"Prayer Works For Me"

I know what you mean. In New Zealand at the moment a law was just passed that allows gay couples to have the same legal rights as married couples, and most of the churchs (mostly the leader of the destiny church) are sinking all their time and effort into preventing a law which does nothing accept promote tollerance in the community. What about hundreds of children dying of cancer and other diseases, innocent civilians and aid workers in countries like iraq having their heads removed or caught in cross fire. Families are being destroyed on a daily basis by war, poverty, disease, and all they can care about is something as trivial as a law extending the rights of gay couples (as a side note, why does it matter which gender a person likes?).

I just get so fustrated when people are moaning about not having enough money or not getting enough of what ever. How can people be so self centred?

No. sadly enough edgar.
And if you ask this question to a christian,, they will say
Well God had a plan for those people who died or are being shot or what ever.. .
Or just simply say " that is god's plan"

Hmm.. i personally dont know any father who would allow one child to die while helping another one walk up a set of stairs.

Interestung responses. Not a one addresses the stated question. Whether or not the calamities which befall humanity help define the character of a god was not the question. And I have no idea what the theological stance against homosexuality has to do with anything germane to the discussion. "Are your prayers ever answered?" was the simple question that Edgar asked.

simply - yes: not always but yes

There's nice discussion in The Plague between Rieux and Tarrou about something like this that concludes that we must accept everything that happens and only fight for what is good, because who are we to deny bad events that will inevitably happen?

I pray only for what I need. And sometimes I don't even know what that is. If I were to pray for what I want and desire, and that prayer was granted, I'd be in one hell of a lot of trouble. Seen on a T-shirt in Greenwich Village: "God, Protect Me from What I Want."

Whenever someone tells me that prayer can move mountains...and people often do...

...I challenge them to a competition.

They can get all their friends, neighbors, and all the ministers, priests, rabbis, and other folks they can muster and pray to move a mountain.

I get a boy scout with a spoon to work on a different mountian.

My bet...I get more of my mountain moved than they do.

Oh, yeah...they can get the pope and the college of cardinals helping them pray also.

Nothing like that ever happens in my neighborhood, Edgar. At least not all at once like that.

I want to move to your neighborhood. It sounds exciting!

Edgar wrote:



While we are on the subject...and to be fair to the other side...I guess this is as good a place as any to share this:




Subject: The Christmas Party

December 1st TO: ALL EMPLOYEES I'm happy to inform you that the company Christmas Party will take place on December 23rd at Luigi's Open Pit Barbecue.There will be lots of spiked eggnog and a small band playing traditional carols ... feel free to sing along. And don't be surprised if our CEO shows up dressed as Santa Claus to light the Christmas tree! Exchange of gifts among employees can be done at that time; however, no gift should be over $10. Merry Christmas to you and your family. Patty Lewis Human Resources Director


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December 2nd TO: ALL EMPLOYEES In no way was yesterday's memo intended to exclude our Jewish employees. We recognize that Hanukkah is an important holiday that often coincides with Christmas (though unfortunately not this year). However, from now on we're calling it our "Holiday Party." The same policy applies to employees who are celebrating Kwanzaa at this time. There will be no Christmas tree and no Christmas carols sung. Happy Holidays to you and your family. Patty Lewis Human Resources Director


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December 3rd TO: ALL EMPLOYEES Regarding the anonymous note I received from member of Alcoholics Anonymous requesting a non-drinking table, I'm happy to accommodate this request, but, don't forget, if I put a sign on the table that reads, "AA Only," you won't be anonymous anymore. In addition, forget about the gifts exchange-- no gifts will be allowed since the union members feel that $10 is too much money. Patty Lewis Human Researchers Director


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December 7th TO: ALL EMPLOYEES I've arranged for members of Overeaters Anonymous to sit farthest from the dessert buffet and pregnant women closest to the restrooms. Gays are allowed to sit with each other. Lesbians do not have to sit with the gay men; each will have their own table. Yes, there will be a flower arrangement for the gay men's table. Happy now? Patty Lewis Human Racehorses Director


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December 9th TO: ALL EMPLOYEES People, people -- nothing sinister was intended by wanting our CEO to play Santa Claus! Even if the anagram of "Santa" does happen to be "Satan," there is no evil connotation to our own "little man in a red suit." Patty Lewis Human Ratraces


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December 10th TO: ALL EMPLOYEES Vegetarians -- I've had it with you people!! We're going to hold this party at Luigi's Open Pit whether you like it or not,you can just sit at the table farthest from the "grill of death," as you put it, and you'll get salad bar only, including hydroponic tomatoes. But, you know, tomatoes have feelings, too. They scream when you slice them. I've heard them scream. I'm hearing them right now... Ha! I hope you all have a rotten holiday! Drive drunk and die, you hear me? The Bitch from Hell

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December 14th TO: ALL EMPLOYEES I'm sure I speak for all of us in wishing Patty Lewis a speedy recovery from her stress-related illness. I'll continue to forward your cards to her at the sanitarium. In the meantime, management has decided to cancel our Holiday Party and give everyone the afternoon of the 23rd off with full pay. Terri Bishop Acting Human Resources Director

And as long as we're on the subject of religion, here's a story about my dear brother, killed in a car accident many years ago.

We lived together in a small house off campus while we were attending the University of -.

We used to get all sorts of pesky religious people coming to our door, trying to save our souls or pawn their religion off on us.

I've always had a weakness for my fellow man and am willing to lend an ear. Many times I invited these souls into my home to listen to their spiritual diatribes while at the same time mentally lamenting my decision to allow them across the threshold.

My brother was not so nice. He'd answer the door, see a couple of smiling young men in suits, and when one of them asked "Have you met God?" my brother would reply, "F#** God!", and slam the door in their startled faces.

I miss my brother.

My answer is the same as husker's:

One thing that puzzles me about prayer is that say your in your car stuck, and it wont start. A christian prays to their god and the car starts, they immediately associate this with the prayer they sent the big guy without even considering . . . was the car going to start even if i didnt pray? Or if a non-religious person in the exact same situation only hoped instead of prayed would it start? Or if a pagan sacrificed a lamb for jupiter, would the car start?

I think that the praying just gives people hope, and it doesnt even really matter if there prayers get answered or not because they have an excuse or explanation for each side. Either "thank god he answered my prayers" or "god taught me a lesson by not answering my prayers" .

Ive got nothing against praying, because to me its just like hoping or meditating, it makes (some) people more hopefull or positive. The only thing that bothers me is when people attribute it to events which happen.

The ship sinks. All the sailors leap over the side, praying to the God/Goddess/Neptune.

One makes it to shore. 'I prayed for my deliverance and I was rescued!'.

'A miracle from God', cry the multitude, 'Proof of the divinity!'.

Meanwhile the rest of the crew are shark-food. 'God is so pleased with us', says one Great White to another.


This fallacy is the that of the 'Texas Sharpshooter'. He shoots off some rounds at the side of the barn. Then he carefully paints a bulls-eye around the bullet holes. A direct hit - EVERY TIME!

An answer of "No" or "Not yet" is still an answer.

I was told that God answers all prayers. The answer just might be no. I agree with LabRat.

I know a lot of people don't believe the whole destiny thing but I really believe that we are all here for a reason and once we fulfill that purpose, we die. Even if we are 25 or 98 or 6. I believe that we can't understand why things happen because we can't see the whole picture. We just have a brief snapshot of it. I've lived through tragedy and I've asked myself why, asked God why. I don't ignore the human nature to ask why. But I also don't ignore the faith that there is a bigger plan. Crazy as it might seem to some, I think that things do happen for a reason. I also believe in reincarnation and that we come back as something we were not before (ie. poor one life, rich another).

edit cuz I can't spell.