How to get to heaven when you die

Rancid wrote:

Scott

God, on the other hand, went out of his way to create a place where he could send his children to burn forever and ever out of spite for their disobedience. This is the God you worship.

I'm sure there is a reasonable, biblical explanation for this... right? God is love... right?

WHERES THE LOVE MAN??

He sent his Son that all the world may be redeemed. THAT is where the love is.

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Quote:

He sent his Son that all the world may be redeemed. THAT is where the love is.

1. All the world wont be redeemed. Think of the little kid who had his parents killed 'in the name of Jesus' during the catholic crusades, you think he will ever put faith in Jesus?
2. According to most christians, God himself came in human form, he didn't send his son. (However the bible does say that Jesus is God's son, go figure...)
3. Jesus suffered for us so that we wouldn't have to suffer in hell. He died and went to hell for three days and then was resurrected, how is that the same as burning forever? If the ransom was to be paid properly, Jesus would have to be in hell forever.

Even if these things weren't true, nothing will convince me that its ok to torture someone forever and ever, its just not reasonable (or realistic).

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Rancid wrote:

Scott

Lets say you have a son, lets call him Adam (for no particular reason) and you love your son as any father would. One day when little Adam is old enough to understand, you tell him "Adam, dont touch the cookies", you then proceed to place a plate of cookies right in front of him. Adam knows hes not allowed to eat the cookies, but out of curiosity, he grabs one and eats it (as any young child would). What would you do?

Well, as a good Christian I'm sure you try to follow God's example in all you do. So, you would take your son by the hand into the kitchen, turn the element on and proceed to hold his hand on the element forever and ever while he screams and yells in pain. Would you do that to your own son just because he didn't obey you? I'm sure you wouldn't. Infact, even if your son disobeyed your every command you would still love him and not wish him any harm. Its human nature.

God, on the other hand, went out of his way to create a place where he could send his children to burn forever and ever out of spite for their disobedience. This is the God you worship.

I'm sure there is a reasonable, biblical explanation for this... right? God is love... right?

WHERES THE LOVE MAN??

That's not how it is. First of all God gave adam all of the trees in the garden except one. It wasn't any special tree, except that it was forbidden of adam and eve to eat from. The reason that God did this was a loving one, not a mean one. God truly loved adam and eve and wanted them to have a chance to choose to love Him back. If God were to force adam to love Him, that is not real love. God gave adam the choice to obey Him or not, by putting the tree there. Adam failed the test because the sepent tricked eve and eve gave to adam. By disobeying God, Adam's children were doomed to also disobey God. God loved them so much that He sent His Son Jesus Christ to live a perfect life and take their punishment for the sins that they committed against God. All we have to do is accept what Jesus Christ did on the cross for our sins to get to heaven, otherwise we have to pay for our own sins. God is a God of love, but He is also a God of perfect justice. In God's eyes, anything that is less than perfect is corrupt and cannot exist with God, therefore they must go to hell. You are looking at this the wrong way. What you said is like a parent telling his kids not to do drugs because they will harm them and then you come along a say "They are just being mean to you because the drugs will make you feel good" The drugs may make you feel good but they will also destroy your life. The same thing with the fruit that adam and eve ate. You can clearly look around you and see the corruption that came from them disobeying God. Pain, suffering, children dying, ect. All is the result of sin.

As far as what did adam and eve eat before they sinned. They ate plants and fruit and vegetables. They did not eat meat at that time.

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First of all God gave adam all of the trees in the garden except one. It wasn't any special tree, except that it was forbidden of adam and eve to eat from. The reason that God did this was a loving one, not a mean one. God truly loved adam and eve and wanted them to have a chance to choose to love Him back. If God were to force adam to love Him, that is not real love. God gave adam the choice to obey Him or not, by putting the tree there.

The tree was a test of Adam and Eve's love for God - ok.

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Adam failed the test because the sepent tricked eve and eve gave to adam. By disobeying God, Adam's children were doomed to also disobey God. God loved them so much that He sent His Son Jesus Christ to live a perfect life and take their punishment for the sins that they committed against God.

Jesus did not take their punishment, are Adam and eve not in hell right now? Besides, Jesus only went to hell for 3 days which is far less than eternity.

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All we have to do is accept what Jesus Christ did on the cross for our sins to get to heaven, otherwise we have to pay for our own sins. God is a God of love, but He is also a God of perfect justice.

I would rather endure crucifiction for myself and go to hell for 3 days, then get ressurected to heaven. I dont want anyone paying for my sins.

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In God's eyes, anything that is less than perfect is corrupt and cannot exist with God, therefore they must go to hell.

Romans 6:23 - "For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." If you're in hell forever, do you not still have eternal life (albeit a painful one)? God told Adam and Eve "in the day you eat from the tree of knowledge of Good and Bad, you shall surely die." He didn't mention anything about eternal torment...

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You are looking at this the wrong way. What you said is like a parent telling his kids not to do drugs because they will harm them and then you come along a say "They are just being mean to you because the drugs will make you feel good" The drugs may make you feel good but they will also destroy your life. The same thing with the fruit that adam and eve ate. You can clearly look around you and see the corruption that came from them disobeying God. Pain, suffering, children dying, ect. All is the result of sin.

I dont approve of giving drugs to children. From what you're saying its like God placed drugs in front of Adam and Eve and said "you can eat anything except these drugs". They disobeyed him one time and cursed the entire human race... a tad harsh, especially considering it was the serpent who orchistrated it.

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As far as what did adam and eve eat before they sinned. They ate plants and fruit and vegetables. They did not eat meat at that time.

Only after the flood people started eating animals.

I dont disagree with scripture, I respect it (but dont necessarily believe it because there is no proof). I do however disagree with the concept of hell. I will share some scriptures about it if you like.

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I agree, it doesn't make sense that a loving God would create people he knew he would eventually have to sentence to eternal punishment.

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Rancid wrote:

Quote:
First of all God gave adam all of the trees in the garden except one. It wasn't any special tree, except that it was forbidden of adam and eve to eat from. The reason that God did this was a loving one, not a mean one. God truly loved adam and eve and wanted them to have a chance to choose to love Him back. If God were to force adam to love Him, that is not real love. God gave adam the choice to obey Him or not, by putting the tree there.

The tree was a test of Adam and Eve's love for God - ok.

Quote:
Adam failed the test because the sepent tricked eve and eve gave to adam. By disobeying God, Adam's children were doomed to also disobey God. God loved them so much that He sent His Son Jesus Christ to live a perfect life and take their punishment for the sins that they committed against God.

Jesus did not take their punishment, are Adam and eve not in hell right now? Besides, Jesus only went to hell for 3 days which is far less than eternity.

Quote:
All we have to do is accept what Jesus Christ did on the cross for our sins to get to heaven, otherwise we have to pay for our own sins. God is a God of love, but He is also a God of perfect justice.

I would rather endure crucifiction for myself and go to hell for 3 days, then get ressurected to heaven. I dont want anyone paying for my sins.

Quote:
In God's eyes, anything that is less than perfect is corrupt and cannot exist with God, therefore they must go to hell.

Romans 6:23 - "For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." If you're in hell forever, do you not still have eternal life (albeit a painful one)? God told Adam and Eve "in the day you eat from the tree of knowledge of Good and Bad, you shall surely die." He didn't mention anything about eternal torment...

Quote:
You are looking at this the wrong way. What you said is like a parent telling his kids not to do drugs because they will harm them and then you come along a say "They are just being mean to you because the drugs will make you feel good" The drugs may make you feel good but they will also destroy your life. The same thing with the fruit that adam and eve ate. You can clearly look around you and see the corruption that came from them disobeying God. Pain, suffering, children dying, ect. All is the result of sin.

I dont approve of giving drugs to children. From what you're saying its like God placed drugs in front of Adam and Eve and said "you can eat anything except these drugs". They disobeyed him one time and cursed the entire human race... a tad harsh, especially considering it was the serpent who orchistrated it.

Quote:
As far as what did adam and eve eat before they sinned. They ate plants and fruit and vegetables. They did not eat meat at that time.

Only after the flood people started eating animals.

I dont disagree with scripture, I respect it (but dont necessarily believe it because there is no proof). I do however disagree with the concept of hell. I will share some scriptures about it if you like.

Jesus Christ rose from the dead after 3 days because He is God and is powerful enough to do so. You or no other person have the power to do so. Also, it is the blood of Jesus Christ that pays for our sins, because He lived a perfect life on earth. Everyone else is a sinner and cannot pay for their own sins. The scriptures clearly talk about hell. To deny hell exists is to say that the bible is wrong. I don't believe that the bible is wrong.

Re 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Re 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Re 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
(KJV)

There are many more verses on hell.

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And many posts on A2K that just RESEMBLE hell.

I wonder how they've had to change some of the rules in Hell to cope with stuff like spamming and phishing and corporate crime.

Heavy metal music fan? In the pit of sludge up to your nose.

Talking on your cell phone at the top of your voice? A white-hot poker up the rectum.

Overuse of the 'quotes' feature on forums? Hmmmmmmmmm.....

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...

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Get on the bus marked up. It would appear that there is always someone who believes this forum is a good place too proselytize. Well any port in a storm I guess.

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Re: How to get to heaven when you die

XFRODOBAGGINSX wrote:

ARE YOU 100% SURE THAT IF YOU DIED TODAY THAT YOU WOULD GO TO HEAVEN?

1. REALIZE THAT YOU ARE A SINNER AND IN NEED OF A SAVIOR:

Ro 3:23 "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"

Ro 3:10 "As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:"

This all began with the story of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden. God created them perfect, there was no death or sorrow. God told them not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. They disobeyed God and as a result, sin entered into the world. The pain which this world sees is the result of sin.

2. BECAUSE OF OUR SINS, WE DIE BOTH SPIRITUALLY AND PHYSICALLY, BUT GOD SENT HIS SON TO TAKE OUR PUNISHMENT AND GIVE US A CHANCE NOT TO HAVE TO GO TO HELL.

Ro 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."

Ro 5:8 "But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us."

Every person who has ever lived is a sinner and is not righteous because we do bad things. A sin is a crime against God, just as if you steal something at the store, it is punishable by going to jail. It's the same thing with sin. Even if we lie one time, the punishment is hell, which is a prison for those who commit crimes against God. No matter how well you live your life from then on, you have already committed a sin which will be punished if you are not pardoned. If you commit a crime, and then live as a good citizen you still will go to jail for the crime you committed. Right? Just as the president can pardon a crime so you won't go to jail, Jesus can pardon your sins so that you do not go to hell, and can go to heaven when you die.

3. WE MUST CONFESS JESUS CHRIST AS OUR SAVIOR WITH OUR MOUTHS AND BELIEVE IN OUR HEARTS THAT HE ROSE FROM THE DEAD, BY DOING THIS WE ARE RECEIVING HIM:

Ro 10:9,10 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation."

Joh 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: {power: or, the right, or, privilege}
(KJV)

You cannot get to heaven by being a good person, going to church, baptism or any other way other than by turning to Jesus and asking Him to Save you. While these are good things to do, some people believe that they will get to heaven if they do these things, but the bible says that there is only one way to heaven and that is through receiving what Jesus Christ did on the cross for you.

Will you do that today? If you will, you can be 100% sure that you will go to heaven when you die.

DO YOU BELIEVE THAT JESUS CHRIST DIED ON THE CROSS AND ROSE FROM THE DEAD FOR YOUR SINS? DO YOU ACCEPT WHAT HE DID FOR YOU TO PAY FOR YOUR SINS?

4. If you are willing to receive Jesus Christ as your Savior please pray this from your heart to God,

"Dear LORD JESUS, I believe that YOU died on the Cross and Rose from the dead for my sins. I realize that I cannot get to heaven any other way other than to trust YOU as my SAVIOR. I ask you to forgive me for my sins and take me to heaven when I die. I receive YOU as my Lord and SAVIOR. Thank You for Saving me in JESUS name amen"

If you prayed that prayer from your heart to God, and meant it with all of your heart, you are now a child of God and will go to heaven when you die.

Now that you are on your way to heaven, you should attend a bible believing church and follow in baptism.

Mom, is that you? I told you you need to take those pills the doctor gave you every day...not just when you feel like it!

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Re: BBB

BumbleBeeBoogie wrote:

I finally have proof that Heaven does not exist.

I requested driving directions to Heaven on both Yahoo maps and Mapquest. Both indicate they cannot find any address for heaven.

BBB

Good news BBB, you must have just misspelled something

1: Start out going EAST on US-60 toward CR-B092. 22.6 miles Map

2: Turn SLIGHT RIGHT onto US-285 S/US-60 E/SHEURICH ST. Continue to follow US-285 S/US-60 E. 18.1 miles Map

3: Turn LEFT onto US-60/US-54. Continue to follow US-54 E. 37.8 miles Map

4: Turn SLIGHT RIGHT onto I-40 BL E/US-54 E/PARKER AVE. Continue to follow I-40 BL E/US-54 E. 1.2 miles Map

5: Merge onto I-40 E. 413.8 miles Map

6: Take the exit toward JOHN KILPATRICK TURNPIKE. 0.6 miles Map

7: Take the KILPATRICK TURNPIKE EAST exit- EXIT 139. 0.4 miles Map

8: Merge onto JOHN KILPATRICK TURNPIKE (Portions toll). 24.5 miles Map

9: Stay STRAIGHT to go onto TURNER TURNPIKE (Portions toll). 16.9 miles Map

10: TURNER TURNPIKE becomes I-44 E (Portions toll). 467.9 miles Map

11: Take the I-55 N exit- EXIT 290A- on the LEFT toward I-70 EAST/ILLINOIS. <0.1 miles Map

12: Merge onto I-55 N via EXIT 290B toward I-70 EAST/ILLINOIS. 20.6 miles Map

13: Merge onto I-70 E toward INDIANAPOLIS. 214.0 miles Map

14: Merge onto I-465 S via EXIT 73A. 18.4 miles Map

15: Merge onto I-70 E via EXIT 44B toward COLUMBUS OH.. 159.8 miles Map

16: Merge onto I-270 N via EXIT 93B toward CLEVELAND. 17.5 miles Map

17: Merge onto I-71 N via EXIT 26B toward CLEVELAND. 101.5 miles Map

18: Merge onto I-271 N via EXIT 220 toward ERIE PA. 40.4 miles Map

19: I-271 N becomes I-90 E (Portions toll). 448.2 miles Map

20: Take NEW YORK STATE TRWY S/I-87 S toward NEW YORK (Portions toll). 14.5 miles Map

21: Take EXIT 21A toward I-90 E/MASS TPKE/BOSTON. 0.9 miles Map

22: Merge onto NEW YORK STATE TRWY E (Portions toll). 24.1 miles Map

23: NEW YORK STATE TRWY E becomes I-90 E/MASS PIKE/MASSACHUSETTS TURNPIKE (Portions toll). 105.9 miles Map

24: Merge onto I-495 S via EXIT 11A toward MILFORD/CAPE COD. 38.6 miles Map

25: Merge onto MA-24 S via EXIT 7B toward FALL RIVER. 6.0 miles Map

26: Merge onto MA-140 S via EXIT 12 toward LAKEVILLE/NEW BEDFORD. 6.8 miles Map

27: Take the COUNTY RD exit- EXIT 9- toward LAKEVILLE. 0.2 miles Map

28: Take the COUNTY RD/LONG POND ramp. <0.1 miles Map

29: Turn LEFT onto COUNTY RD. 1.4 miles Map

30: Turn LEFT onto GERARD AVE. 0.1 miles Map

31: End at Heaven Heights, MA US Map

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Kicky
Make sure the pills are antibiotics to fight the infection of religion.

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Frodo wrote:

God is perfect and demands perfection. God made a perfect man and woman, they were sinless. They had an opportunity to sin by eating the fruit in the garden of eden and they ate it, dooming themselves and all of their children.

Before they ate the fruit, they had no knowledge of good and evil. How could they be blamed for their actions when they could not have known that it was "sinful" to eat the fruit?

BTW, according to Genesis, God told Adam that the day that he ate from the tree, he would surely die. The serpent told Eve that they would not die, but their eyes would be opened. They ate, they did not die, and their eyes were opened.

Who told them the truth, God or the serpent? Who lied?

Why do you suppose that God wanted them to remain ignorant of morality?

Why do you suppose that he gave them a test that he knew (given that he is omniscient) they must fail?

How is it fair to punish billions of people for the alleged sins of 2, when we had no control over their actions?

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Frodo wrote:

You and I are their children. We sin because we took on that sin nature of our parents.

That's not what God said to Ezekiel:

Quote:

Ezekiel 18:1-4 The word of the Lord came to me: "What do you people mean by quoting this proverb about the land of Israel: `The fathers eat sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge'? As surely as I live, declares the sovereign Lord, you will no longer quote this proverb in Israel. For every living soul belongs to me, the father as well as the son - both alike belong to me. The soul who sins is the one who will die.

18:19-23 "Yet you ask, `Why does the son not share the guilt of his father?' Since the son has does what is just and right and has been careful to keep all my decrees, he will surely live. The soul who sins is the one who will die. The son will not share the guilt of the father, nor will the father share the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous man will be credited to him, and the wickedness of the wicked man will be charged against him.

But if a wicked man turns away from all the sins he committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, he will surely live. None of the offenses he has committed will be remembered against him. Because of the righteous things he has done, he will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? Declares the sovereign Lord. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?

Do you think God lied to his prophet Ezekiel?

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Frodo wrote:

we are all sinners and deserve prison or hell, we cannot save ourselves.

Do you think that babies are sinners and deserve prison or hell? Millions of children die before age 5, far too young to understand the gospel and make a choice, even if they hear it which is very unlikely if they are born in a non-Christian country.

Do you think that God sends them all to hell?

Frodo wrote:

I just want to give people the opportunity to accept Him. It is a free choice. Those who do not accept Him, will have to pay their own punishment, which is hell.

People who suffer from mental illness or defective minds cannot make free choices. People who are brain-washed from birth into accepting their parents' beliefs cannot make free choices. People who are cursed with logical minds cannot make the choice to believe the contradictory tenets and outright lies of Christianity without giving up their sanity. Billions of human beings who died before Jesus was born cannot choose to accept him.

Do you think that God sends them all to hell, or does he make exceptions?

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Frodo wrote:

Also, it is the blood of Jesus Christ that pays for our sins, because He lived a perfect life on earth. Everyone else is a sinner and cannot pay for their own sins. The scriptures clearly talk about hell. To deny hell exists is to say that the bible is wrong. I don't believe that the bible is wrong.

Jesus did not live a perfect life. According to the Bible, he broke several commandments and was called a glutton and drunkard. He taught others that God's Laws were not set in stone but could be violated with impunity (for instance the woman caught in adultery). The Christian Church is based on the teachings of Paul, who claimed (untruthfully) that Jesus had abolished the Law.

Believe it or not, many Christians today actually eat ham on Easter in spite of God's known aversion to pork. Even touching a pig makes you unclean in his eyes. Such acts of defiance of God's Will must surely bring retribution down on this country!

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Frodo wrote:

As far as what did adam and eve eat before they sinned. They ate plants and fruit and vegetables. They did not eat meat at that time.

Mankind has been eating meat for millions of years. The story of Adam and Eve is a Jewish creation myth. It is not literally true.

One final but very important question for you, Frodo:

According to the Bible, the Jews are God's Chosen people and still live by the covenant he made with them thousands of years ago. God told them not to believe anyone who called himself a prophet if he advocated breaking God's laws. False prophets were to be killed. God never told them or his priests that he was sending his son to them to break the old covenant, so of course they did not believe a self-styled messiah who said that God had changed his mind and that now they would have to go through him to get to heaven.

Do you think that the 6 million Jews who were starved, tortured and killed in the Holocaust because of their faith in God's Word are now in hell?

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Jesus did not live a perfect life. According to the Bible, he broke several commandments and was called a glutton and drunkard. He taught others that God's Laws were not set in stone but could be violated with impunity (for instance the woman caught in adultery). The Christian Church is based on the teachings of Paul, who claimed (untruthfully) that Jesus had abolished the Law.

Jesus DID live a perfect life. He was wrongly accused of those things if you would actually read the bible for yourself. Since Jesus Christ was God in the flesh, He had every right and the authority to abolish the Law. He fulfilled the law. The Christian church is based on the teachings of Jesus Christ, not paul. Paul, Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Titus, Philemon, James, Peter, all wrote down what God told them to write. Jesus Christ was prophesied in the old testiment and fulfilled every prophetic prophecy in the old testiment. The old testiment predicted that He would come and be rejected and many more things that He fulfilled to the letter. He IS God and He proved it when He died on the cross and rose from the dead.

Believe it or not, many Christians today actually eat ham on Easter in spite of God's known aversion to pork. Even touching a pig makes you unclean in his eyes. Such acts of defiance of God's Will must surely bring retribution down on this country!

Of course they eat pork since the scrpture clearly says that we can eat whatever we want. It is NOT an act of defiance.

1Ti 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.
1Ti 4:4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:
(KJV)

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Frodo, I have read the Bible. I recommend that you do the same, and you will see that the propaganda that you regurgitated is not what the Bible actually says.

Typically, you ignored the questions I asked you. Please take a look at them and give me your best guess if you cannot answer them.

----

If you think that Jesus was wrongly accused, please quote the Bible passages that refute the following:

Thou shalt have no gods before me. Jesus put himself before God when he said, "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father but by me" (John 14:6).

Remember the sabbath day to keep it holy. Jesus and his disciples plucked and ate corn on the sabbath and Jesus said, "The sabbath was made for men and not men for the sabbath" (Mark 2:23-28). They also ate with unwashed hands. (Mark 7:1-4)

Honor your father and mother. Jesus scorned and publicly humiliated his mother. (Mark 3:31-34, Luke 8:19-21, Luke 11:27-28, John 2:3-4) Jesus said, "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters, -- yes, even his own life -- he cannot be my disciple." (Luke 14:26) The Bible does not report a single instance where Jesus did or said anything to honor either his earthly father or his mother.

Thou shalt not bear false witness. Jesus said he wasn't going to a feast and then as soon as the others left, he went to the feast in secret. (John 7:8-10) Jesus promised to return within the lifetime of his disciples but never did, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with power." (Mark 9:1)

Thou shalt not commit adultery. The OT required that anyone guilty of adultery be stoned to death, but when a woman caught in adultery was brought to Jesus, he enabled her to escape lawful punishment (John 8:3-11).

The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and you say, `here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and "sinners."' (Luke 7:34)

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Frodo, please note that much of the New Testament consists of letters purportedly written by Paul (the titles of these books refer to the recipients of the letters, not the author). In many cases, they directly contradict things that Jesus taught:

Quote:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of the pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven. (Matthew 5:17-20)

But the Gentiles were understandably resistant to following Jewish Law, particularly circumcision and dietary laws (which were extremely important to the God of the OT), so Paul arbitrarily abolished the Law in order to gain converts. "Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law." (Galatians 3:25) "For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations." (Ephesians 2:15)

The church has generally followed the teachings of Paul which allows it to pick and chose which laws to enforce and which to ignore. For instance, the Catholic Church deleted the commandment regarding idols and graven images. Paul said that women could not teach men or speak in church; that prohibition never came from Jesus. Jesus focused on Jews but Paul found that Gentiles were easier to convert.

Look up the passages for yourself. Who do you think was telling the truth, Jesus or Paul?

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