Brexit. Why do Brits want Out of the EU?

@Blickers,

Well, as neither is part of the EU, Norway and Switzerland don't have any MEPs or commissioners representing them it the EU. But they're also both part "Schengen", which means that although there are custom requirements in place (as they're not in the EU), there are not usually systematic passport controls at the border.
Both countries bring many of their laws into line with EU rules, on the single market in particular nearly all. Norway incorporates single market rules as they’re made, while Switzerland accepts EU law (e.g. weapon laws).

Blickers wrote:

In the best-case scenario, Britain may be able to negotiate access to the European market that isn’t that different from what it has now.

If such would happen, we should any country be a member? And why should it be "best-case scenario" having the same as before, but nothing to say about rules and laws?

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@Lash,

i'm on the side of "if you want to leave someplace or thing, you g0, so long, see ya, don't **** around with my life"

in other words, the 52% who want out of the EU should be looking for somewhere else to live

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@Blickers,

Blickers wrote:

If you think it's in the interests of the EU to make the UK's departure as rough as possible as a caution to other nations if they decide to leave, fine. I think that the UK has more economic clout than Norway, and the EU will meet them at least halfway on most things.

I don't think so. The EU has already established two task forces, the "Brexit Task Force" and the "Article 50 Task Force". The consultations with the UK are lead by the Belgian diplomat Didier Seeuws (He serves actually now as "Director for Transport, Telecommunications and Energy", kind of "Permanent Secretary".)

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Quote Blickers:

Quote:

If you think it's in the interests of the EU to make the UK's departure as rough as possible as a caution to other nations if they decide to leave, fine. I think that the UK has more economic clout than Norway, and the EU will meet them at least halfway on most things.

Quote Walter:

Quote:

I don't think so. The EU has already established two task forces, the "Brexit Task Force" and the "Article 50 Task Force".

You don't think the EU will go hard on the UK or you don't think the EU will meet the UK halfway on most things?

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@Blickers,

Well, I really don't think that the EU will meet the UK at least halfway on most things - at least not to something that could be a better situation than that of Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland.

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Why can Switzerland get away with friends-with-benefits and Britain can't? Seems fucked up.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/after-brexit-can-the-u-k-become-more-like-switzerland-1466774144

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@Lash,

Lash wrote:

Why can Switzerland get away with friends-with-benefits and Britain can't? Seems fucked up.

Why do you think it is fucked up?

Switzerland never has been an EU-country. But is a Schengen member. And most EU-laws apply in Switzerland - including weapon weapon law to immigration. Switzerland pays more than two billion Euros per year to the EU ... and doesn't get a single cent.

The question would be same if asked about Liechtenstein or Norway.
There had been a really interesting feature on the Swiss tv yesterday evening: a live discussion over nearly two hours if Switzerland now should become a EU-member state. (Equally divided opinions.)

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@Lash,

One, if not not THE main argument for Brexit was "immigration".
More than 25% of the Swiss population has a foreign nationality (more than 20% EU-citizens). Plus those with double-nationalities.

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@Walter Hinteler,

There are European countries that rejected EU membership and have not been vilified, but still enjoy some type of "favored nation status" by the EU. You've mentioned some of them.

I think the punitive reaction towards Britain is hypocritical.

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well worth a listen

Dead Ringers 24th June 2016
Friday Night Comedy from BBC Radio 4

With the Referendum result now in the team give in-depth analysis of the highs, lows and madness of the EU Campaigns. Performed by Jon Culshaw, Lewis MacLeod, Jan Ravens, Debra Stephenson and Duncan Wisbey.

http://bbc.in/28UIXhk

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@Lash,

Lash wrote:

There are European countries that rejected EU membership and have not been vilified, but still enjoy some type of "favored nation status" by the EU.

The only known country is Greenland. (Switzerland, Norway, Iceland and Liechtenstein have never been EU-countries.)
I don't know why you call the procedure according article 50 a vilification. Or the afterwards comiing talks about new treaties. (Greenland was just about fish, nothing else, and it lasted years.)

In my opinion, Brexit means Brexit. And we really must get over it.
The majority of the UK didn't want the UK to be an EU-member country. Full stop.

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@Walter Hinteler,

Why is it ok that Switzerland et al rejected membership outright & still get perks from the EU; and Britain actually made an attempt to be a part of it and later decided they didn't like it? There are two sets of responses and that's unsupportable.

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@Lash,

Switzerland et. al. have never been members - talks about how they (now) are connection went over years, as well as those joining Schengen (Schengen is something, the UK never wanted).
They didn't reject membership: they never applied for it.

Britain has been an EU-member for 43 years. Now the voters said 'no' to it.

The EU wants it done fast.
The UK government not (“The period of informal negotiation prior to an article 50 process will be crucial and should not be rushed.”, cabinet minister Theresa Villiers, writing in the Observer,)

The crux is that not everything really is regulated article 50 - seems, the creators if didn't think that some country would leave.

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@Walter Hinteler,

Walter, you're talking around the question, refusing to answer. I guess you haven't had a good day. I'll wait a week or so and see if you can answer then.

It's nonsensical to be madder at the ones who tried membership than the ones who refused to try.

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@Lash,

It's a nice morning here.
I'm not talking around the question - comparing how Norway et. al. got their relation with the EU and how a Brexit should be handled is something totally different.

No-one denies that the UK could start (and should) to try getting the same as the other non-EU-members. But at first, the divorce must really start.

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The opinion expressed by Glenn Greenwald is my opinion. It's nice to be validated by someone I respect.

Brexit is closely connected to what's currently happening in the US. It is a strike against neoliberalism. Sort of crappy that bigots attach themselves to the movement. I guess we're all swimming around in the same soup.

https://theintercept.com/2016/06/25/brexit-is-only-the-latest-proof-of-the-insularity-and-failure-of-western-establishment-institutions/

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@Lash,

I'd read it.
I have been against globalisation when I was young, too.
Now, I must admit, that we can't live without it. And can't handle it.

But I disagree that it has been a "strike against neoliberalism" in the UK - Boris Johnson's neoliberal agenda is too known.

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@Walter Hinteler,

Quote:

Boris Johnson's neoliberal agenda is too known.

Careful Walter; the pundits here think it's a mythical beast borne in the imagination of conspiracy theorists.

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@Walter Hinteler,

I'll read up on Boris, but pulling away from top-heavy layers of distant non-representational bureaucracy is a strike against neoliberalism- no matter what Boris may have said.

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@Builder,

Might be so. But Johnson and Gove are really ready to turn Britain into a neoliberal fantasy island. (Well perhaps just England and Wales, if Scotland and Northern Ireland leave the union.)

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Brexit. Why do Brits want Out of the EU?

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