Where is the US economy headed?

@okie,

okie wrote:

Back on the subject, here is an article in regard to a report about the rampant waste in government. Not that most of us don't already know this by simple observation and common sense, but anyway here it is:

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/03/01/government-waste-numbers-report-identifies-dozens-duplicative-programs/

""This report confirms what most Americans assume about their government. We are spending trillions of dollars every year and nobody knows what we are doing. The executive branch doesn't know."

Yaknow the funny thing? This is one of the things Obama specifically identified in his State of the Union as a way we could save money: by looking into and cutting duplicate programs. The right-wing made fun of him for it at the time and called it an 'unserious' way to cut spending.

When are you going to give the guy some credit, Okie?

Cycloptichorn

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@okie,

okie, You'll never understand any issue, because your brain is settled on "no" taxes. Our citizens already pay one of the lowest tax rates of all developed countries, and during this Great Recession, many public services that we enjoyed before have disappeared from our landscape, and many are disappearing as we speak.

Your destructive opinions about our country only enforces your ignorance and inability to understand politics or economics.

It's no longer about "spending," so much as political positioning. We're already denying our children a good education with larger class size and taking away their health care. What more do you want to destroy besides our infrastructure?

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@okie,

Quote:

I just posted a report that was put out by your own government, cyclops, that confirms the existence of rampant waste in government.

Ah yes.. a report that no way supports the quote FOX used in it's story about the report.

The report doesn't say the government doesn't know where the trillions are going. Of course we could be losing trillions because the ATF and FBI both have groups for explosive investigations, but I doubt it and the report doesn't say that.

The report only focuses on duplicate services by different government agencies. Some duplication is probably necessary and could save money. Some of it may waste money but it doesn't add up to trillions and may not even be billions.

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@Cycloptichorn,

There is no doubt there is waste with the war efforts and contractors, cyclops. I am also convinced that we cannot blame the inefficiency on one party, it is both parties and the problem is systemic throughout the entire government.

Look, if I was in office, I would be willing to look at certain increases in marginal tax rates on very high incomes, but it would have to be accompanied by significant cuts in spending, cuts of bureaucracies, etc. This has to be a comprehensive program accross the board, and I repeat that the primary emphasis has to be on cutting spending first, not increasing taxation. I would say again also that I would support higher marginal tax rates on individuals if income taxes were eliminated on corporations and businesses. At least I would have to see significant reductions in taxing of corporations and businesses.

The foundation beneath my policies as stated above is the fact that we must get our manufacturing and productivity up here in this country.

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

There is no doubt there is waste with the war efforts and contractors, cyclops. I am also convinced that we cannot blame the inefficiency on one party, it is both parties and the problem is systemic throughout the entire government.

Look, if I was in office, I would be willing to look at certain increases in marginal tax rates on very high incomes, but it would have to be accompanied by significant cuts in spending, cuts of bureaucracies, etc. This has to be a comprehensive program accross the board, and I repeat that the primary emphasis has to be on cutting spending first, not increasing taxation.

Why? It's easier to cut spending than it is to raise taxes!!! Why not raise the taxes first?

I think that this is a convenient excuse for your side to get behind NEVER raising taxes. The Dems will NEVER cut spending enough for you to say 'okay, we can raise taxes now.' Right? I mean, how much would they have to cut, for you to think that the time is right for taxes to go up?

Quote:

I would say again also that I would support higher marginal tax rates on individuals if income taxes were eliminated on corporations and businesses. At least I would have to see significant reductions in taxing of corporations and businesses.

Why? Most of the big ones pay no or very little taxes anyway. Why must cutting taxes be a condition of you supporting RAISING taxes? It makes no sense at all!

Quote:

The foundation beneath my policies as stated above is the fact that we must get our manufacturing and productivity up here in this country.

There are a lot of ways to do that other than slashing corp. taxes.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Why? It's easier to cut spending than it is to raise taxes!!! Why not raise the taxes first?Cycloptichorn

Because the economy is lousy. Raising taxes will dampen further the economy's ability to recover.

Just my opinion, but one that many politicians and economists share. After all, isn't that why Obama extended the taxcuts?

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:
Why? It's easier to cut spending than it is to raise taxes!!! Why not raise the taxes first?Cycloptichorn

Because the economy is lousy. Raising taxes will dampen further the economy's ability to recover.

So will cutting spending. Economists have blasted Boehner and the House Republican plan as one which will cost hundreds of thousands of jobs and knock serious points off of our GDP. Yet, you're all for it.

Why are you for things that will hurt the economy in a recession on one hand, but not for other things?

Quote:

Just my opinion, but one that many politicians and economists share. After all, isn't that why Obama extended the taxcuts?

He was forced to do so by the Republicans in Congress. He didn't want to, and argued vociferously against it. You may recall that the Republicans held any number of bills, including the START treaty, hostage to cutting taxes for the rich. It was pathetic, but Obama didn't have much of a choice - and it worked out well for him.

Cycloptichorn

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@okie,

Listen, I grew up poor. Because of my good grades, my membership in the National Honor Society and my high scores on the SATs and competitive tests, I was awarded several college scholarships.

But, they only paid tuition. So I worked. I had one of the early work study grants and worked for the chemistry department of my college. Then I worked at a museum as a tour guide for several years and at the post office during Christmas rush.

I went to grad school at a state university and worked part-time while attending school full-time for the first year. During that period, I took civil service tests and looked for work. The next year, I worked as a welfare case worker and went to night school. I took part of a year off from work to student teach. The following year, I taught and went to night school. Because I found teaching confining, I looked for and found work in journalism, earning $8,000/annum or the same as a teacher would earn or slightly less than a new attorney would earn. I continued taking night classes and finished my degree. Every professor I had asked me to tutor in writing.

I later earned a second master's at an Ivy League school where I again tutored in writing. Admittedly, my ex paid my tuition there, the only "break" I got.

1 Reply

@okie,

Who said anything about faddish music? So what if your dad played music. I have the feeling you never listen to any. My daughter plays 8 instruments and her father, my ex, could pretty much play any reed, wind or brass instrument he picked up. String instruments boggled his mind.

We can't judge your wife's skill because one man's meat is another man's mediocrity. Sure, some folks are happy with Wonder bread and a McBurger but I am not.

You accuse me of spouting ignorance and arrogance when someone tells you each and every time you post here that you are dumb. If anyone is arrogant, it is you. Why do you think I accuse of typing in front of a mirror?

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@okie,

Fox is a biased source.

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@plainoldme,

Pom is a biased source.

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The House is lurching towards a vote later this afternoon on a Republican measure to pass a continuing resolution - which would avoid a federal government shutdown on Friday. The House, Senate and the White House would get 2 weeks to work out a budget for the remainder of this fiscal year. The Republican plan would require cuts in spending of $4Bn between now and Sept 30th. Many of those cuts have already been approved by President Obama. If it passes the House it appears to me the Senate and the president would probably go along.
This afternoon the White House proposed an alternative plan: do a 4 o5 5 week CR in exchange for $8Bn in cuts. House majority leader John Boehner says that it too late to consider an alternative plan.
The WH says 2 weeks is not enough time. Hence the longer time frame proposed today. I think there is more to it then that, though.

1 Reply

@realjohnboy,

335-91 in favor of a 2 week extension with $4Bn in cuts.

1 Reply

@realjohnboy,

Quote:

House passes two-week stopgap spending bill

Carrie Dann writes:In a step to avert a government shutdown before the current funding measure expires later this week, the House has passed a two-week spending bill would cut federal spending by $4 billion.

The vote was 335-91, with six Republicans opposing the GOP-authored measure. On the other side of the aisle, 104 Democrats voted for it, while 85 voted against the bill.

The Republican-backed stopgap bill was considered palatable by many Democrats because it drew on suggestions made by President Barack Obama in his budget for this year.

The Senate is expected to approve the bill within the next two days, giving lawmakers an additional two weeks to negotiate a longer-term measure to fund the government.

Some GOP House members opposed the bill because it did not include more controversial measures to defund Planned Parenthood and the implementation of the Obama-backed health care plan.

Conservative Rep. Steve King of Iowa tweeted shortly before the vote, “I will vote "NO" on 2week CR bc some of ObamaCare is funded by it & Pence amendment to block Planned Parenthood is not in.” Source

1 Reply

@JPB,

Reid sez they'll hold a vote on this bill as well. Looks like the shutdown/showdown will be put off for two more weeks.

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

@plainoldme,

plainoldme wrote:

Listen, I grew up poor. Because of my good grades, my membership in the National Honor Society and my high scores on the SATs and competitive tests, I was awarded several college scholarships.

Since you seem to be into the game of one upmanship here, while pooh poohing other people that you consider beneath you, so what, pom? - I had good grades and scholarships and all of that other stuff too. I minored in math in college, which I doubt you could cut the mustard, the "mustard" being able to pass classes in Calculus, Analytical Geometry and Trigonometry and all of that kind of stuff.

Quote:

But, they only paid tuition. So I worked. I had one of the early work study grants and worked for the chemistry department of my college. Then I worked at a museum as a tour guide for several years and at the post office during Christmas rush.

I went to grad school at a state university and worked part-time while attending school full-time for the first year. During that period, I took civil service tests and looked for work. The next year, I worked as a welfare case worker and went to night school. I took part of a year off from work to student teach. The following year, I taught and went to night school. Because I found teaching confining, I looked for and found work in journalism, earning $8,000/annum or the same as a teacher would earn or slightly less than a new attorney would earn. I continued taking night classes and finished my degree. Every professor I had asked me to tutor in writing.

I later earned a second master's at an Ivy League school where I again tutored in writing. Admittedly, my ex paid my tuition there, the only "break" I got.

If you are telling the truth, it befuddles me as to why you are so clueless about some things, pom, such as about the economy, etc. You actually sound like you could be a decent person, which is different from your demeanor on this forum. Given your experiences, etc., it seems like you should be educated enough to actually be conservative rather than being stuck in the swamp of liberalism. Can you explain that, pom?

1 Reply

Meanwhile, I am sure that yall have been nattering away here while waiting for Gov Scott Walker's budget announcement from Wisconsin.
It came out this evening.
He proposes cutting $4.2Bn from the budget (6.7%) over the next two years. $1.25Bn would come from aid to education and local governments.
He claims that much of that could be accomplished by requiring more from union members who work for the government with regards to contributions to retirement funds and health insurance programs. Opponents say that many employees are already at the level he proposes.
I assume that someone here can fill in the details about that.
Two bullet points I caught while watching Walker's speech:
^ The state government would have the ability to limit any increase in taxes by a locality to offset cuts;
^ The state should eliminate any capital gains taxes for investors in companies creating jobs in Wisconsin.

Please let me know if I have misunderstood any of the details. Thanks.

1 Reply

@realjohnboy,

Quote:

Please let me know if I have misunderstood any of the details. Thanks.

Walker:

Quote:

"Do as I say, or the schools get it!

He basically is threatening to take punitive measures against children for the Dems disagreeing with his political plans to remake WI into a Conservative wet-dream.

Americans for Prosperity and the Koch brothers bought up ALL the advertising time possible around Walker's speech on local WI television.

Cycloptichorn

2 Replies

@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Americans for Prosperity and the Koch brothers bought up ALL the advertising time possible around Walker's speech on local WI television.
Cycloptichorn

Can you source that claim, Cyclo?

1 Reply

@realjohnboy,

realjohnboy wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Americans for Prosperity and the Koch brothers bought up ALL the advertising time possible around Walker's speech on local WI television.
Cycloptichorn

Can you source that claim, Cyclo?

My comment was based on eye-witness reports from local watchers on WI television. I can't vouch for the veracity other than the fact that my friend there has never lied in the past.

Cycloptichorn

0 Replies

Where is the US economy headed?

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