61
   

THE MEANING OF OZ - All you need to know!

 
 
Bootlace
 
  1  
Reply Sat 22 Sep, 2012 02:17 pm
@msolga,
msolga wrote:

Quote:
Quote:
Do you know any muslims? (you ignored that question)

Yes I do, and all the males carry knives too. They might be model citizens, but they will do as they are told by their spiritual leader and they will freely tell you this

I think you are talking through your hat.

You can think what you like dear.

I think you live in Queensland, yes, Bootlace?

You can think what you like msolga and your point is?

Could you at least identify what must be some incredible hot spot, where ALL of the males carry knives! Where is this place, exactly?
You don't have to identify yourself, but I would really like to know where this danger spot is!

I never said there was a danger spot, those are words invented by you. All I said was that the ones I know carry knives. (5)

Let me tell you something: I live in the inner-north of Melbourne. The suburb I live in (Coburg) has a large percentage of Muslims in our population make-up. Also, as a teacher, I have taught in many schools with high Muslim populations for 20+ years. Muslims of all sorts. Turkish, Lebanese, Syrian, Afghan, Indian, etc, etc ...
Never once, in many, many years here, have I witnessed any sort of knife provocation. Never once have I felt unsafe because there are so many Muslims in my community. Traders, neighbours, students, parents, what-ever ...

So you would have felt perfectly safe in Sydney the other day if you had been in the street?

I am surprised that you are a teacher in that in a previous post you could not be persuaded on the difference between race and religion. I still find it appalling that someone will play the "race card" to discredit someone who disagrees with a religion. It’s an old trick to stifle free speech, and unbecoming of an educator.


So what is so different about where you live, that you hold the views you hold? Please tell us the location of this dangerous place you live in, where all the Muslim men carry knives!

There you go inventing words again msolga. I said, all the males I know carry knives, I didn't say all muslim men carry knives.

And who, exactly, are the "spiritual leaders" of these knife-carrying Muslims in your community?

The "spiritual leaders" are local imams who basically work out of a private garage.
Four times you have asked me "where" . Why is this so important to you ?
Hingehead got stuck on how "old" I was. I don't intend to tell you either.
The ones I know are model citizens; it’s the parts of their religion that breaks Australian law and basic human rights that I abhor. They all will get tarred by the same brush until the moderates do something about it and that will NEVER happen.


.
msolga
 
  2  
Reply Sat 22 Sep, 2012 07:12 pm
@Bootlace,
Quote:
....and your point is?

As you'd be perfectly aware, I was commenting on what you said:

hinge asked you:

Quote:
Do you know any muslims? (you ignored that question)


To which you responded:

Quote:
Yes I do, and all the males carry knives too. They might be model citizens, but they will do as they are told by their spiritual leader and they will freely tell you this


So (a) you know Muslims (in Qld, where you live, as I've gathered from other posts of yours on other threads, like the Oz election thread. But anyway, who cares where you live? It's how you've formed your views that interests me. )

(b) All the Muslims you know carry knives. They've "freely" told you this. Yes?

(c) They "do as they're told" by their "spiritual leader". (which includes carrying knives?)

So, on the basis of what you said, I wanted to know where this place is, exactly.
Because your perceptions, based on your experience of where you live & the Muslims you claim to know, are quite different to my perceptions, based on my experience & knowledge of Muslims where I live.
I told you where I live. If you Google that suburb (& the northern suburbs of Melbourne) you'll find that there's a high Muslim population there.
I have had a lot of experience living among & working with Muslims. I have based my views of Muslims on that experience & knowledge.

That's why I asked you:

Quote:
So what is so different about where you live, that you hold the views you hold? Please tell us the location of this dangerous place you live in, where all the Muslim men carry knives!

Fair enough?

Your quibbling & waffling is not an answer to that simple question.
For all we know you might have formed your opinions via Alan Jones.
Anyway, please spare us yet more quibble & waffle.
All I wanted was an answer to my question.
Just say you won't answer it, if that's the case.
But don't expect to have your views on Muslims to be taken too seriously, OK?
.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  2  
Reply Sat 22 Sep, 2012 07:28 pm
@Bootlace,
p.s.

You know, Bootlace, when you talk like this you sound exactly like Bill.
Exactly how he addresses firefly:

Quote:
You can think what you like dear.

You wouldn't be Bill in disguise would you, Bootlace? Razz

No, no, please don't respond to that! (Heaven help us! This may never end!)
Just making an observation. Wink
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Sat 22 Sep, 2012 09:29 pm
@msolga,
Who's afraid of Muslim Rage?
msolga
 
  2  
Reply Sat 22 Sep, 2012 09:49 pm
@hingehead,
Good article, hinge.
Thanks for posting.
Including some excellent & informative links for further reading.:

Quote:
...A lonely band of journalists and scholars have approached the protests with an intent to truly understand the forces behind them. Among them, Hisham Matar, who powerfully describes the sadness in Benghazi after J Christopher Stevens' killing, and Barnaby Phillips, who explores how Islamic conservatives manipulated the film to their advantage. Anthropologist Sarah Kendzior cautions against treating the Muslim world as a homogenous unit. And Professor Stanley Fish tackles a tough question: why many Muslims are so sensitive to unflattering depictions of Islam.


Who's afraid of Muslim Rage?:
http://en.avaaz.org/783/muslim-rage-protests-newsweek-salafists
dlowan
 
  2  
Reply Sat 22 Sep, 2012 10:54 pm
@msolga,
Good article in The Nation also:

http://www.thenation.com/article/170043/muslim-rage-us-policy

hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Sun 23 Sep, 2012 01:46 am
@dlowan,
I can't help feeling that the outraged muslims have been duped. That the salafists found the video and translated it into arabic makes them at least as culpable as the film maker, who may have some murkiness of motive, but clearly the translators only had one aim.

How many of us would even know the video existed except for the protests?

How long before someone from the west starts trawling through arabic videos looking for something to offend us through translation?
dlowan
 
  1  
Reply Sun 23 Sep, 2012 02:09 am
@hingehead,
I think we have most Christians trained not to kill people over religion in a direct way any more in the west, though.
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Sun 23 Sep, 2012 02:20 am
@dlowan,
Yeah. Maybe. Although don't the articles mention the possibility the movie was commissioned by coptic christians? And let's not get to smug about Belfast.

I was thinking the same, then I was thinking of the attacks on family planning clinics in the US by right to lifers. I guess there's a fair percentage of the muslim world who think christians persecute muslims through a veil of military expediency.

On Q&A they had a couple of notable Islamic community leaders whose central theme was that the violent protesters were disaffected, at-a-loose-end, angry young men. That's a pretty universal issue for any community. Hell last northern summer London was in flames, with almost no trigger.
msolga
 
  3  
Reply Sun 23 Sep, 2012 03:07 am
@hingehead,
In Melbourne today ... Further ugly incidents (like those in Sydney) didn't not occur, thank goodness. Despite the best efforts of the "pro-Australian" trouble-makers. Idiots.
Muslim community leaders here put in a lot of work in the media & within their own communities during past week, urging Muslims to stay away from the rally. They also worked closely with the police.
Well done! Smile

Quote:
Film protest fails to ignite
September 23, 2012 - 5:38PM
Benjamin Millar/the AGE


TENSIONS flared but a repeat of Sydney-style clashes failed to materialise in a demonstration outside the State Library in Melbourne today.

A Muslim rally was initially planned to condemn a US film denigrating the Prophet Muhammad, which has incited violent rallies around the world.

But the organiser canned the protest over fears the event could spark the kind of violence that erupted between police and Muslim protesters in Sydney last weekend.

A text message circulated during the week urged a counter-protest comparable to the Cronulla riots and called for Australians to "come ready for a battle for our rights and our land" to counteract the rally at the State Library.


About 50 nationalist protesters appeared outside the library early in the afternoon, some wearing Australian flags and chanting "Aussie Aussie Aussie, Oi Oi Oi" and "we grew here they flew here".

Arguments broke out a Muslim man clashed with men bearing "Islam is false" signs.

Police asked the man to leave to defuse building antagonism but there was no major outbreak of violence under the watch of about 40 police officers.

Melbourne businessman Matt Hasan, speaking to those gathered, said that there is no place for the violence of last weekend.

"What we've demonstrated today is that we Muslims are on the same side as them. We're not fighting against them - that's not what Islam teaches. What happened in Sydney last week, we condemn it as much as they do. I think that message did get through. Protests are important but they should be peaceful."


Jayden Seric said he was spurred to join the protest because of the recent protests around the world.

"I wanted to provide balance to the extreme view that we saw in Sydney last weekend. I think that there are people in this country that are a threat to our way of life and they're very loud and very obvious about that."

He said his concern is with people motivated by religion to do extreme things "that are against our cultural norms”.

"I don't think it's a coincidence that recently we haven't seen violent protests by Buddhists, by Hindus or by Christians."

Police Commander Jeff Forti praised Islamic leaders for helping keep the protest peaceful.

"We're very thankful the rally really didn't go off, there was a small gathering of people there that was peaceful."

He said the predominant "pro-Australian" group was vocal but peaceful.

"It never got the point where we needed to separate but we did speak to some people who had the potential to get antagonistic. We prepared extensively for this but we really didn't know what was going to eventuate today so we planned for the worst and hoped for the best."

"People have the right to peacefully protest and there's no issue with that but any violence is unacceptable and we were prepared for it."

Commander Forti said he was heartened Muslim protesters stayed away and that police will continue to speak with Islamic leaders about any future rallies.


http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/film-protest-fails-to-ignite-20120923-26eov.html
msolga
 
  3  
Reply Sun 23 Sep, 2012 03:27 am
@msolga,
Quote:
A text message circulated during the week urged a counter-protest comparable to the Cronulla riots and called for Australians to "come ready for a battle for our rights and our land" to counteract the rally at the State Library.

About 50 nationalist protesters appeared outside the library early in the afternoon, some wearing Australian flags and chanting "Aussie Aussie Aussie, Oi Oi Oi" and "we grew here they flew here".

Those "Australian nationalists" & their ilk should be told by Australian leaders that they do not represent us.
Just as bluntly as the Muslim rioters in Sydney were told so by their leaders.
They are little more than yobs, on both sides.
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  2  
Reply Sun 23 Sep, 2012 03:50 am
@hingehead,
Oh yes....I agree with the points re Christian terrorists indeed.....

A big radio national discussion was suggesting the angry young men were a largely western Sydney phenomenon.....and that they find belonging and a channel in well organized radical Islamist groups.


I think the Copts are reacting to very oppressive situations in places like Egypt. Very sad to see.

Msolga....well done by the Oz Muslim community indeed! I agree....I'd like to see similar statements by our leaders.
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Sun 23 Sep, 2012 07:57 am
@dlowan,
I have a couple of inlaws who are Syrian christians so I can understand coptic angst but can't justify that alleged incitement. Thoroughly endorse your point that our community leaders should be as vocal as the oz muslim community leaders.
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  3  
Reply Mon 24 Sep, 2012 05:24 pm
http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/185295_4608935581663_866792508_n.jpg
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Sep, 2012 06:48 pm
@hingehead,
Laughing

Very funny!
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Mon 24 Sep, 2012 08:56 pm
Interesting piece from The Drum on just how different the illegal immigration 'debate' is in Australia compared to the rest of the world.

A crackdown on illegal immigrants. Interested? Anyone?
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Tue 25 Sep, 2012 03:55 am
Apple's Wozniak wants to become Australian
http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/apples-wozniak-wants-to-become-australian-20120925-26iwb.html
Bootlace
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Sep, 2012 01:43 pm
@hingehead,
From your previous posts hingehead

Quote:
Better that than your white blindfold.
Almost everything you say and quote smells of angry white man.


You sound like you are suffering a severe case of white liberal guilt.
hingehead
 
  1  
Reply Wed 26 Sep, 2012 03:23 pm
@Bootlace,
Funny it took you days to find a label that effectively means nothing.
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Wed 26 Sep, 2012 04:08 pm
@Bootlace,
PS 'White blindfold' is a lift from a speech made my Sir Gustav Nossal, Australian of the Year, 2000. Himself a refugee from the Nazi annexation of Austria.
0 Replies
 
 

Related Topics

Beached As Bro - Discussion by dadpad
Oz election thread #3 - Rudd's Labour - Discussion by msolga
Australian music - Discussion by Wilso
Oz Election Thread #6 - Abbott's LNP - Discussion by hingehead
AUstralian Philosophers - Discussion by dadpad
Australia voting system - Discussion by fbaezer
 
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 3.2 seconds on 12/23/2024 at 07:17:09