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Global Warming...New Report...and it ain't happy news

 
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 08:27 am
Do you think it is "mostly pure fiction" Thomas or more of it is based on actual science?

Documentaries are always from the perspective of the film maker. Gore may hype the science but the science is there.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 08:36 am
Although this is not a "film thread" ...

Quote:
Rule Twelve
Special Rules for The Documentary Awards

I. DEFINITION
An eligible documentary film is defined as a theatrically released non-fiction motion picture dealing creatively with cultural, artistic, historical, social, scientific, economic or other subjects. It may be photographed in actual occurrence, or may employ partial re-enactment, stock footage, stills, animation, stop-motion or other techniques, as long as the emphasis is on fact and not on fiction.

II. CATEGORIES
The Documentary Awards are divided into two categories:

1. Documentary Feature - films more than 40 minutes in running time, and

2. Documentary Short Subject - films 40 minutes or less (including all credits) in running time.
... ... ...

This are the 2005' rules, I suppose the experts here (Foxfyre? Thomas? Parados?) might know if they were changed.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 08:37 am
parados wrote:
Do you think it is "mostly pure fiction" Thomas or more of it is based on actual science?

I don't know, because I haven't seen it yet. My first impression, based only on the trailer, is that Gore starts from real science, then hypes up through his choice of examples what the scientific findings mean. But I'll reserve my judgment for when the movie hits Germany's rental video stores.

Anyway, whatever the merits of the science in Gore's movie, I doubt they made much of a difference to those who gave him the Oscar. That's why I brought up Michael Moore.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 09:08 am
parados wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:


I think the amateur skeptics are unlikely to take either GW or AGW seriously until there is more serious integrity in showing the whole picture and not just the convenient parts of it. Giving Al Gore the oscar for best documentary for a film the skeptics have pronounced mostly pure fiction is one example of a lack of integrity in the process.

I find it interesting that you judge Gore's film only by his skeptics.

Perhaps it should be judged based on the actual science which tends to be more accurate than not.


Perhaps you didn't read Michaels' critique of Gore's film that I posted yesterday? Would you like to put your credentials as a judge of scientific material up against his?
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 09:11 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Although this is not a "film thread" ...

Quote:
Rule Twelve
Special Rules for The Documentary Awards

I. DEFINITION
An eligible documentary film is defined as a theatrically released non-fiction motion picture dealing creatively with cultural, artistic, historical, social, scientific, economic or other subjects. It may be photographed in actual occurrence, or may employ partial re-enactment, stock footage, stills, animation, stop-motion or other techniques, as long as the emphasis is on fact and not on fiction.

II. CATEGORIES
The Documentary Awards are divided into two categories:

1. Documentary Feature - films more than 40 minutes in running time, and

2. Documentary Short Subject - films 40 minutes or less (including all credits) in running time.
... ... ...

This are the 2005' rules, I suppose the experts here (Foxfyre? Thomas? Parados?) might know if they were changed.


Perhaps you overlooked the criteria in your own post that a documentary is supposed to be non fiction.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 09:32 am
Foxfyre wrote:

Perhaps you overlooked the criteria in your own post that a documentary is supposed to be non fiction.


How the hell did you come to that idea now?

(Again) To clarify: I only go now and then in a movie. I watch now and then a film on tv.
Sometimes that's a documentary.

I'm totally uninterested in the Oscar award.
(Even now I only looked up from where the ancestory of the German director got their earl's title.)

I have no idea at all who judges the films and how they do it.

I only posted that link plus copied a bit from it.

I read it.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 09:50 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:

Perhaps you overlooked the criteria in your own post that a documentary is supposed to be non fiction.


How the hell did you come to that idea now?

(Again) To clarify: I only go now and then in a movie. I watch now and then a film on tv.
Sometimes that's a documentary.

I'm totally uninterested in the Oscar award.
(Even now I only looked up from where the ancestory of the German director got their earl's title.)

I have no idea at all who judges the films and how they do it.

I only posted that link plus copied a bit from it.

I read it.


My point has been that, according to critics that I trust and admire, Gore's film is mostly fabrication and/or misrepresentatiion and is more fiction than fact. So you then posted your post in what appeared to be a rebuttal. If that was not your intention, I apologize.

And no, the rules have not changed.

The Academy has become so excessively political and entrenched in one ideology that it rewards those who shares its ideology and punishes anything that does not. By its own rules, a documentary is defined as a non fictional theatrical presentation. Therefore, even when a documentary is exposed as misrepresenting, distorting, or fabricating the actual facts to the point that it should be in the dramatization based on (something) category or fiction, they will reward it if it is politically correct and presents the correct ideology. Thus an irresponsible Michael Moore and/or Al Gore are rewarded while something more factual won't even be nominated.

And then they hyporitically protest a film that is billed as fiction but which presents one of their darlings in an unflatteirng manner. They have even gone so far as to demand that such works be edited to be more factual (from their point of view.)

For Al Gore's documentary to have received the Oscar does nothing but increase contempt for the GW point of view and I think actually is a negative factor in bringing us all closer to agreement on what, if anything, should be done about it.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 09:55 am
Might be. I'm - as said - neither a film expert nor do I know anything about the influence of Oscars on education, science etc.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:02 am
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Might be. I'm - as said - neither a film expert nor do I know anything about the influence of Oscars on education, science etc.
I would think all the partying probably has an adverse affect on local climate. Save the planet, shoot a film star.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:05 am
Steve 41oo wrote:
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Might be. I'm - as said - neither a film expert nor do I know anything about the influence of Oscars on education, science etc.
I would think all the partying probably has an adverse affect on local climate. Save the planet, shoot a film star.


Who gets to pick which one?
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:13 am
Foxfyre wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Might be. I'm - as said - neither a film expert nor do I know anything about the influence of Oscars on education, science etc.
I would think all the partying probably has an adverse affect on local climate. Save the planet, shoot a film star.


Who gets to pick which one?
I do. I suggested it, so its me, only. But I'll let you have a go after the first 75. Now where to start....such opportunities... Laughing
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:24 am
Steve 41oo wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
Steve 41oo wrote:
Walter Hinteler wrote:
Might be. I'm - as said - neither a film expert nor do I know anything about the influence of Oscars on education, science etc.
I would think all the partying probably has an adverse affect on local climate. Save the planet, shoot a film star.


Who gets to pick which one?
I do. I suggested it, so its me, only. But I'll let you have a go after the first 75. Now where to start....such opportunities... Laughing


Thank god. I was afraid I would have to actually narrow it down to one and there are so many. . . . Smile
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:28 am
But my choice for Worst Carbon Footprint would go to...


oh I dunno you know more about Hollywood Fox, havent you got connections with a studio? You shoot one.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:38 am
Steve 41oo wrote:
But my choice for Worst Carbon Footprint would go to...


oh I dunno you know more about Hollywood Fox, havent you got connections with a studio? You shoot one.


Steve, I don't fault fishermen and enjoy sharing the fish they catch, but I gave up fishing because I felt sorry for the fish. And the worms. I love well prepared wild game and have no problem with legal hunters, but I hunt only with a camera myself because I can't bear to think I might cause pain or suffering to some creature. And I love movies and have a huge collection of favorite movies that I watch over and over despite having ideological differences with a lot of the actors and actresses.

But given my sensibilities about fishing and hunting, you'll understand if I shy away from your suggestion. In that case I would discourage you even. . . .but oh my, it is a wonderful fantasy.
0 Replies
 
Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:49 am
Well I cant honestly say I have the same sentimental attachment to worms as you do, but inconsideration of the fact that it might be illegal, I'll refrain from shooting any Hollywood star.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 11:57 am
Gore now preaching global warming is now a "moral issue." He must be one of the biggest reprobates and sinners there is, with his jetsetting around the world. Ha Ha, the guy is getting humorous. At least he provides good entertainment. It surely isn't science anymore.

Democrats accuse Republicans of wanting to be in their bedrooms. Well, they want to be in our cars, in our houses, in our pocketbooks most definitely, everywhere. If anyone ever questioned that environmentalism was not a religion, they should be convinced now.
0 Replies
 
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 12:32 pm
Thomas wrote:
georgeob1 wrote:
If solar and wind power are so cheap and available, why are there not more production facilities? .... Is the profit motive dead?

It isn't. What do you think of raising the gasoline tax by 15 cents -- about the amount Nordhaus suggests for 2010 -- and see what happens? It stimulates the supply of alternatives to oil, investments in saving oil, driving less, and everything else that helps evade the higher tax. Politicians don't have to decide how to save oil that way. (And realistically, since current budget deficits aren't sustainable in the long run, there will probably have to be some tax increase. This would be a face-saving way for Republicans to impose one. Karl Rove could call it the "9/11 memorial, national security, energy independence tax".)

I wouldn't argue with that at all. Indeed I would advocate a larger increase in the Federal tax on gasoline - say about 50 cents/gallon. Moreover I would wish to see the revenue go into the general fund, instead of being earmarked for road and mass transit construction. (Both programs are heavily politicized and intelligent economic use of resources is generally the first casualty in the government decision-making process.)

Thomas wrote:
georgeob1 wrote:
It is more than a bit interesting to note that global warming zealots are generally strongly anti-nuclear power. ....

To be fair though, this seems to be true only for policy activists. It isn't even true for all policy activist, and definitely not for the scientists. Hansen, one of the loudest whistle blowers on global warming and Bush's interference with the research, is very clear on the point of being proon having his publications censored by political Bush appointees at NASA, is clearly pro-nuclear energy. So is Al Gore. Your observation may be true for Sierra Club types, but the movement for curbing greenhouse gases is much broader than this.
Al Giore did his best as Vice President and previously in the Senate to kill any potential for licensing or construction of nuclear power plants - for almost 20 years. If a conversion has occured, it is of recent origin and (I believe) mostly a rhetorical device to cover a glaring contradiction in the only remaining vehicle to support his continued national prominence. Certainly the Democrat Party is strongly anti nuclear -- on all issues from licensing new plants to opening the repository at Yucca Mountain. The Republicans have different sympathies, but lack the political courage to do more than vaguely talk about it.
0 Replies
 
Foxfyre
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 12:44 pm
GeorgeOb1 writes
Quote:
I wouldn't argue with that at all. Indeed I would advocate a larger increase in the Federal tax on gasoline - say about 50 cents/gallon. Moreover I would wish to see the revenue go into the general fund, instead of being earmarked for road and mass transit construction. (Both programs are heavily politicized and intelligent economic use of resources is generally the first casualty in the government decision-making process.)


I would rather see incentives in the way of tax relief etc. offered for fuel conservation instead of new taxes. To substantially raise the gasoline tax opens the door wider for politicians to be exploited by outside oil producers such as Venezuela who would almost certainly try to bribe their way into more influence here.

If you raise taxes, at least mandate that all revenues be earmarked for oil exploration and production and/or fuel economy and/or development of alternative fuels. They've kinda reined in the deficit a bit lately. To pour more undesignated monies into the national treasury is to encourage a new surge in irresponsibile spending. Congress, both Republican and Democrat, never met a spare dollar they didn't see as a vote, and neither seem content to spend only what they have to spend.
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 12:45 pm
georgeob1 wrote:
Al Giore did his best as Vice President and previously in the Senate to kill any potential for licensing or construction of nuclear power plants - for almost 20 years. If a conversion has occured, it is of recent origin and (I believe) mostly a rhetorical device to cover a glaring contradiction in the only remaining vehicle to support his continued national prominence. Certainly the Democrat Party is strongly anti nuclear -- on all issues from licensing new plants to opening the repository at Yucca Mountain. The Republicans have different sympathies, but lack the political courage to do more than vaguely talk about it.


Exactly correct. Leopards do not change their spots easily.
0 Replies
 
miniTAX
 
  1  
Reply Mon 26 Feb, 2007 05:12 pm
Steve 41oo wrote:
I'll refrain from shooting any Hollywood star.

It won't be necessary. Best science fiction film award winning star Al Gore is shooting himself on the foot with his environmental "mission".
Carbon emission is growing unabated (forget to try to demand the Chinese or Indians to limit theirs). Temperatures stubbornly refuse to rise above the 1998 levels. Antarctica is cooling since the 1980s. The Greenland's ice, who was diminishing until 2005 is recovering spectacularly in 2006. The greenies' poster child Kilimajaro snow cover has never been as large for 15 years thanks to exceptional snowfall this year. Even the IPCC has downwardly revised its sea rise prediction and widened its uncertainty scales. The carbon stocks exchange, the core tool of Brussel aimed at conforming to Kyoto has cataclysmicly crashed in a complete Soviet-era media silence: the price of 1 ton of CO2 has fallen from 30 euros (35$) 8 months ago to 85 cents (1$) last week.

Al Gore must be desperate NOT to see the catastrophies predicted in his lifetime battle for the Earth. An Oscar is a meager compensation.
0 Replies
 
 

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