Where is the US economy headed?

right, so none of this does any good for Chrysler if they don't live long enough to use the technology Fiat is giving them in place of cash. Fiat is paying to retool one plant now, but it will make Fiats not Chryslers.

Hey, Chrysler. Way to dilute shareholder equity - to the extent there was any equity left to start with.

that would be 80.1% Cerberus Capital Management who wants to give the company away, and 19.1% Daimler who presumably as usual don't have a clue what to do with Chrysler.

Who owns the other .8%?

19.9% ......typo

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/21/business/economy/21bailout.html?_r=1&hp
one day these clowns are going to wake up having had an epiphany, they will then know that this problem does not get solved by throwing money at it. There is a lack of confidence in the economic system, a well deserved lack of confidence, only remaking the financial system and the global economic system will solve it.

were are we at, well past $10 trillion of global future taxpayer future earnings being diverted to the pockets of the capitalists who failed us? For the last ten years I had decided that my dream of a socialist revolution could not happen, it is time to reconsider. Cities will burn for what has been done to our kids during the last six months. This is no time to double down on a foolish bet with more bailouts, but we will do that.

Sorry, hawkeye, but the experts that Obama chose will certainly "give" more billions to the banks to keep them solvent.

They have no other choice to resolve the short-term or long-term cash/credit problems.

akin to deciding to put another $1000 into the beater in the driveway, which has had over $2000 put into it over the last six months. Ya, you need to get to work, but every dollar down the rat hole (aka the beater) is one less you have for the car you need long term. And what do we call it when we pay the mechanic bill, this last one, and proclaim to all around that our problems are solved???? Delusion maybe? Stupidity? And when you put the mechanic bill on the credit card what is that? It has to be stupidity.

When they're fighting a firestorm that may destroy everything, there's not many options. Maybe, you have a better solution.

of course, stop handing out money and start planning the next global economic system. We could have it done in a year, and THEN use what ever money we can find to jump start it. You act like spending this money will prevent a depression, it will not. It will delay the depression and then we will have these added unnecessary bills to deal with after we finally do what we should be doing now. You fix the system first, and spend money to support it after. You don't invest in a proven loser.

You are losing your common sense CI.

I didn't say it'll prevent a depression. I said it was necessary to keep cash and credit available in our economy. Big difference.

I hope that it is not headed for the 10% Unemployment under the esteemed Jimmy Carter. I KNOW it is not headed for the 17% under FDR AS LATE AS
1937(The New Deal did not get us out of the Depression). But FDR was able to solve those problems when we went to war with Germany and Japan and
unemployment was erased.

I know that President Obama's personal morality and goodness would never allow him to choose war as a solution to economic problems in the USA.

Obama did say we had to get out of Iraq, didn't he?

I will gladly join in any march insisting that we leave Afghanistan. We are spending far too much money and losing too many American lives to continue the war there.

sometimes a "counterfire" has to be used to dam in a fast spreading fire .
nobody likes to give up his house and possessions to a counterfire - but sometimes that's the only way to stop a firestorm from spreading further .
is that the case with the american economy - not sure , but looks pretty much like it .
hbg

That's about the size of it; our instincts tells us that adding more dollars to our economy will only fuel inflation, but without a national economy, inflation takes a back seat.

BTW, even Geithner during the hearings said priority one was to get the credit market working again; I agree.

Hawkeye 10- You are correct. However, I hope that you realize that part of the hype has been constructed by the media to build a firewall around President Obama. If, as some in the media have said( See Krugman in the New York Times) we are heading for another GREAT DEPRESSION courtesy of GW Bush( never mind, Barney Frank and/or Senator Dodd and their machinations with regard to Fannie Mae ), President Obama can be forgiven for any failures---the problem inherited from Bush was too large and profound--you see!

I am not going to become overly concerned until two things happen--

l. Unemployment reaches the level of 10%. This last occured under the aegis of the one worlder- Jimmy Carter.

2. The Dow Jones drops below 6,000--At this time, my holdings roughly mirror the Dow Jones. The Dow is now at 8,000.
In 2004, I began investing in earnest. The Dow was then at 3,000. At this time, my investments have increased by 5,000 in 14 years.

Of course, if I were a Utopian or a malcontent, I could whine about the fall of the Dow from 13,000 to 8,000 but then I might be accused of being greedy.

Hi, genoves. I don't think I have met you.
1) Unemployment. I am pretty confident that it will rise from 7.2% to 10% as the downturn spread beyond manufacturers to retailers. 34000 job losses at Circuit City alone.
2) Dow hitting 6000. I doubt it for a couple reasons:
a) What is the alternative to the stock market? Bonds, CD's, real estate? I meant to look at dividend yields on Dow stocks. That puts a bit of a floor under the market, perhaps.
b) Two cute financial tricks come to mind: one is comps. Companies ran into trouble last year and lost a lot of money. It they can show less losses this time around they can claim there has been improvement compared to last year.
The other trick, in CPA parlance, is "extraordinary items." Suppose a company loses a factory in LA due to a hurricane. Any cost is not considered usual so it pretty much ends up in a footnote. Fights break out over what is extraordinary. Job layoffs costs are routine nowadays but tend to slip into a footnote. I can imagine that, in the extreme, a blizzard in the NE for a week before Christmas could result in "losses" that should be considered as extraordinary.
Most of the media report earnings (losses) before extraordinary items.

Sorry for the long post. I do tend to go on, don't I?

Ah, but you have. Just under a different name.

Cycloptichorn

rjb writes :



from BLOOMBERG report :


full report :
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&refer=worldwide&sid=aGQ__icNMvzI

looking at "timesonline" , i get the impression that things in britain are as bad - if not worse .
"viyella" - founded in 1784 - is closing up ; "wedgewood" is about to go - and they are pulling down their german subsidiary "rosenthal" .

reminds me of the horsedealer who was selling a horse :
"she no looke so good" , he told the buyer .
the buyer said : "i'm not buying the horse for looks but to pull a wagon " .
two days later he came back : "you sold me a blind horse , you 8z5x4c " .
seller : "i telle you , she no looke so good" .

let's hope our "horses" are looking better !
hbg