Shep Smith: Journalists are not the enemy of the people

Izzy has been virulently anti-American since he first showed up here. This was the remark to which I initially responded:



Izzy is not Irish either. He has always asserted that he knows what "the real Irish" think and say. He is also overly fond of straw man fallacies, which it seems appeal to you, too. I know of no one who said he was attacking medics. His MO is to become more and more hysterical in his tone and accusations--witness the Trotsky bullshit he has posted.

He the proceeded to write this:



Of course, that's another straw man because I have never lectured him on the horrors of the British Empire. As I pointed out subsequently there is absolutely no evidence that any American administration had the extermination of the Vietnamese as an object--there was no genocide or attempt at genocide, so that is just more hysteria, his stock in trade. He then proceeded to this:



So I pointed out that the Army Medical Corps does not drop bombs. It seems to me that your reaction is colored by your personal animus to me. Note that his rhetoric (never very adroit) finishes by advocating smashing someone's head on the pavement if you cannot get them to agree with you. This from someone who was lecturing me on my moral standing. Enjoy your new buddy.

That's a strange quote about the Irish. Especially the Northern Irish who fought against each other based on their religion. https://berkleycenter.georgetown.edu/publications/northern-ireland-religion-in-war-and-peace

I sincerely hope you have not directed all of that outrage toward me. I do everything possible to avoid you. This might be a stretch, but please try to understand I’m not engaging with you, I’m just not furious at Izzy. You may be furious at multiple people, so enjoy. You are correct, Izzy may not be an Irishman, and frankly you and I only share Irish heritage (more precisely, our ancestors may have come to the US from Ireland)...both sides of my family.... don’t know or care about yours. I think of myself as Irish American....but first I think of myself as an American.

If you really want to address someone who hates America, I suggest you direct your outrage toward Builder (an Australian) who posts as if he is an American. Or not, meh.

It is a matter of indifference to me at whom you might or might not be furious. I assure you that I am not furious at you or Izzy--neither of you is important to me, and I don't spend much time here. However, your post showed either that you did not understand the exchanges between myself and him, or that you have the same propensity to set up straw men. When I do bother to post here, I'm likely to point those things out. I assure you that Izzy has puked up a great deal of anti-American bile since he arrived here. It is also a matter of indifference to me whether or not you understand that.

Have a lousy day . . . see ya in the funny papers.

I hate to wade in, but in my defense, I sort of started this with my remark that the US committed war crimes. I was referring to the Vietnam war. Not that I think we committed genocide, our aim was not wipe out a race, but to win a war which does not make some of our actions there any better. Even John Kelly testified about those crimes the US committed.



Also Set is correct in that izzythepush does have an itchy happy habit of jumping on any sort of criticism of the US, some of it deserved, but nevertheless he does have a habit of it.

I am proud of John Kelly and his testimony. If we don't admit to our mistakes, we are bound to repeat them.

I meant John "Kerry."

The good thing about the US is its ability to admit its mistakes and make amends when possible. I speak from personal experience. During WWII, the US government put us Japanese Americans into concentration camps, but not German or Italian Americans. That was based on bigotry at its worst, but in the 1980's, the US government apologized and paid us $20,000 reparations to those who were still alive. No other government in this world has done such a thing. The US always strives to do the right thing. We can't ask for more than that in a world full of complexities.

Shouldn't this read : The US always strives to do the right thing by its citizens and companies/corporations?

Trump Blasts Social Media Platforms for “Totally Discriminating” Against Conservatives
By DANIEL POLITI

AUG 18, 20186:02 PM

President Donald Trump took to Twitter Saturday and railed about an issue that has been gaining traction on Fox News and other conservative outlets: “censorship.” In a string of tweets, the commander in chief said social media “is totally discriminating against Republican/Conservative voices.” The president insisted that “we won’t let that happen.” His tweets came at a time when the issue is being increasingly talked about in right-wing circles after some social media platforms removed certain content from conspiracy theorist Alex Jones.


Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump
Social Media is totally discriminating against Republican/Conservative voices. Speaking loudly and clearly for the Trump Administration, we won’t let that happen. They are closing down the opinions of many people on the RIGHT, while at the same time doing nothing to others.......

The president said the platforms are “closing down the opinions of many people on the RIGHT, while at the same time doing nothing to others.” Ultimately, “Censorship is a very dangerous thing & absolutely impossible to police,” added the president. If the goal is to get rid of “fake news” then “there is nothing so Fake as CNN & MSNBC, & yet I do not ask that their sick behavior be removed.”


Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump
.....Censorship is a very dangerous thing & absolutely impossible to police. If you are weeding out Fake News, there is nothing so Fake as CNN & MSNBC, & yet I do not ask that their sick behavior be removed. I get used to it and watch with a grain of salt, or don’t watch at all..

Trump also seemed to suggest social media shouldn’t have any control over its content and everyone should be allowed because the alternative is much worse. “Too many voices are being destroyed, some good & some bad, and that cannot be allowed to happen,” Trump wrote.
“Who is making the choices, because I can already tell you that too many mistakes are being made. Let everybody participate, good & bad, and we will all just have to figure it out!” Trump tweeted about the issue shortly after Tucker Carlson mentioned it on his Fox News show.


Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump
....Too many voices are being destroyed, some good & some bad, and that cannot be allowed to happen. Who is making the choices, because I can already tell you that too many mistakes are being made. Let everybody participate, good & bad, and we will all just have to figure it out!
7:40 AM - Aug 18, 2018

Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey vehemently denied his company was discriminating against any political views in particular during an interview with CNN that is set to air in full on Sunday. “Are we doing something according to political ideology or viewpoints? We are not. Period,” Dorsey said Friday. “We do not look at content with regards to political viewpoint or ideology. We look at behavior.”

Social media does not discriminate; only people. Trump has a history of bigotry and discrimination. Those are facts easily confirmed.

Trump also has a history of spreading falsehoods and lies.
The evidence is overwhelming.

The US is not a single thing and you can't assume that those who do right represent everyone else, nor can you assume those that do wrong don't do right in other situations.

There is good and bad in people and situations and nations are huge, complex networks of networks of people and situations that get summed up as unified collective entities but in reality are anything but.

Ironically, however, despite the essentially fragmentary nature of collective groups, there is not even group identity/solidarity necessary for organic ground-up collectivism to occur. Diverse groups and situations interact in ways that result in aggregate effects, and this is why the economic analysis of free markets emerged with nebulous concepts like 'aggregate demand' and 'the invisible hand' to explain emergent patterns that occur without the planned/intentional coordination of individuals operating as their constituents.

We have a legal system that strives for equality. That there are individuals who are bigots/racists in government is the only danger. Trump is a good example of that. His border wall and banning all Muslims from entering our country has many supporters, but the supporters of the Constitution should override those actions. Trump is only good at dividing our country like no other president in contemporary times. It's because of his ignorance and immaturity. He speaks as if all Mexicans are "criminals and rapists." That only proves his ignorance. US born citizens commit more crimes than illegal and legal citizens of this country.

Trump is ignorant of the facts, and he spreads lies to all Americans. That's a greater tragedy for our country.

Many Americans also seem to forget that all of us except for Native Americans are descendants of immigrants. I'm third generation American and have been told by whites in my youth to "go back to your own country." Bigotry still exists today.

So what good is there in white supremecists? Is it because they don't kick the dog? What a stinking load of horsesnbit.

White supremacists have been successful in exposing white supremacists in our country. It seems many are Nazis.

There are good and bad people in every form of economies. That doesn't take away from the fact that a market economy is better than socialism. I studied Economics, Macroeconomics and Microeconomics in college, and have concluded that I agree with the economics system of democracies.

I'm not Irish, I do have an Irish great grandmother which makes me about as Irish as Setanta, probably a bit more so due to proximity.

The British Empire is long gone, some of us can put historical enmities behind us, others need someone/something to blame for our own shortcomings or to justify our own crimes.

Thank you. Both Gbob and Setanta are Anglophobic bigots who attacked me when I first came onto A2K just for being English.

Both have a huge sense of entitlement and expect us non Americans to bow and scrape before them. Setanta's definition of virulent anti Americanism is anyone not prepared to kiss his arse, listen to his bullshit, or be told what to do.

When I don't do that he has another hissy fit.

That's a lie, and it's name-calling, which is why I will try to get it pulled.

Seven of my great-grandparents were born in Ireland, and the other in Scotland. I was raised by my maternal grand-parents, both of whom were born in Ireland.