Lets tax Christmas !

Fresco: Please. Cigarettes are 4 dollars a pack because of taxes in America and we are torching up more than ever. Taxes stop exactly nothing - we just bitch more as we puff ourselves to death.

MORE DEBT! That is what we need - more debt in the name of the lord. God loves it when I blow wads of cash on plastic **** in his name.

Wars and debt! It is the Christian way! I am buying only automatic weapons for the people on my Christmas list. Like Jerry Falwell said last week 'Blow them all away in the name of the Lord!'

TTF

TTF, can I get on your Christmas list?

Re: Lets tax Christmas !
fresco, are you crazy? More taxes? I pay in taxes every month 45% of my salary! Do you think it's not enough?

Once again the Jews are left out in the cold of the holiday season. No suggestion that we tax Chanukah??? How is that supposed to make them feel?

I would think they would protest but first they have to watch the National Christmas Tree Lighting LIVE on CNN.

Thinkfactory -- where do you live? Four bucks for a pack of butts? That's dirt cheap today. Up here in the over-taxed northeast, it's six or more for any name brand. And Massachusetts is about to add another 40 cents in taxes, according to latest news reports. Cigs will soon become an underground currency if they haven't already done so. "I don't have the ten bucks I owe you but will cettle for two Marlboros?" (That's 2 cigarettes, not 2 packs.)

Fresco:

I am sceptical to this kind of forced charity. My government (norwgian) are pioneers in the art of creating new taxes. The price of a pack of cigarettes in norway is approximately ten dollars if one dollar is the equivalent of six norwegian crowns, wich I believe is close. A bottle of vodka more than doubles in price from the time it enters customs to the time it reaches the shelves in the monopolies for selling hard liquor and wine. Socialism still has its grip in the soul of our people.

The question is what we get from all of this. Norwegian experts maintain that alcohol related tragedys are less frequent in countries with strict regulations and high taxes, and so it is right to shield the population from alcohol. There are so many flaws in this chain of thought, but the most ironic one is how unchristian such a logic is. After all our prime minister is also a priest...

It boils down to this: Should the community strive to excel as a community, or should it work to educate the people in it to excel as human beings, to overcome their challenges and grow?

The second kind of community would be the one in accordance with the christian message..

Christmas is what we make of it. We can (1) celebrate it as Christians if that is our bent; (2) we can partake a more generalized "Peace on Earth, good will to men" tack; (3) make it all about families; (4) participate in orgies of spending. I make it a combined number two and three myself. The gifts I give are inexpensive and do little to contribute to the commercialism of the season. Charity given of the heart is an excellent expression of number two. I will be condemned for socialistic tendencies, but I believe the federal and state governments should combine to aid the poor the year round. Arguments that there is no available money are ridiculous. The money is there, it is just being wasted on the wrong priorities.

Fresco, a pox on your tax. <smile>.

I really don't care about exchanging gifts any longer. I just enjoy the lights and the glow of remembering. I think that I agree with edgar, here.
I noticed that The Salvation Army Bell Ringer has been replaced with a robot, because of some stores' policy of no solicitation. Good Grief!

I am interested in celebrations everywhere and although we will be alone this Christmas, I find it neat that no government has found a way to tax memories. Give 'em a chance, though. They'll think of some way, I'm certain.

This is an interesting topic because of what Fresco has asked underlying the original post.

Which is - should we tax to 'force' giving during the season?

I am not sure - it seems that if we do not tax to help the poor no one will help them (it is not like the tax refund that Pres. Bush sent out was given to the poor in droves) - but if you give more back to the people it seems thier giving nature will have more for them to give.

I guess I am a pessimist that if we do not have programs to help the poor - the wealthy will not help by themselves.

However, I am against taxing at Christmas because of the speration of church and state. Welfare is one thing - good tidings another.

TF

Yes, it is an interesting topic, TZ. Since I don't count donations on my IRS return, I feel that anything that I give is just a mite, but done without expectations of return. The U.S. Constitution is amazing as it stands, and we do NOT need any further amendments. Absolutely, keep our religion and our government separate.

There have been programs to help the poor for years... where has it gotten us?

Plus it is backwards logic. How is raising taxes going to help the poor? It seems to me it would push prices higher so that the poor won't even be able to participate due to the fact that they are poor and can't afford christmas as it is.

My thoughts:

People won't buy as much due to the tax eating up more of their disposable income.

You can't force charity. It comes from the heart.

Joe's right, of course. No one should be left out. Tax Kwanza, too, if you plan to tax Christmas.

And... Who needs cigs? I get a carton of Marlboro Lights for $28.00 with tax. That's only $2.80 a pack?

It will be a Very Merry Christmas indeed! Guns and Cigs for everyone! Ho-Ho-Ho!

Lively discussion !

Perhaps related....

I don't know how your US lotteries operate but here the National Lottery must give a large percentage of the take to charity. The "poor" tend to be major purchasers of tickets.

My brother says the lottery is a tax for people that can't do math

I'd say that's fairly accurate.

though I played it once when it got so high that the benefits outweighed the odds

Was there supposed to be some evidence that these programs have not worked in your post? I tell you where it has gotten me.

When my mother left my father for a time shee needed food stamps to feed us. We were on WIC and food stamps for about a year. Without this program my mother and her two children would have not been able to afford housing. Without housing - she probably would not have been able to have the time to get back on her feet - get a head a bit - finish up her college degree and so on.

Where it has gotten my family is here:

1) My mother went on to get her graduate degree and helped found a shelter for battered women where they have helped over 1,800 people stay safe.

2) I got 4 college degrees and teach philosophy at a college. I have one child and one on the way.

3) My brother got a degree and is a great salesmen and has 4 daughters.

Where have these programs gotten us - well when they work - and are not abused - I think they have gotten so many Americans back on thier feet you cannot begin to count.

TTF

TF, I am totally taken with your success story built on the rock of help and determination. Unbelievable, my friend.

Kudos, TF.