may have been told of Valerie Plame's CIA activity by a journalist, such as Judith Miller, as recently suggested in Editor & Publisher. If so, that doesn't exonerate Rove. Rather, it could make for some interesting pairing under the federal conspiracy statute (which was the statute most commonly employed during Watergate).


Cheers

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Brand X
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:01 am
Quote:
Lawyer: Identity act may not apply in CIA leak case

Thursday, July 14, 2005; Posted: 5:27 p.m. EDT (21:27 GMT)

story.sanford.cnn.jpg
Attorney Bruce Sanford



(CNN) -- The 1982 Intelligence Identities Protection Act is the federal statute that apparently is at the heart of the investigation by a special prosecutor into who in the government leaked the identity of a covert CIA operative to a newspaper columnist two years ago.

The law makes it a crime to knowingly disclose the identity of an agent and specifies penalties of a fine amounting to as much as $25,000 or up to five years in prison, or both.

CNN anchor Kyra Phillips talked Thursday with Bruce Sanford, a Washington-based First Amendment attorney who helped draft the law.

PHILLIPS: Bruce, tell me your intent when you helped to draft this.

SANFORD: Well, we were representing a big cross-section of press groups trying to narrow the act, because whenever Congress gets in the business of making it a crime to make a disclosure, essentially making it a crime to convey speech, you're really talking about a law that infringes on the First Amendment field of free expression.

So we were trying to do everything we could to narrow the law. And, indeed, it is so narrow it's only been used once in its 23-year history, and that was with one of our embassy officials in Ghana in a prosecution where she pleaded guilty to telling her boyfriend who the local CIA agent was.

The truth of the matter is that this was a law passed in 1982 to stop Philip Agee from outing our covert agents during the Cold War abroad. And it really is not intended, never was intended [to be applied to matters] of public policy or national policy or whether we should be going to war with Iraq.

PHILLIPS: Well, aside from maybe partisan politics, looking strictly at the law that you drafted, do you see any evidence, according to this law, any evidence of any criminal wrongdoing?

SANFORD: No, I think it's pretty clear that what Karl Rove said to Time magazine's Matthew Cooper doesn't even come close to the kind of knowing violation that is required by the act. Really, the act really requires an intent to harm national security, and that certainly can't be said in these circumstances, I think.

PHILLIPS: All right. Now, we've heard a lot about the act, but let's look at it, actually read this portion of Section 421 of the act:

"... knowing that the information disclosed so identifies such covert agent, and that the United States is taking affirmative measures to conceal such covert agent's intelligence relationship to the United States ..."

So in other words, what you're saying, the reason there is no evidence of criminal wrongdoing is because Karl Rove didn't do anything wrong because he didn't know that Plame was covert.

SANFORD: That's pretty clear from the notes, the e-mails that Time magazine released to the grand jury that [White House political adviser] Karl Rove said that [former Ambassador Joseph] Wilson's wife -- he didn't even use her name -- but Wilson's wife "apparently works" at the CIA.

It seems to me there's a substantial question whether she qualifies as the kind of covert agent that was envisioned by the act. There are very tight requirements for that.

And there is a substantial doubt whether the agency was taking the kind of affirmative measures to conceal her identity that the act talks about.


PHILLIPS: So, Bruce, how would you define a covert agent?

SANFORD: I think a covert agent under the act has to be someone who has deep cover, who is working abroad. Not just traveling abroad, but is stationed and working abroad sometime within the last five years.

And USA Today reported that Joe Wilson's book has even made -- if you do the timeline, the Wilsons were married in 1998. There's some question whether she was even abroad during the last five years.

She really had a desk job at [CIA headquarters in] Langley [Virginia] and was driving in and out of the CIA every day. That's not exactly deep cover.

PHILLIPS: Well, do you think that is the area that needs to be flushed out in a little more detail? Because obviously there is a criminal investigation going on. Somebody thinks that somebody did something wrong. Is it going to come down to defining her job, detail by detail?

SANFORD: Well, I think we'll have to -- Pat Fitzgerald, the prosecutor, will obviously have to see whether this act applies.

But if it isn't this act that serves as the basis for an investigation, he could always rely on perjury or obstruction of justice, the sort of lying to investigators that prosecutors have used time and time again in recent years.

PHILLIPS: Well, breaking the law or partisan politics, do you think Valerie Plame [Wilson's wife] is now damaged goods?

SANFORD: Well, ... it is worth remembering that when Robert Novak, the columnist, disclosed her identity in his column, he had called the CIA to tell them he was going to do that, and they didn't stop him.
They did not do what the CIA normally does in that situation if they want to protect or continue to protect somebody's identity. ...

They didn't call his syndicate. They didn't scream at him, say you're going to endanger her life or [en]danger her career, that sort of thing. They just sort of shrugged and said, "Well, I guess she won't be getting any more overseas assignments."

I don't think that's the kind of affirmative measures that the agency needs to be taking in order to invoke the statute.


CNN
0 Replies
 
Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:03 am
The Perjury and Obstruction of Justice laws are still in effect, I presume. LOL
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:03 am
pngirouard
pngirouard, welcome to A2K. Glad to have someone so smart join us.

Some day, historians will record the administration of George W. Bush as one of the most corrupt in US history. In fact, the entire Bush-Walker families have a long, well-documented history of corrumption. The old saying that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree is true. Bush is rotten to the (apple) core. If one wants to learn about the family corruption, all they have to do is read their history before and during WWII that starts with their collaboration with the Nazis. I don't know which is worse, the Bush and Walkers families.

BBB
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:07 am
Quote:
but is stationed and working abroad sometime within the last five years.


From what I've read, the "stationed" part is an overstatement -- if she took a single official trip, that could be enough.
0 Replies
 
Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:07 am
Judge Tatel, in allowing the jailing of Miller, has said that there is compelling evidence that a serious crime comprising national security has been committed. The White House can asend out every spinmeister they can find to obfuscate the matter. It ain't gonna mean a thing once the indictsments come down. All they are hoping to do at this point is avoid a Congressional inquiry.
0 Replies
 
Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:11 am
sozobe wrote:
Quote:
but is stationed and working abroad sometime within the last five years.


From what I've read, the "stationed" part is an overstatement -- if she took a single official trip, that could be enough.


This "not a covert agent" canard has about run its course. Anyone with a lick of common sense knows Fitzgerald has determined she is. If no serious crime has been committed, why has he investigated this going on two years and why is Miller in jail?
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:12 am
Interesting article by Dean re: Randel, Cycloptichorn, thanks for posting it.
0 Replies
 
Brand X
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:14 am
Chrissee wrote:
sozobe wrote:
Quote:
but is stationed and working abroad sometime within the last five years.


From what I've read, the "stationed" part is an overstatement -- if she took a single official trip, that could be enough.


This "not a covert agent" canard has about run its course. Anyone with a lick of common sense knows Fitzgerald has determined she is. If no serious crime has been committed, why has he investigated this going on two years and why is Miller in jail?


The again if she was covert why did the CIA approve Novak to use the name?
0 Replies
 
Chrissee
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:19 am
She was a covert agent and the "CIA" did not authorize Novak to out her. That is the height of absurdity.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:23 am
Lash, the senate report which documents doubts about the Iraq Niger uranium deal within the intellegence community before the President spoke of it in his speech. It's 48 pages long but to get the full picture it is worth the read.

http://news.findlaw.com/legalnews/lit/iraq/documents.html
http://news.findlaw.com/hdocs/docs/iraq/sic70904iraqrpt-2.pdf
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:23 am
Brand X wrote:
Chrissee wrote:
sozobe wrote:
Quote:
but is stationed and working abroad sometime within the last five years.


From what I've read, the "stationed" part is an overstatement -- if she took a single official trip, that could be enough.


This "not a covert agent" canard has about run its course. Anyone with a lick of common sense knows Fitzgerald has determined she is. If no serious crime has been committed, why has he investigated this going on two years and why is Miller in jail?


The again if she was covert why did the CIA approve Novak to use the name?


The CIA approved Novak's use of her name? WTF?
You people will say ANYTHING.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:26 am
"Approve", BrandX? According to Novak, they made a "very weak request" that he not name Plame publicly. So even Novak doesn't go so far as "approve." Meanwhile, the CIA itself says it has " disputed Novak's claim and indicated that he was told revealing the information could cost agents their lives."

http://www.able2know.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1449950#1449950
0 Replies
 
pngirouard
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2005 09:28 am
Hello BBB.

Thanks for the kind comment.

The basic Republican party line is: discredit Wilson, discredit Plame as an undercover agent (after all she can't comment on that as a result of her employment) and affirm at every turn that Rove is a good man. Also make sure to say as so many pundits have said that this is an August food throwing event that bears little importance (i.e. it will go away as all august story do).

The problem with such a strategy is that in no way does it address Bush's firm commitment to fire anyone who had anything to do with the leak. Bush is in a quagmire. Rove was involved in the leak. That's his own admission. Bush now hides behind the legalities. What he basically shows are too things:

· His loyalty to a fault
· His inability and weakness to deliver in time of crisis.

And to think that some think he is a tough leader. He might be an agile one. But he remains weak. Cemeteries are full of indispensable people. Rove can go. One can't imagine there aren't others who could fill his shoes on the same day. Or is it that the Republicans are devoid of people of talent?
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Karl Rove E-mails - Discussion by Diest TKO
Rove: McCain went 'too far' in ads - Discussion by Robert Gentel
Sheryl Crow Battles Karl Rove at D.C. Press Dinner - Discussion by BumbleBeeBoogie
Texas attorney fired for Rove article comments - Discussion by BumbleBeeBoogie
 
Copyright © 2025 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.05 seconds on 03/19/2025 at 02:19:04