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Do we owe Muslims another apology?

 
 
Reply Mon 7 May, 2018 02:08 pm
Do we owe Muslims another apology?

This link says yes.
http://bigthink.com/videos/maajid-nawaz-on-islamic-reform

This link says no.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQcSvBsU-FM

To those who think we should try to separate the good Muslims from the bad Muslims.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drJCC2XXMBo

I do not think it is to the non-Muslim world to apologise to Muslims for the criticism we do of their un-civilized ideology.

Should we stop judging and criticizing those institutions of religion that are leading us away from a more civilized state?

1 Thessalonians 5:21 Test all things; hold fast what is good.

Have you tested the ideology of Islam? Is it good to you?

Proverbs 3:12 For whom the Lord loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.

Is correcting and criticizing Islam the loving or the hateful thing to do?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMJATBMebj8

Regards
DL
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Type: Question • Score: 0 • Views: 1,081 • Replies: 47

 
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 7 May, 2018 05:17 pm
@Greatest I am,
Quote:
Do we owe Muslims another apology?

No. We never owed them the first one.
Below viewing threshold (view)
coldjoint
 
  0  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2018 09:56 pm
Islam owes the world an explanation of why they feel they should kill, lie, rape, subvert, and hate anything non-Islamic besides their religion telling them to.

It would be nice to know what else entitles them to do these things. And why their way of life must be inflicted on others by any means necessary. Since there are no answers forthcoming why aren't we treating Islam like Christianity, or heaven forbid, the Jews. Shun them, and insult them too.

Why is it acceptable in Western society to say nothing about an obvious serious problem? Is it the violence? Yes, it is. Is it the money, yes it is. Or is it the emasculated leadership that arrests critics and allows Islamic countries tell us about human rights.

But back to religion, why is Islam allowed their fantasy? Christians are told there is no God. Do we ever tell Muslims there is no Allah? No, we don't. Why?
coldjoint
 
  -3  
Reply Sat 19 May, 2018 01:35 pm
Amazing how little people have to say about Islam. Could someone tell me one thing positive non-Muslims get by welcoming Islam into their midst?
coldjoint
 
  -3  
Reply Sun 20 May, 2018 09:46 pm
Quote:
We don’t expect ideas to matter — or, when they do, we expect them to matter only because people have been flipped into a vulnerable mode by repression or poverty. Thus all our divagation about the “root causes” of Islamic terrorism, as if the terrorists’ very clear and very ideological account of their own theory and motivations is somehow not to be believed.


Interesting article.
http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=260

0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  5  
Reply Mon 21 May, 2018 08:35 am
@coldjoint,
Islamic world contributions to Medieval Europe
coldjoint
 
  -2  
Reply Mon 21 May, 2018 09:21 am
@nimh,
Quote:
Islamic world contributions to Medieval Europe

Revisionist bullshit. Islam caused the Dark Ages.
Quote:
Islam caused the Dark Ages

Quote:
It seems possible to me that the only religious beliefs holding back Europe during the Dark Age were that of Islam. Because of the Islamic empire, Christendom was frequently defending itself against Mohammedan invaders, and losing territory and trade routes.

Maybe someone could have said that Islam was the superior religion in 900 AD, as it was gaining power and territory and Christendom was losing. That would be about like saying in the 1930s that Communism was superior to Capitalism. Maybe it looked that way to a superficial observer. But nobody could say anything so ridiculous now.

http://blog.singularvalues.com/2015/11/islam-caused-dark-ages.html
Love2Love
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 09:51 pm
Currently taking bets that pink-font and OP are the same person.
coldjoint
 
  -4  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 10:29 pm
@Love2Love,
Quote:
pink-font and OP are the same person.


It is magenta. I'll take that bet.

Anything to say about Islam?
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 08:50 am
@coldjoint,
coldjoint wrote:

Quote:
Do we owe Muslims another apology?

No. We never owed them the first one.


I agree.

Regards
DL
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 08:51 am
@coldjoint,
coldjoint wrote:

Does not look like anyone wants to discuss Islam, I wonder why.


P. C. and a fear of telling the truth of their vile ideology.

We have been well conditioned to respect what does not deserve respect.

Regards
DL
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 08:55 am
@coldjoint,
coldjoint wrote:

Islam owes the world an explanation of why they feel they should kill, lie, rape, subvert, and hate anything non-Islamic besides their religion telling them to.

It would be nice to know what else entitles them to do these things. And why their way of life must be inflicted on others by any means necessary. Since there are no answers forthcoming why aren't we treating Islam like Christianity, or heaven forbid, the Jews. Shun them, and insult them too.

Why is it acceptable in Western society to say nothing about an obvious serious problem? Is it the violence? Yes, it is. Is it the money, yes it is. Or is it the emasculated leadership that arrests critics and allows Islamic countries tell us about human rights.

But back to religion, why is Islam allowed their fantasy? Christians are told there is no God. Do we ever tell Muslims there is no Allah? No, we don't. Why?



What you ask mimics many right wingers who asked the same questions and since the left was not doing that asking, we earned Trump.

It seems our left did not notice the many other E.U. and free countries voting right wing so that the foul religions can be criticized.

Regards
DL
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 09:40 am
Quote:
It seems our left did not notice the many other E.U. and free countries voting right wing so that the foul religions can be criticized.

Eastern European countries have made it quite clear how they feel about Islam and how it devours cultures by refusing to assimilate and using the host countries laws against them.

The damage Islam has done and continues to do is so patently obvious the denial from the EU would be comical if it was not so sad.
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 09:46 am
https://creepingsharia.files.wordpress.com/2014/12/b5a1a8fiuaes1bb.jpg?w=676&h=447
https://creepingsharia.wordpress.com/2018/07/21/arabian-nightmare-west/
0 Replies
 
coluber2001
 
  3  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 04:28 pm
Quote:
Revisionist bullshit. Islam caused the Dark Ages.
Quote:
Islam caused the Dark Ages

Quote:
It seems possible to me that the only religious beliefs holding back Europe during the Dark Age were that of Islam. Because of the Islamic empire, Christendom was frequently defending itself against Mohammedan invaders, and losing territory and trade routes.

Maybe someone could have said that Islam was the superior religion in 900 AD, as it was gaining power and territory and Christendom was losing. That would be about like saying in the 1930s that Communism was superior to Capitalism. Maybe it looked that way to a superficial observer. But nobody could say anything so ridiculous now.


The Dark Ages was a time that lost aconnection with the vast ancient Greek knowledge that had been acquired.

The Christian Credo of the Dark Ages was: knowledge comes from belief. If you wanted to study or know anything you would have to study the Bible, because that contained all knowledge.

In 1085 AD the Muslim city of Cordova was overrun by Christians. The library of Cordoba had more books in it then the entire country of France, and the Muslims had preserved the ancient Greek knowledge. Scholars from all over Europe flocked to Cordova to study these texts. It took about three hundred years for the beginning of the Italian Renaissance and the transforming of the old Christian Credo from knowledge comes from belief into: belief comes from knowledge. Thus, we can thank the Muslims for preserving that ancient Greek knowledge that led to the Renaissance.
coldjoint
 
  -4  
Reply Sat 21 Jul, 2018 04:45 pm
@coluber2001,
Quote:
Thus, we can thank the Muslims for preserving that ancient Greek knowledge that led to the Renaissance.

No, we can thanks the converts to Islam that still valued that knowledge. They converted so they would not be oppressed or killed.
0 Replies
 
vikorr
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Jul, 2018 01:36 am
@Greatest I am,
In relation to the original post - our OP obviously didn't watch the video properly. Maajid Nawaz is one of the most progressive muslims you'll find. He wasn't at all suggesting an apology.

He was saying that applying lower standards to different cultures actually holds back the development of other cultures, and helps entrench the worst parts of them. And if you read between the lines...the inference is that holding other cultures to lower standards helps extremist views within those cultures.

Nawaz by the way, is head of an anti-extremist (of all sorts) organisation. He has a very interesting book call The Radical. A friend of his, Ed Husain wrote just as interesting book called The Islamist. Both are the stories of their radicalisation, and deradicalisation. The interesting thing about reading both books, is not just their individual reasons for radicalisation, but that they both took different paths to radicalisation. And they leave it fairly clear that there are also other paths to radicalisation.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Mon 23 Jul, 2018 01:59 am
@Greatest I am,
Greatest I am wrote:

coldjoint wrote:

Islam owes the world an explanation of why they feel they should kill, lie, rape, subvert, and hate anything non-Islamic besides their religion telling them to.

It would be nice to know what else entitles them to do these things. And why their way of life must be inflicted on others by any means necessary. Since there are no answers forthcoming why aren't we treating Islam like Christianity, or heaven forbid, the Jews. Shun them, and insult them too.

Why is it acceptable in Western society to say nothing about an obvious serious problem? Is it the violence? Yes, it is. Is it the money, yes it is. Or is it the emasculated leadership that arrests critics and allows Islamic countries tell us about human rights.

But back to religion, why is Islam allowed their fantasy? Christians are told there is no God. Do we ever tell Muslims there is no Allah? No, we don't. Why?



What you ask mimics many right wingers who asked the same questions and since the left was not doing that asking, we earned Trump.

It seems our left did not notice the many other E.U. and free countries voting right wing so that the foul religions can be criticized.

Regards
DL


LOL so roughly one third of the human race need to be hold accountable for the actions of their fringe groups?

Somehow I do not think that you would care to have the same standard apply to Christianity now or in it history.

So you are willing to bear the shame for the torture and the murders and the child rapes that had been done either in the name of Jesus or make possible by the cover the Christian churches had provided?
coldjoint
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 23 Jul, 2018 08:07 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
Somehow I do not think that you would care to have the same standard apply to Christianity now or in it history.

I sure would. Who are being killed by organized Christian terrorists today, or yesterday, last week, last month?
Below is a month of what Islam inspires and obligates as it was designed to do. They are 1/4 of the worlds population and they are being taught to hate.



Quote:
Jihad Report
Jul 14, 2018 -
Jul 20, 2018
Attacks 38

Killed 280
Injured 257
Suicide Blasts 4
Countries 12

https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
 

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