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Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

 
 
miniTAX
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 04:19 am
Other news from carbon-Gore
We already knew Bushe's texas ranch is relatively ecological (rainwater collecting, cheap & local construction material, solar energy). Now, we know Barton's electricity bill is ridiculous compared to Gore's.
Next time someone wants to lecture you in saving the world, ask him his electricity bill. Such a good BS sensor Wink

Quote:


http://libertas.bigblog.com.au/data/0/3861/image/goreworl2122920070418150131.jpg
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 04:51 am
The pretty graph above is a contemporary part of a long-running ad hominem marketing/PR/propaganda (all apply, take your pick) strategy to dissuade the public from granting credence to those who argued that global warming is real, (and, next) that it is being caused by human activities, (then) that it is in any sense critically important, (and now) that we will hurt ourselves less if we move to ameliorate its causes than if we do nothing. It's a trajectory which really is entirely predictable given the enormous financial, political and media interests at risk (so they consider) from alterations in the status quo.

But the shift in the public's view has happened anyway. Imagine you are a Frenchman living in Amien in 1790 and how you begin slowly to understand that the fairly wealthy family who've made their fortune from the manufacture of powdered wigs just might not be an unbiased or selfless fount of truth on the subject of the swell benefits that the aristocracy provides to all.
Quote:
A third of Americans say global warming ranks as the world's single largest environmental problem, double the number who gave it top ranking last year, a nationwide poll shows.

In the new poll, conducted jointly by The Washington Post, ABC News and Stanford University, most of those surveyed said that climate change is real and that they want the federal government to do more about it. But the survey also shows there is little public agreement about the policies the United States should adopt to address it.

The findings come weeks after the Supreme Court ruled that the federal government has the right to regulate carbon dioxide, the largest contributor to human-caused warming. Congress is pressing to enact limits on all greenhouse-gas emissions linked to climate change, but it remains unclear how soon the House or the Senate could pass such legislation.

According to the poll, seven in 10 Americans want more federal action on global warming, and about half of those surveyed think the government should do "much more" than it is doing now.

By a 40-point margin, the public trusts congressional Democrats more than it trusts President Bush to handle global warming. More than nine in 10 Democrats in the poll said they trusted their party's leaders over Bush on the issue, as did 54 percent of independents and one in five Republicans.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/19/AR2007041902527.html?hpid=moreheadlines
0 Replies
 
miniTAX
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 06:59 am
blatham wrote:
The pretty graph above is a contemporary part of a long-running ad hominem marketing/PR/propaganda (all apply, take your pick) strategy to dissuade the public from granting credence to those who argued that global warming is real, (and, next) that it is being caused by human activities, (then) that it is in any sense critically important, (and now) that we will hurt ourselves less if we move to ameliorate its causes than if we do nothing. It's a trajectory which really is entirely predictable given the enormous financial, political and media interests at risk (so they consider) from alterations in the status quo.

The story of big business conspiration is ridiculous. The nuclear industry, the insurance industry, Enron (who hoped to make big bucks with carbon trading and lobbied for Kyoto), the Gore's carbon offset companies, the gaz based electricity utilities who want to evict their coal counterparts ... are all big business that have enormous interest in pushing the cause of the AGW theory.

What the graph showed is just that Gore uses 20x more energy of the average John Doe. The rest is interpreted up to your imagination (or fantasy or paranoid tendency, take your pick). If Gore, who preaches conservation while wasting a stupidly HUUUUGE amount of energy, why should others believe him? Why should they conserve ? Would you trust a priest who preaches fidelity & abstinence while he is sleeping around with all women of the neighbourhood who want to ? Come on Blatham!

If Gore claims urgency to save the planet while he is consuming like crazy, it's just that he doesn't believe a single second it's urgent. That's logic, mathematic, automatic. Nothing can't be clearer. If you can believe otherwise, you'll believe in anything.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:11 am
miniTAX wrote:

What the graph showed is just that Gore uses 20x more energy of the average John Doe. The rest is interpreted up to your imagination (or fantasy or paranoid tendency, take your pick). If Gore, who preaches conservation while wasting a stupidly HUUUUGE amount of energy, why should others believe him? Why should they conserve ? Would you trust a priest who preaches fidelity & abstinence while he is sleeping around with all women of the neighbourhood who want to ? Come on Blatham!



You can't compare Gore to Steve at the 7/11. I bet you every congressman wastes stupidly HUUUUGE amounts of energy.

Compare Gore to other congressmen who run their businesses out of their homes.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:12 am
Quote:
Nothing can't be clearer.


This reads rather more humorously than you might imagine. But let me add that all I can muster up in French is an order for coca-cola or a request for directions to the youth hostel.

I'm not going to bother arguing about Enron (oil, petrochemicals, plastics) or the insurance companies benefiting more from global warming news than the absence of it because I can't find any sense at all in such an argument.

As regards Gore, as you note, the function of such a graph or discussion on Gore's energy use at home IS to strike a blow at his credibility - that is, to encourage the public to disbelieve or discredit anything he might say about the science or facts about global warming because he wastes energy himself at his house. Folks who advance this ad hominem would be, to make the point a little sharper, quite happy to discover it if Gore was a pederast. Boy! Then no one would listen to him!

There's no logical relationship between pederastry or his home energy usage and what he describes as the 'facts' of global warming and its cause.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:14 am
What makes me wonder since months: we do most here just and only focus on Gore?
He still is a citizen in a country which is miles away from being average in what is done in other countries.

So, why not picking out someone who really represents an eco-friendly energy policiy from a different country?

Nelly Olin could it be for miniTAX, for instance she's the French environmental minister and a member of the conservative Union pour un Mouvement Populaire (UMP).
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:16 am
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:29 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
What makes me wonder since months: we do most here just and only focus on Gore?
He still is a citizen in a country which is miles away from being average in what is done in other countries.

So, why not picking out someone who really represents an eco-friendly energy policiy from a different country?

Nelly Olin could it be for miniTAX, for instance she's the French environmental minister and a member of the conservative Union pour un Mouvement Populaire (UMP).


That's a good point walter. I suppose it is simply because this is mainly an America-centric group here and because modern american culture is rather celebrity-obsessed and because politics here is so frequently marked by the ad hominem.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:34 am
I don't know who exactly you mean by "you guys".

I never thought that ONE single representative or former representative or Oscar-winning person speaks for those who want to minimise climate change and stop distroying the world to give future generations a change to still live here.

There are certainly more and better persons and groups for that than Gore.

Since I thought that this thread is not only about the USA - though I can be mistaken - I will keep quiet now.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:35 am
Gore is the one pushing a movie full of bad science on kids and presenting himself as the one who presumes to save the world from a terrible fate. He's fair game for plenty of criticism.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 09:02 am
If someone is not willing to walk the talk, then they should shutup. Pretty simple point.
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Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 09:10 am
I am hearing a lot of petty and foolish things. Assuming for the sake of argument that Gore is personally a hypocrite regarding his home, that does not begin to make his environmental message false. It is supported by the vast majority of respected climate scientists.

I guess we will next hear that an Edwards's administration would be extravagant because Edwards sometimes get $400 haircuts.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 11:03 am
You hit on a point, because I would not elect a man that gets $400 haircuts, at least when he charges it illegally to his campaign. It sort of reveals a very vain personality, does it not? Is that the kind of guy you want for president?

Of course, I could be out of it as an okie. Maybe everybody in Washington goes to a hairstylist that charge exorbitant fees, and they all know the public expects perfect looks on tv.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 11:51 am
I hope everyone in this country is as petty as you. I am more concerned about his past votes, his positions, his smarts, etc. I could care less about haircuts, and whether it is a campaign expense.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 01:59 pm
Advocate wrote:
I hope everyone in this country is as petty as you. I am more concerned about his past votes, his positions, his smarts, etc. I could care less about haircuts, and whether it is a campaign expense.
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 02:39 pm
heya foxy, hope yer doin' well!

maybe this will quell the stormy seas of gore-gate... Laughing
-------

Quote:
Al Gore gets approval to install solar panels at his Tenn. home
By Associated Press.
Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - Updated: 01:37 PM EST

NASHVILLE, Tenn. - Former Vice President Al Gore's upscale neighborhood granted the environmental activist approval Tuesday to install 33 solar panels on the roof of his mansion.
Belle Meade had blocked his application until new rules were approved unanimously late Tuesday, said Gore spokesman Chris Song. The city located within metropolitan Nashville said the panels must be placed in areas where they can't be seen by neighbors.
Gore, who starred in the documentary film "An Inconvenient Truth" about global warming, already buys enough energy from renewable energy sources such as solar, wind and methane gas to balance 100 percent of his electricity costs.
He is also upgrading the furnace, windows, and light switches, as well as installing new floor radiant heat and solar vents, to improve the home's energy standards, said Kalee Kreider, a Gore spokeswoman.
The home bought by Gore in 2002 is more than 70 years old and illustrates the challenges of renovating an older home to conserve more energy, Kreider said.
"It's obviously easier to build a green home from the get-go," she said. "When you purchase an older home, these retrofits take lot longer."
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 02:54 pm
and maybe Haircut-Gate...

Stitch in time produces new classic
Chicago Sun Times May 6, 2001 by Lisa Lenoir


Quote:
President George W. Bush steps into the spotlight looking like a man fresh off the pages of GQ magazine. His black cashmere overcoat delicately drapes his shoulders, the blue stripe tie radiates against his white shirt and the suit perfectly fits his fit form. .....But Bush's past style lapses are forgivable because, since his inauguration he's been wearing some of the best tailored garments --Oxxford suits.

...When brothers Louis and Jacob Weinberg founded the company in 1916, they were determined to make the best suit. They used the finest fabrics and designed only simple, timeless shapes. This guiding principle ensures Oxxford continues to create top-notch garments for a price --$2,000 to $14,000 --that loyal customers are willing to pay. Oxxford produced 25,000 handmade garments and had $30 million in sales last year, according to Roger Parfitt, the company's chief operating officer.

...Rocco Giovannangelo, 61, the company's master tailor, flew to Austin for President Bush's fittings. A tailor since he was a 10-year-old in Italy, he knows the importance of being well-dressed. "You can make an impression on society if you decide to dress well," he says.


oxxfordclothes.com/suntimes.asp


when you consider things such as security, availability, housecalls and mistake free work, $400.00 bucks isn't all that much.

i mean really, whaddya guys want? he should go to floyd's barber shop?

jeezz.. please tell me y'all have more on these guys than this piddley nonsense... Laughing
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 03:50 pm
DontTreadOnMe wrote:
heya foxy, hope yer doin' well!

maybe this will quell the stormy seas of gore-gate... Laughing
-------

Quote:
Al Gore gets approval to install solar panels at his Tenn. home
By Associated Press.
Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - Updated: 01:37 PM EST

NASHVILLE, Tenn. - Former Vice President Al Gore's upscale neighborhood granted the environmental activist approval Tuesday to install 33 solar panels on the roof of his mansion.
Belle Meade had blocked his application until new rules were approved unanimously late Tuesday, said Gore spokesman Chris Song. The city located within metropolitan Nashville said the panels must be placed in areas where they can't be seen by neighbors.
Gore, who starred in the documentary film "An Inconvenient Truth" about global warming, already buys enough energy from renewable energy sources such as solar, wind and methane gas to balance 100 percent of his electricity costs.
He is also upgrading the furnace, windows, and light switches, as well as installing new floor radiant heat and solar vents, to improve the home's energy standards, said Kalee Kreider, a Gore spokeswoman.
The home bought by Gore in 2002 is more than 70 years old and illustrates the challenges of renovating an older home to conserve more energy, Kreider said.
"It's obviously easier to build a green home from the get-go," she said. "When you purchase an older home, these retrofits take lot longer."


Hiya DTOM. You've been scarce lately. Good to see you back. So how's my favorite liberal? Smile

Yes the document you've posted here has been posted or linked I think several times now, and has been mostly discredited. Those carbon credit offsets? Mostly to his own companies or to credits that would have gone unused I think--no significant net reduction in energy consumption, if any. Those solar panels? They make a good show but according to our neighbor engineer who works for the city power company here, they will help on sunny days--Tennessee has a lot of cloudy days--but will not serously reduce Gore's other energy consumption.

I'm not knocking using wind and solar and any of the greenhouse reducing means of producing energy and in fact am pretty energy conscious myself more for practical reasons rather than from any altruistic motives. I like the idea of wind generated energy as we almost always have wind. I like the idea of solar because we almost always have sun.

But please don't try to present Al Gore as having any credibility or virtue on this issue. He just doesn't.
0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 05:03 pm
Foxfyre wrote:
Hiya DTOM. You've been scarce lately. Good to see you back. So how's my favorite liberal? Smile


doin' okee-dokee, foxy. still revving up the revolution..i can count on your support, right ? :wink:

Foxfyre wrote:
But please don't try to present Al Gore as having any credibility or virtue on this issue. He just doesn't.


could you post the sources on your gore statements ? curious to read them.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Fri 20 Apr, 2007 07:08 pm
http://www.prospect.org/print/V8/31/gelbspan-r.html

Check the above. The world is not convinced about global warming because of the reports of amateurs. I think there are a couple of old scientists, stuck with their old methodology, who won't accept new findings and methods. The right, of course, seizes on what these guys say.
0 Replies
 
 

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