Where is the US economy headed?

@cicerone imposter,

People drove less, and they trotted out the small cars, most of which they already owned. Sales of the Ford Focus, as one example, increased by 50% over the previous year. People drastically cut back on fuel purchases at $4.00 + per gallon. The price dropped, and it had nothing to do with Cash for Clunkers, or any other government intervention. It was nothing other than market forces.

I do know you meant $4.00/gallon, not $400.00/barrel.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

okie, If your list is so important in controlling our current financial crisis, why didn't Bush do anything about it when oil hit over $400/barrel? You did list "energy" didn't you?

I guess I should read your posts. I admit I don't read them much anymore, but when did oil hit $400 per barrel. Speaking of the real world?

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@okie,

Oh, you caught my exaggeration? LOL Do you really know how much oil costs were under GWBush?

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@cicerone imposter,

Exaggeration? I am used to it. Plus distortions and errors.

I could look it up, but wasn't oil up to around $140 a barrel? By the way, if the world economy comes back, the price will go higher than that, easily. And we will wish we had done some drilling. I just saw an article a few days ago that Non-Opec oil has peaked, and is on the downward trend, so OPEC has us right where they want us, dead to right. Good luck on your solar panels and windmills powering the trains, ships, trucks, and all the rest of what makes the economy go, ci. Ha ha, it should be fun, except we conservatives will also have to pay the ridiculous prices for fuel.

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@okie,

okie, Everybody has been paying higher prices for fuel much longer than Americans. Get your head out of your ass!

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@cicerone imposter,

But I would rather pay lower prices if possible. Apparently you don't. We will pay higher prices soon enough, without pushing the schedule for it. I am not going to purposely not plant wheat so that I can pay more for wheat, that strikes me as somewhat stupid.

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@okie,

We have been paying lower prices. Why doesn't that stick in your brain? You need to replace your glue.

Here's what they're paying in the UK for petrol:

Quote:

Time Submitted Fuel Price(p/l) Brand Petrol Station Location
14/08/2009 04:03:50 Unleaded 95.9 FUELFORCE Ltd Unknown Map Link
14/08/2009 01:21:11 Unleaded 103.9 BP Euston Filling Station Map Link
14/08/2009 01:02:43 Unleaded 103.9 Texaco Church Hall Garage - Map Link
14/08/2009 01:02:26 Unleaded 100.9 Asda ASDA Map Link
13/08/2009 23:03:38 Unleaded 104.9 Texaco Tates - Map Link
13/08/2009 23:00:25 Unleaded 102.9 Sainsburys Sainsbury's Map Link
13/08/2009 23:00:12 Unleaded 102.9 Sainsburys Sainsbury's Map Link
13/08/2009 22:52:48 Unleaded 102.9 Shell Gulf Telegraph Service Stations (EAC) Map Link
13/08/2009 22:23:49 Unleaded 104.9 BP Boongate Service Station

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@okie,

okie wrote:

Good luck on your solar panels and windmills powering the trains, ships, trucks, and all the rest of what makes the economy go, ci.

Really? I've seen a couple of ships (I've an older thread about it somewhere) which use high-tech kites.
Windmills are just kept running for historic reasons.

And photo-voltaic and wind turbines produce electricty here, which is used elsewhere like electricity from any other source.

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@Walter Hinteler,

Walter Hinteler wrote:

Really? I've seen a couple of ships (I've an older thread about it somewhere) which use high-tech kites.

Might you be talking about sailboats? Are you proposing that oil be transported in sailboats now?

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Walter Hinteler wrote:

Really? I've seen a couple of ships (I've an older thread about it somewhere) which use high-tech kites.

Might you be talking about sailboats? Are you proposing that oil be transported in sailboats now?

You gotta get with the times, pops.

http://www.treehugger.com/beluga-skysails-kites-002.jpg

Throwing a big kite up can save 20% or more in fuel costs, or 2k/day.

Cycloptichorn

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@Cycloptichorn,

Not bad, I had not seen that. Seems like a good idea. But to totally replace the need for oil, I somehow doubt it will happen soon, cyclops.

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@okie,

okie wrote:

Not bad, I had not seen that. Seems like a good idea. But to totally replace the need for oil, I somehow doubt it will happen soon, cyclops.

It's not about replacing the need for oil; we will need oil for some time to come. It's about incrementally finding more efficient ways to do the things we want to do.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@okie,

You are unable to look at anything without your personal extremism of a problem. There are many variables to any issue, and the solutions are usually a combination of many things.

You suffer from myopia.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

It's not about replacing the need for oil; we will need oil for some time to come. It's about incrementally finding more efficient ways to do the things we want to do.

Cycloptichorn

For once, we agree. I think though the increments may be smaller than you want, and how we do that, we profoundly disagree on the wisest and best course to take.

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

It's not about replacing the need for oil; we will need oil for some time to come. It's about incrementally finding more efficient ways to do the things we want to do.

Cycloptichorn

For once, we agree. I think though the increments may be smaller than you want, and how we do that, we profoundly disagree on the wisest and best course to take.

I think that we as a nation get the results we push for. America has a long and rich tradition of scientific development, when we decide that we want to do so. If we want to increase efficiencies and find better ways to do things, and we are willing to invest time and money into these new techniques, we will achieve them.

For example, solar and wind power. Many claim that they are not ready for prime-time, so to speak; but this is entirely a factor of how much time and energy we dump into them. The last decade has seen large advances in both these technologies, and if we continue to push for more, we will get more.

Cycloptichorn

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@Cycloptichorn,

I believe solar energy needs to be developed more to the extent consumers can afford to install them.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

I believe solar energy needs to be developed more to the extent consumers can afford to install them.

It's already at that point. Solar is a long-term investment.

Of course, the amount of sunshine your home receives plays a big part in that. In the Southwest and sunny CA, it's a better deal than in the NE.

Cycloptichorn

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@Cycloptichorn,

But many can't afford to install those solar panels in their homes because of the current costs. It's an "investment" not many can afford today.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Many claim that they are not ready for prime-time, so to speak; but this is entirely a factor of how much time and energy we dump into them. The last decade has seen large advances in both these technologies, and if we continue to push for more, we will get more.

Cycloptichorn

Yes, and it was done without Obama. It was done because the great power of the free market drives entrpeneurship, invention, and innovation. That is where I will place most of my faith, not in some bureaucracy to solve problems.

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:
Many claim that they are not ready for prime-time, so to speak; but this is entirely a factor of how much time and energy we dump into them. The last decade has seen large advances in both these technologies, and if we continue to push for more, we will get more.

Cycloptichorn

Yes, and it was done without Obama. It was done because the great power of the free market drives entrpeneurship, invention, and innovation. That is where I will place most of my faith, not in some bureaucracy to solve problems.

Okie, how many times must you be reminded that huge amounts of the research which leads to new inventions and new science is funded by the government, and takes place in Universities?

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

Where is the US economy headed?

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