Where is the US economy headed?

@parados,

Ican? debate??!! Since when is a list a debate?

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@parados,

Parados, my hat is off to you for having the "stick-to-ativity" to read that far into one of okie's posts. I read the second sentence. The lack of logic and abysmal structure were more than I could tolerate. I never made it to the third!

You're a good man, parados, and a valiant one.

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I read a review of Andrew Basevich's latest book today and I urge everyone to read the book.

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@parados,

parados wrote:

This is what the court said about your statement in Butler okie.

Quote:
. When such a contention comes here, we naturally require a showing that by no reasonable possibility can the challenged legislation fall within the wide range of discretion permitted to the Congress.

So, in order for you to argue that something is NOT covered by the general welfare clause the court requires that you show there is no reasonable possibility that such legislation could be for the general welfare. A standard that is difficult to meet and based on yours and ican's arguments wouldn't even come close to meeting.

What you have just said is one big reason why I am a conservative, and why I think liberal politicians and liberal judges have twisted the content and the intent of the constitution to whatever they please to do, without regard to a common sense interpretation of what the constitution says and what the framers intents really were. It helps explain why this country is now on the edge of bankruptcy, it has been driven to the brink by Democratic big spenders for the past few decades now. When these people take the oath of office, they swear to uphold the constitution, but sadly they have ignored their oath and have mismanaged the jobs that they were elected to do. Its time for a huge change in Washington.

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@okie,

Okie you have to be very careful of them demacrates as you know they can lie just like any other party, and like you said they do not have the same common sense as conservative's when it comes to the constitution.

Now that I think of it did you see that thread titled "Does common sense exist"? http://able2know.org/topic/160898-1

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@reasoning logic,

I took a quick look at the thread. An interesting subject for sure. About all I can say is that I agree with what is now heard fairly often, that common sense is not very common anymore.

Having grown up on a farm in Oklahoma, I think farmers learn common sense or they do not survive, either physically or financially or both, so they know what it is. For example, if you drive your tractor into a mudhole and spend a half tank of fuel and half a day getting out, it is common sense not to repeat the mistake on the next round around the field. Yet there are people that will repeat that same mistake. Another example, my granddad, who was born in 1868 and never finished grade school I don't think, he called cigarettes "coffin nails" way back in the early teens and twenties and taught my mother that. He considered it common sense, but I guess millions of people never figured it out and waited for the government to print the warning on the cigarette packages about them being hazardous to their health. Some people have common sense and others do not, and I cannot explain why some do and some don't, reasoning logic.

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Common sense has something in common with beauty: so many of those who proscribe it to themselves totally lack it.

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@okie,

Quote:

What you have just said is one big reason why I am a conservative, and why I think liberal politicians and liberal judges have twisted the content and the intent of the constitution to whatever they please to do

Don't you mean you are a conservative because you are willing to ignore the Constituiton and the Supreme Court rulings because you don't agree with them. That shows an utter contempt for our system of government on your part okie. Do you think the government should only do what you want it to? Or do you think the Republic was created so all sides have to compromise?

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@okie,

Frankly okie, I get sick of your BS.
Let's look at what you have said..

Quote:

I have a feeling that this constitutional section has been largely ignored and not dealt with or confronted directly and as precisely as it should have been so far.

Then when shown it wasn't ignored by the courts but they actually ruled on it you don't admit that your "feeling" was wrong. Instead you attack the ruling you claimed didn't exist as not being "common sense."

It is legal and binding under our constitution. If you want to attack the US Constitution, go ahead but don't proclaim yourself a patriot while doing it because you are doing nothing but trying to undermine the Constitution and this country.

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@parados,

It's too bad okie can't see the irony of his "feelings" about the US Constitution that is the instrument by which our country was founded and exists to be treated equally under our laws.

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@cicerone imposter,

It is amazing how many people say things and are not informed on the subject matter they speak of.
I know that I have done this before out of ignorance, I am embarrassed to say that I still do because I am not always completely conscious of it at all times.
It seems to me that when we come to this point of being able to be conscious of the fact that we have confirmation biases, it is then that our knowledge begins to excelerate in the understanding of things.

I could be wrong but it seems that Thucydides the father of "scientific history" wrote about this during the same time that Socrates was walking the earth.

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@reasoning logic,

rl, The first lesson we must learn is that "the more we think we know, the less we really know." This should be the basis for gaining knowledge; not get stuck on personal beliefs and feelings. The internet is a wonderful tool, because there are so many sources we can access. Some people never learn to use these simple tools, and rely on their faulty memory or biased media. I use Wiki and FactCheck often to make sure my understanding of the topic has some support. They are not 100% correct, but it's still the closest to being right.

Some people never learn from their mistakes; their biggest handicap to learning.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

rl, The first lesson we must learn is that "the more we think we know, the less we really know."

Knowledge is like a circle, and the more we learn - the larger the circle surrounding what we know, so I agree with what you said by observing that the circumference of the circle in contact with the unknown continues to grow larger and we should therefore realize and become aware that there is more and more that we do not know.

That is knowledge however, which is a bit different than wisdom. In regard to wisdom, there are age old principles that will stand the test of time and will remain just as true and right as they were at the beginning of time.

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@okie,

Why haven't you learned the things you seem to understand concerning the test of time?

Why is your memory of history so lacking and wrong? Why is your current knowledge so lacking and wrong?

You seem to be lost in a no time zone where knowledge remains static - and wrong.

1 Reply

@okie,

Quote:

Knowledge is like a circle, and the more we learn - the larger the circle surrounding what we know, so I agree with what you said by observing that the circumference of the circle in contact with the unknown continues to grow larger and we should therefore realize and become aware that there is more and more that we do not know.

That is funny okie.
When you learned that the Supreme Court had ruled on the meaning of "general welfare" you didn't let your circle grow larger. You just lambasted them as being liberal because you didn't agree and made your circle of knowledge smaller.

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@cicerone imposter,

Very enlightening!

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Why haven't you learned the things you seem to understand concerning the test of time?

Why is your memory of history so lacking and wrong? Why is your current knowledge so lacking and wrong?

You seem to be lost in a no time zone where knowledge remains static - and wrong.

There you go making general statements without specificity in regard to what you are talking about. ci, you need to provide a statement of mine that you disagree with, along with some evidence or proof of my statement being wrong.

1 Reply

@parados,

parados wrote:

Quote:
Knowledge is like a circle, and the more we learn - the larger the circle surrounding what we know, so I agree with what you said by observing that the circumference of the circle in contact with the unknown continues to grow larger and we should therefore realize and become aware that there is more and more that we do not know.

That is funny okie.
When you learned that the Supreme Court had ruled on the meaning of "general welfare" you didn't let your circle grow larger. You just lambasted them as being liberal because you didn't agree and made your circle of knowledge smaller.

Not all Supreme Court rulings are correct in my opinion, parados. Only if I thought the Supreme Court was infallible since its creation would I believe that. Do you believe the Supreme Court has issued perfect decisions or opinions, such as Plessy v. Ferguson in 1896? Disagreement does not make the circle of knowledge smaller at all. That would be a silly assumption in my opinion.

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@okie,

Not all Supreme Court decisions are correct but until they are overturned they ARE the only legal interpretation.

Now.. since "theft" is a legal word that requires something be against the law and the legal definition is not violated by how the money is spent for the "general welfare" then is ican correct or not when he says taxation is theft?

Since the legal definition of "general welfare" requires ican to show beyond a doubt that any spending doesn't meet that definition is his argument for impeachment valid or not?

Your refusal to accept the court's ruling as the legal one even if you disagree is what makes you appear to hate the Constitution okie. You refuse to accept that the court has the final ruling even if they ruled incorrectly.

1 Reply

@okie,

Nobody has ever argued that the supreme court's decisions were always right. So, what's your point?

1 Reply

Where is the US economy headed?

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