Where is the US economy headed?

@okie,

okie wrote:

Quote:

Come on, ci, I have almost given up completely on you, you are so dense. If you were in business, you would understand the fear of what government will do next, how they will tax you or punish you with another law.

No, okie, I am not dense. You're the one making sweeping threats of what government will do to business, but you show no evidence whatsoever about the "when and how?" The bailout of the auto companies began with Bush. I disagree with Obama's continuation of that policy, and I've said so on many occasions.

What businesses now fear is the downturn in our economy, and the concomitant consumer spending down. It's the result of a) more people losing their jobs and homes by the thousands every day, b) more are trying to save for their rainy day fund, because they don't know if they'll have a job tomorrow, and c) most Americans have lost equities in their home values and retirement funds. That's the reason businesses are worried; lack of consumers.

You understand very little to nothing about economics or politics. All you do is blow shite around here with nothing but your own depraved imagination.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
Are you serious? It was a cowardly one. He didn't want GM to fail on his watch, so he punted to the next guy. Who is now getting the blame from you guys. Very convenient.

where I grew up little boys learn at a early age not to start something that they can't finish. Bush was under the impression that bankruptcy law being what it was believed to be at the end of 08 that he could force the auto companies into bankruptcy, but that obama would need to deal with all of the bankruptcy process. He said that it was unfair to force obama to step into such a huge jackpot day 1 of his administration. Look, I have no use for Bush generally, but in this case he made a good call.

I would like to think that you're right, and maybe you are. But I was soooo disappointed with President Bush for seemingly abandoning all rational fiscal responsibility with that humongous bailout bill in November before he left office--admittedly he had the backing of Obama and the majority of Congress to do it--that I have a difficult time putting a good face on that. I think he got suckered into the fear mongering game as many others did (and still are).

But I will defer to a competent argument on your part and try my best to reserve judgment until we see how it all shakes out or until the more impartial economic gurus make their final assessment.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

What businesses now fear is the downturn in our economy, and the concomitant consumer spending down...That's the reason businesses are worried; lack of consumers.

I found some data on that, ci, from the Fed Reserve as reported by the AP on Friday. It was, alas, a sloppily written story.
Consumer borrowing fell by $15.7B in April, nearly matching the $16.6B in March. Those numbers are the biggest in the 60 years the stat has been tracked (albeit unadjusted for inflation or the increase in the size of the economy). Most of the decline is related to credit cards.
Meanwhile, consumer deposits in savings accounts rose 5.7% in April.

The consumers are getting religion but it is bad news for the retailers. Same store sales fell pretty dramatically (6% overall?) in May. Manufacturer's are waiting for orders. But, in the Fed Reserve survey I am a participant in, retailers like me continue to slash inventory. The Index (increase inventory-decrease inventory) was -26 in March, -28 in April and -17 in May. Maybe May was a turning point.

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@realjohnboy,

Quote:

The consumers are getting religion but it is bad news for the retailers. Same store sales fell pretty dramatically (6% overall?) in May. Manufacturer's are waiting for orders. But, in the Fed Reserve survey I am a participant in, retailers like me continue to slash inventory. The Index (increase inventory-decrease inventory) was -26 in March, -28 in April and -17 in May. Maybe May was a turning point.

You see that in services as well, I am finding 4 star hotels available up to the last minute, and with price cuts. I am having no trouble getting into the best restaurants last minute as well. A lot of retail is just holding on, waiting for a return to "normal". I don't expect it to ever happen, Americans are tapped out, the spending cuts are permanent.

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@realjohnboy,

Do you mean rjb that if we don't borrow more we are fucked?

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

Truffaut said the restaurants are threating places for men hawk.

I presume the best ones are the ones that go to extremes.

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

I am finding 4 star hotels available up to the last minute, and with price cuts. I am having no trouble getting into the best restaurants last minute as well.

You have stayed in a 4 star hotel? I stayed in a Motel 6 once.

1 Reply

@spendius,

spendius wrote:

Do you mean rjb that if we don't borrow more we are fuc...

Our government has at least 2 times sent money to us, hoping we would spend it. Hasn't worked yet.

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Real John Boy wrote:

Re: cicerone imposter (Post 3669510)
The House last night, by a vote of 258-154 (including some 25 Repubs in the majority), passed a bill giving new parents who are Federal employees 4 weeks of paid leave. If they wanted to take off longer they would have to dip into their accrued annual leave/vacation time. The cost to the taxpayer is estimated at $20M/year.
I heard no mention (on the NPR story) as to whether this would be available to fathers as well as mothers. But it was noted that the military gives 6 weeks paid leave to new mothers and 10 days to fathers.
Some opponents said good idea/bad timing. Others worry that, if passed, it would only be a matter of time before Congress mandates a similar program for private employers.
The bill goes next to the Senate.

I would have voted NO. Are you surprised?

*****************************************************************

I would have voted against it also but will Obuma veto it if it gets to his desk?

Because he is absolutely unprincipled, he will ask Axelrod what the polls say. How many votes will he get if he signs the bill. Obuma thinks he is still back in the Chicago Ghetto doing "the numbers">

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TODAY'S NEWSPAPER-Washington Post-
Subscribe | PostPoints

Paid Parental Leave Considered

Happy Wednesday! The House Oversight and Government Reform Committee is scheduled today to consider the Federal Employees Paid Parental Leave Act, a measure that would allow federal employees to take up to four weeks of paid leave for the birth or adoption of a child.

Yours truly reports today in The Post that "Federal workers already receive 12 weeks of unpaid leave for such an event and can also use their paid sick leave or vacation time during that period.

"The House approved an identical bill during the previous Congress, but the Senate did not take up the measure. Several of the committee's Republican members consider the bill a wasteful government expense amid the national economic slump.

But... "Federal employee unions also argue that while their members can take up to 12 weeks of unpaid leave, many cannot afford to do so. The measure would help establish a stronger work-life balance for federal workers, a stated goal of the Obama administration, they said.

____________________________________________________

A stated goal of the Obama administration, they say.

Of course, Most of Obuma's clients, when he was a community organizer in Chicago were on welfare and sat on their butts all day long. They had a great work/life balance. No work--what a life.

They only trouble is that someone has to pay for these useless idlers.

That is the rapidly diminishing group of hard workers who pay more and more tax to the Obuma robbers!

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@realjohnboy,

realjohnboy wrote:

hawkeye10 wrote:

I am finding 4 star hotels available up to the last minute, and with price cuts. I am having no trouble getting into the best restaurants last minute as well.

You have stayed in a 4 star hotel? I stayed in a Motel 6 once.

I have stayed in 4 star hotels, but I have never stayed in a 4 star hotel I had to pay for except once in Vancouver as the last night of a great vacation. But Hawkeye is correct that there are a LOT of bargains to be had almost everywhere right now. A four star hotel might offer a rate close to what that Motel 6 would have been offering a couple of years ago. A couple of years ago we were having to fight to get booking for a decent flight to almost anywhere and all the flights were packed to capacity. I just got my regular routine promo from American Airlines offering $48 non stop fare between a number of prominent cities.

1 Reply

@Foxfyre,

Quote:

I have stayed in 4 star hotels, but I have never stayed in a 4 star hotel I had to pay for except once in Vancouver as the last night of a great vacation. But Hawkeye is correct that there are a LOT of bargains to be had almost everywhere right now

Luxury places in particular are half empty and cheap. Luxury is out of fashion, and those with money still are also staying away, it is not cool/does not feel right to be having a great time in a ritzy place. It is now a playground for people like me, who have never been able to afford such places, but who now find ourselves with a money to spend and a desire to play. Until these places start going belly up, and the supply comes more into balance with demand anyways. Word is that a slew of "boutique" hotels are with-in a year or so of default on their commercial loans, and thus bankruptcy.

1 Reply

@hawkeye10,

It's not only the hotels that are giving big discounts; travel companies and cruise lines are making it so cheap, it's cheaper to go on a cruise than to stay at home. You get accommodations plus three squares a day. Can't beat that, and the food is on par with some of the best restaurants around. The only disadvantage is the points of departure and arrivals of ships that are not close to home, because that means airfares can eat away at the good bargains.

1 Reply

@cicerone imposter,

The way I hear it the cruise lines have added a slew of fees, and have drastically cut back on the food offerings and service. It will be interesting to see what they do to cut capacity, normally you would expect them to scrap the oldest as the airlines have done, but unfortunately most of the new ships are just toooooo damn big. Maybe they will become commuter boats in Asia, running Filipino's and the like. No matter how you slice it I don't see the cruise lines being able to avoid bankruptcy.

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@hawkeye10,

hawkeye10 wrote:

No matter how you slice it I don't see the cruise lines being able to avoid bankruptcy.

I hope we don't bail them out as well. After all, they aren't exactly an essential service. I never lost anything by not taking a cruise.

1 Reply

@okie,

okie wrote:

Quote:

I hope we don't bail them out as well.

Where do you come up with all of your crackpot ideas? Your own brain, or from your parents?

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@hawkeye10,

During the past decade, the cruise lines built all those mega-ships that can carry 6,400 passengers. Their lobbies are bigger than land-based hotels, and they have rock climbing, ice skating, and other sports areas that just boggles the mind. I like smaller ships myself; and favor those that carry around 620 passengers like Oceania. Princess has the same ship but carries a little bit more passengers.

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@hawkeye10,

I knew you didn't mention Obama, but it appeared in your post that it MAY have been implied and I say that, because since he took office Republicans, maybe NOT you have tried to "stick" him with being the cause, when I know and any poster knows that the Bush Administration is the cause for MOST of the economic woes in this country today and for the past 8 years. I apoligize if you aren't one of the naysayers in this group, but if you are, I stand by my statements.

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@okie,

Well, that's like saying business needs the governments help, (financially), for their BAD business decisions, but don't want any strings attached. They go on making bad decisions, begging for more taxpayer dollars, etc. You're damned skippy, the government should safeguard against fraud and bad management by nationalizing, as YOU call it, but if I were a private lender, I'd have plenty of strings attached to all the LOSERS, e.g., the banks, stocks and ALL of the greedy "suits" out there, feathering their nests after accepting OUR tax dollars, so naysay what the Obama Administration is implementing but already conditions are improving from what they were back in September 08, when the bottom literally fell OUT of this piss-poor economy!

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@Cycloptichorn,

Thank You!

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Where is the US economy headed?

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