17
   

Is it ever a good idea to indoctrinate children?

 
 
daverod
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 16 Jun, 2017 09:24 pm
@coluber2001,
depends on if you know enough to keep them indoctrinated if you do.
0 Replies
 
Glennn
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jun, 2017 11:13 am
@maxdancona,
Quote:
You are basically saying "My beliefs are right, and other cultural beliefs are wrong".

No, my standards are based on what I call common sense. It makes no sense to physically mutilate females. My cultural indoctrination had nothing to do with my assessment of that cultural practice.
Quote:
There are many cultures that practice arranged marriages, and many people in these cultures that have had happy, productive lives with arranged marriages.

I have no idea how you came to this conclusion. Generally, people born into a culture where arranged marriages are the norm have no reference from which to compare their life. In simple terms, you're saying that marrying someone whom you did not choose makes more sense than marrying someone of your own choosing. That makes no sense.
Quote:
But you give no "experiment" that we can do to say that you are right

You should poll young people, asking them if they would prefer to marry someone of their own choosing, or someone of another's choosing. I promise you that it will be a slam dunk in favor of marrying someone of their own choosing. But you already knew that . . .

And of course, this doesn't touch on the issue of young girls being placed in the beds of adult males. What would a man want with an emotionally and intellectually immature mate? This is a no-brainer. I shouldn't even have to ask.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jun, 2017 11:49 am
@Glennn,
There is no difference between cultural indoctrination and "common sense". They are the same thing. If I transported you back to a Native American tribe in the year 1300 (pre-colonial), you wouldn't have enough common sense to know how to go to the bathroom or know how to dress yourself.

That is the point. You were indoctrinated with common sense. And, this common sense only works if you are living in modern day Western culture. If you lived in a significantly different culture, you would need a significantly different common sense.

Your argument is based on the assumption that people born into other cultures will think the same as people born into modern American culture.

If you spend any time learning about other cultures, you will see that this is demonstrably false. Pick up an anthropology book, you will see that most women living in indigenous cultures that practice arranged marriages are perfectly happy with their own cultures. There are even examples of indigenous women who have specifically rejected modern Western culture.
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jun, 2017 12:12 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
You should poll young people, asking them if they would prefer to marry someone of their own choosing, or someone of another's choosing. I promise you that it will be a slam dunk in favor of marrying someone of their own choosing. But you already knew that . . .


This is factually incorrect. The one poll I could find was in India (where most marriages are still arranged). India is a fully Westernized country.... and yet there remains widespread support for arranged marriages.

Think about the claim you are making; that indigenous women would choose modern American culture over their own cultures. Given the history of Western culture toward indigenous cultures... this is rather obscene.
0 Replies
 
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Sat 17 Jun, 2017 12:32 pm
@maxdancona,
Quote:
There is no difference between cultural indoctrination and "common sense". They are the same thing.

Not true. Cultural indoctrination might dictate that female mutilation is a good thing. Common sense, however, tells you that it is not. It is pointless and without reason. Defense of such a thing is also pointless and without reason.
Quote:
If you lived in a significantly different culture, you would need a significantly different common sense.

Sure, it might behoove me to go with the flow in order to not be ostracized. But back to the point. Explain to me the common sense behind the idea of an adult male pairing up with an emotionally and intellectually immature female.
Quote:
Pick up an anthropology book, you will see that most women living in indigenous cultures that practice arranged marriages are perfectly happy with their own cultures. There are even examples of indigenous women who have specifically rejected modern Western culture.

I've already explained that people born into a culture where arranged marriages are the norm have no reference of experience from which to draw from in order to compare their life to another. If I were to tell you that marrying someone whom you did not choose makes just as much sense as marrying someone of your own choosing, you would know how to refute that statement. Your cultural indoctrination has nothing to do with seeing the flaw in that logic. You've simply decided that your cultural indoctrination has hindered your ability to make reasonable judgement concerning things like female mutilation, child brides, mating with someone not of your choice, etc.
Quote:
There are even examples of indigenous women who have specifically rejected modern Western culture.

See above.
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Sat 17 Jun, 2017 12:39 pm
@Glennn,
Quote:
ve already explained that people born into a culture where arranged marriages are the norm have no reference of experience from which to draw from in order to compare their life to another. If I were to tell you that marrying someone whom you did not choose makes just as much sense as marrying someone of your own choosing, you would know how to refute that statement.


Do you have any experience living in a culture where arranged marriages are the norm? You have the same problem that these indigenous woman have; "you have no reference of experience from which to draw from in order to compare your life to another". All you know is modern Western culture.

There is no reason that your "sense" or experience is superior to that of women in indigenous cultures. You are claiming to know that they would agree that your way is better than their way... but other than your "common sense" there is no reason to believe that this is the case.

Women in other cultures don't think the same as you do, you fail to accept the fact that you are just as subject to cultural indoctrination as they are.
Glennn
 
  0  
Reply Sat 17 Jun, 2017 03:20 pm
@maxdancona,
Quote:
Do you have any experience living in a culture where arranged marriages are the norm? You have the same problem that these indigenous woman have; "you have no reference of experience from which to draw from in order to compare your life to another". All you know is modern Western culture.

The question comes down to a matter of choice. You have chosen to believe that the choice of a life mate should be made by a third party instead of by the concerned subjects. Relationships develop because two people gravitate towards each other. Arranged marriages develop because a third party gravitates toward someone they approve of, and then makes arrangements to satisfy their desire. Do you believe that marriage is between three or four people?
0 Replies
 
chirchri
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Jun, 2017 09:45 pm
@coluber2001,
I'm sure that won't be necessary..
0 Replies
 
 

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