Brexit. Why do Brits want Out of the EU?

I am all for that it is not allowed to denay Holocaust.
There are just too many - one would be enough- who would like to say it did not exist.
Imagen if in USA people tried to say that you never ever had slaves or segregation? Do you feel that would go under freedom of speach or would it be denaiel of truth and discriminat the people who had to live during these times?

I think sane people would laugh at them or say they're in denial.

The same thing happens here at A2K all the time. People don't like a fact, so they find a way to deny it or avoid it.

They are just not given any credibility when they do it. they live in the dark.

But, if you jail them or arrest them or exert power over them to force them not to say what they believe, I think it increases their hatred. The one they hate has achieved a dominance over them. They yearn for a more violent satisfaction.

Anyway, that's how I see it.

I do think (and that's my exprience as well) that just doing so with Holocaust deniers is dangerous. But that's just because I'm fully aware of the history of the Holocaust (and the Nazi period), because I'm a German and because I live in Germany.

I understand we bring vastly different backgrounds to this issue.

Is it very unpopular in Germany (or the EU) to express a negative opinion about the refugees? Very unpopular to refer to them as immigrants? Do you think concern in Britain due to the refugee issue has anything to do with Brexit?

Hows that European / German dialogue going?

People around me have become more concerned about opening up to so many refugees / immigrants after watching and hearing what is perceived to be a net negative result for Europe.

Found this jewel.

Trump walks back Obama's Brexit threat.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_57387d49e4b060aa781a8a6b

I was really surprised to see Obama had made such a threat. An opinion sure, but I think such threats from a head of state to an ally is completely inappropriate.

Those refugees are refered to as asylum seekers or refugees.

I don't know, how the and/or if the refugee situation is supporting the Brexit-idea in Britain , but I think it does.

I don't understand your question about the European/German dialogue.
(Our MEP's send newsletters, are in their home offices respresented - so anyone could take contact with them.)

After 1945, we had had the very same refugee situation. The main differences were a) that people couldn't be mobilised easily as today to act/re-act against them, b) no arson attacks were made against their homes or planned homes.
But people had perhaps different thoughts than being against refugees in those days

I thought it was very inappropriate. It really made him look like the muscle acting for the unknown profiteers of TPP -who stand to gain more if the EU stays together.

The treaty with the EU is TTIP. And it will be done or not with all countries of the EU, so those leaving will have to make an own one.

I think you would stop laughing when the same things happened to the Afro Americans as happens here to the Jews. In Germany, in Denmark and Sweden the synagoges are under police protection. In Malmö. Sweden the majority of Jews have moved because they are not safe anymore. And in Malmö it is not Swedes...

Obama did not only thret an ally, he spoke for a future president who we do not even know whoo it will be.
I have seen in British papers that the Brittish feel he has snubbed them before.
I can´t prove it just remeber reading about it.
He did not bow to the queen just nodded his head - at the previous visit - and afterwards or before had been kissing the hand of a sultan. There are pictures in internet.

Well, i've finally finished watching the entire filum. I found much to decry on aesthetic grounds--it was like a very long political ad. That objection aide, however, i found the allegation about appointed, unelected officials wielding the true power in the EU very disturbing. When NAFTA (the North American Free Trade Agreement) was ratified, several people had objected to their arbitration process, but their objections got steamrolled by the media blitz. Not long afterward, however, many local authorities found this board overruling or ignoring them when they raised environmental objections. That board was appointed, not elected, and had no elected representatives as members, but rather, government bureaucrats and members of corporate boards. Eventually, Federal courts in all three countries began to simply strike down the arbitration board's rulings, and to grant no standing to corporate representatives who attempted to object or appeal. I wonder if there is any possibility of appeal to the rulings of EU commissions.

All of the slick political-style production taken aside, that idea was disturbing to me. Were i a voter in the EU, that alone would give me pause, as did the NAFTA situation here. As for Farange and his wife getting EU salaries, that only makes his objections about the the EU parliament more credible, given that he would be voting himself out of a job as an MEP if Britain withdrew. I'm sure he has other resources, what politician doesn't? I'm sure this is a political football. Bit tThe lack of accountability and of transparency would be unacceptable to me, were i a voter in the UK. I noted in these fora many years ago that a lack of provision for sovereignty issues was a fatal flaw in the EU, and this looks like a glaring case of a consequence of that lacuna.

Thanks to his Lordyship for posting that--i voted his post back up.

Well, just recently Farange claimed that if voters decided to remain in Europe the referendum, it would spell the "end of the steel industry in this country" [UK]. He also said EU membership was a major factor behind the "massacre" of Britain’s manufacturing sector and that a Brexit vote would give British steel "a fighting chance". He voted in the EU parliament against a move to reform EU trade defence rules in 2014. (That amendment would have resulted e.g. in higher anti-dumping measures for steel.)

By the way: British MEPs have voted against revealing how they spend their staff, office and travel allowances - lead by Ukip, but including Conservatives, Labour, and and Liberal Democrats. (That was already in 2015)

You're telling me that politicians are corrupt, dishonest and disingenuous? That's definitional tautology. Is it, or is it not true that the European Parliament has no power to initiate legislation? Is it or is it not true that the EU is effectively governed by appointed bureaucrats who are not accountable to the electorate?

Years ago in a thread here about the EU, i commented that it needs something like the U.S. Senate, in which the sovereignty of the several states resides. I was ignored, probably because other participants just dismissed me as a naïve chauvinist. I wasn't calling for Europe to have a body identical to the Senate in the U.S., though, just that they needed to take account of national sovereignty in the states which were to join the EU.

In 1641, Stafford, a minister of Charles I, was attained by Parliament (with most members abstaining), and was executed, even though he had been earlier acquitted of charges against him. Charles acquiesced in the attainder, and he (Stafford) was executed. Of course, on January 30, 1649, King Charles himself was executed. Without going into the issues that the execution of a king entails, the point is that the appointment and the dismissal of ministers was an important issue in the 17th and 18th centuries. The compromise which created out Senate gave them the power to appoint or to refuse to appoint secretaries (ministers) of executive branch offices, many other executive branch officers as well as the entire Federal bench. Treaties can only be ratified or rescinded on a two thirds vote of the Senate. Along with the Electoral College (i don't intend to discuss the ignorant objections to that institution which so many Europeans make), the institution of the Senate assured the original states that they would hold the power of sovereignty in our government. As the Senate has equal representation by states, this is an obvious institution of sovereignty. Just after our constitution was ratified, the dismissal of Jacques Necker by Louis XVI was a crucial event which lead to the calling of the Estates General, which eventually lead to a successful revolution in France. I don't say that Europe needs to mimic our institutions, but i do say a major flaw in the EU is the lack of any provision for recognition of national sovereignty in member states.

This article from The Telegraph states that there are 170,000 bureaucrats employed by the EU. Yes, i know that many in the UK call The Daily Telegraph the "Torygraph." That does not alter whether or not the claim is true.

We do still have acts of racial violence and that is definitely no laughing matter, but I don't think censorship causes a decline in violence; in fact, I think censorship increases the emotions that fuel racial, religious and ethnic violence.

I think Trump's rise is tied to speech issues.

I saw something like that in a Swedish paper.
Anyway there are 1750 translater, 600 assistents
3000 freelance plus 250 others just in that sector.

Please do not call these hardworking peole bureaucrats.
A journalist who used the term “euro bureaucrats” received an ear-bashing from Jean-Claude Juncker’s chief spokesman Tuesday who said it was not an acceptable way to refer to “European civil servants.”

Is the term bureaucrat considered pejorative in Europe? Certainly American officers of government don't enjoy the sorts of luxurious perquisites that EU "civil servants" enjoy. Be that as it may, i question whether they are working hard for the common electorates of the member nations.

I should be on that list as well: I distrubated leaflets for our MEP

Now you're just being silly . . .











. . . you bloated bureaucratic parasite!