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JUDGE RULES THAT ABORIGINAL RAPE OF A MINOR TRADITIONAL, OK

 
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 07:46 am
its really just a matter of "stuff", whoever has the most "stuff" wins.
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steissd
 
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Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 09:42 am
I have no idea either what caused their retardation. Japan was also an isolated nation, but she did not stay in the Stone Age until the U.S. imposed on her more openness.
IMHO, it is detrimental to preserve the aboriginal authentic features; first and foremost, it is detrimental to the aborigines themselves, since this preserves retardation; on the contrary, the efforts must be made to integrate them completely into the modern society.
By the way, are they Christians? If not, the Christian churches could have introduced them into the modern world by means of their missionary activities.
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ehBeth
 
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Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 09:45 am
An interesting article. Definitely some similiarities with the situation here in North America.

Leaders in the various aboriginal communities have a rough road to hoe. How to determine what is really traditional? how to balance the good and bad of different cultures? It's the flip side of immigration - what to defend and what to give up.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 09:48 am
Complete integration? I don't think you'll find a lot of support for that, steissd.

Retardation is a very loaded term - a negative connotation there, that may not be appropriate. Inventing stuff you don't need isn't necessarily a sign of an advanced culture - maybe just too many bored guys.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 09:52 am
whooooooooooooaaaaaaaaaa - watch it with the Christianity thing - the Anglican church in Canada is about to go bankrupt as a result of law suits from the aboriginal community here. Both aboriginal and immigrant Canadians pretty much agree that the Christian church had an overall negative impact on the aboriginal peoples living here.
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steissd
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 09:54 am
What is this negative impact all about? Which values that the Christian churches want their followers to share are negative?
Or you mean several dishonest abusive priests?
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 09:58 am
streissd - the catholic churh has a long history of abuse - sexual, economical, ethical...... I'm talking thousands of years.
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littlek
 
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Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:00 am
Like Beth says, the mother of invention is neccessity. Retarded? <shaking head and muttering>
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ehBeth
 
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Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:02 am
this is one article from the Anglican Church itself http://www.anglican.ca/mm/2000/legacy/mm06.html

the article ends this way

Quote:
Miller writes: "It is fitting that a royal commission operating in the name of the people of Canada has looked into the issue because in a fundamental sense the party that bears most responsibility for the residential school story is the people of Canada. Churches and federal bureaucracy no doubt were the instruments that carried out specific acts or neglected to do what needed to be done in particular cases. But behind both the churches and the government stood the populace, who in a democracy such as Canada ultimately are responsible. In the late 1880s and since, it was, in fact, the enlightened and the progressive few in that society who stirred themselves to volunteer to serve in the residential schools. It was the idealists who became involved in missions and residential schools; the mass of the population was indifferent or hostile to the interests of Native people. Those who today self-righteously condemn missionaries totally for the damage done in residential schools might well remember that a century ago it was people like them - the people who cared about the Native communities - who staffed these schools."
While broadening the circle of responsibility to include the Canadian public, Miller says bluntly that the "Christian churches have not done enough to atone for their share of responsibility for the harm residential schools did."
The Anglican Church of Canada has acknowledged this harm and is continuing to address its responsibility. Stressing the broader responsibility of Canadians does not limit the church's responsibility. It does recognize, however, that action on the part of the churches will not be sufficient. Even the resources of the federal government will not be adequate to bring healing to Aboriginal peoples, unless those resources are matched by a change of heart on the part of Canadians.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:07 am
this is from the australian anglican paper which is clearly watching the situation here

Quote:



The situation here is changing, slowly, and with difficulty. Full integration is not being considered as an option.
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dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:08 am
RETARDED? OMG!!!!
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:10 am
GOVERNMENT:

In Aboriginal society every person (particular every initiated male) was considered to be equal. No one had authority over anyone else in the sense of ruling them, but this is not to say that there weren't leaders. There are always leaders in any society - people who have personal qualities that others admire. But there were no elected leaders in Aboriginal society. There were also people who performed particular roles. For example clever men also known as Koradjis and as Doctors by Europeans, had or acquired special skills and were considered to be authorities on certain matters.

LAW:

The Aborigines had a number of laws that governed their society. They ranged from family discipline (whereby children and others were expected to conform and behave to a code of conduct) to laws about trespassing, food taboos, marriage laws or regulations and breaches of acceptable behavior such as rape, murder and stealing.

The source of the laws were Dreamtime stories that told of the behavior of men, woman and children (sometimes in allegorical forms of animals, birds or reptiles - etc. in which the perpetrators actions were punished by being beaten, speared or by banishment.

LINK
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:10 am
this linkthe link's under here has further links to topics/policies related to healing in the first nations in canada.
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steissd
 
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Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:13 am
The article refers to abusive staff, and not about harm that Christianity per se can bring to the converts (in fact, it brings to them nothing but good). If the process of Christianization of the indigenous people is under the strict public control, and each physical and/or sexual abuser is prosecuted, then missionary activities may be instrumental to introducing the aboriginal tribes anywhere in the world to the modern civilized society.
Harsh discipline, when it is not accompanied by torture, is in favor of the disciples; the modern world is a competitive one, and ability to work hard and control urges is instrumental for success.
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:15 am
dyslexia wrote:
RETARDED? OMG!!!!


To be fair, it's probably only in america that retarded means mentaly/physically incapacitated first. If you look the word up it means slow to develop, late, etc etc..... less loaded.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:18 am
steissd - follow the links - read what's going on - there were clearly individuals who behaved inappropriately - but it is the entire Christian faith and government and people that were found at fault - it was/is a systemic problem - not just a couple of people behaving badly.

the trend in Canada, the U.S. and Australia is very much away from full integration. the concept was found faulty, and is no longer being pursued. A government commission here found that Christian behaviour toward First Nations people could be considered genocide.

Competition is not always the most successful way for a person/community/nation to move forward. The research in the social sciences doesn't support that.
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ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:20 am
littlek - the term means the same thing here - horribly loaded.
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:23 am
Ok, N. America.
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:26 am
I asked Dagmaraka, she says her first reaction would be the same as ours....... even without the american spin on the word.
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steissd
 
  1  
Reply Sat 1 Feb, 2003 10:27 am
BTW, the British White Anglo-Saxon Protestant[/i] paupers, including minors, got more or less the same treatment in the Workhouses[/i], and this did not prevent the UK from becoming by the beginning of the 20th century the first global superpower and the third, after the USA and Germany, technologically advanced country. All the abuses refer to the imperfection of the individual rights protection that existed in 19th century, and not to racist attitudes of the civilizers.
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