Michael Moore, Hero or Rogue

I disliked him before then, for more than a few reasons.

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I have disliked him for a long time. But Iraq sure didn't help things.

Cycloptichorn

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Could anyone be worse.
Bush talks about evil. I think he is the Devil incarnate masquerading under the guise of religion. Well, maybe that is where he belongs. Religion the evil spell cast upon mankind.

Kerry will IMO make an acceptable president. However, that of course remains to proven. However, Bush has proven what he can do. What we need is someone who can start to undo the damage.

It is odd that the only thing you picked up from my response is Anyone but Bush.

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au1929 wrote:

It is odd that the only thing you picked up from my response is Anyone but Bush.

I read your list and agreed with few of them and thought of some more not on your list.

But I have been hearing this a lot lately that people just hate Bush so much that they will vote for anyone. I don't think that not being Bush qualifies a person to be president.

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Do I really need to answer that question? I could never, understand how people with even a modicum of intelligence voted for that dolt in the first place

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au1929 wrote:

Do I really need to answer that question? I could never, understand how people with even a modicum of intelligence voted for that dolt in the first place

So now we've resorted to name calling?

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Has McG gone to see F 9-11?

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jpinMilwaukee wrote:

au1929 wrote:
Do I really need to answer that question? I could never, understand how people with even a modicum of intelligence voted for that dolt in the first place

So now we've resorted to name calling?

That happens a lot around here.

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When someone says he or she would vote for "anyone but Bush," it's more of a rhetorical statement, jp. We all know who the other options are.

There's no point in being hung up on the expression..

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D'artagnan wrote:

When someone says he or she would vote for "anyone but Bush," it's more of a rhetorical statement, jp. We all know who the other options are.

I didn't actually think you would vote for anybody. But I still fail to see why Kerry would make a better choice.

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Name calling.hell. Calling Bush a dolt is not name calling it is the truth.

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JPM
I know I will not convince you that Kerry is a better choice than Bush. That is a conclusion if you come to it must be arrived at on your own. Just remember, the decisions and policies that Bush has made in the past are the same as those he will make in the future.

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I want to be convinced... I want to vote for the person I feel will best lead this country.

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D'artagnan wrote:

Moore's exaggerations are no worse than the BS generated by the current administration on daily basis. Both take the facts and manipulate them to suit their purposes.

And that's true for Fox News, too. To claim that Moore is uniquely biased is absurd...

I dont think most of us who have expressed distrust of Moore have said he was uniquely biased.

But if you're gonna want to expose Fox News, or whatever counterpart you choose to compare Moore with, for the exaggerations and manipulations they apply, then have the intellectual honesty to take Moore to task for them too. Otherwise we'll all just become partisan hacks.

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c.i. wrote:

Quote:

I turned on the telley this morning (while putting on my clothes) to watch the finance channel, and this guy was saying that religion was being lost in this country, and it will be our down fall. It's people like this guy that scares the bejesus out of me, because these are the very people that supports Bush!

LW wrote:

Quote:

More fear-laden rhetoric. I suppose they're following along with those two bad novelist who wrote all the silly revelation novels that are more popular than Stephen King.

My sister is from this very camp, LW. These "novelists" graduated from the same seminary as my sister's husband, in the same class. They got their ideas from the same source. These outrageous ideas plus good marketing (placing the books on a rounder near the check out counter) have made the books extremely popular.

But I'm saying that among this group, even they are beginning to doubt Bush. My sister has been wondering for some time, but since the war went obviously bad, and since she has draftable sons, she has been on the fence. Moore's movie, or what she's heard about it has made the final difference.

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http://www.swiftvets.com/Index2.htm

Quote:

Good morning. I'm Commander Robert Brant, USN retired, originally from the upper peninsula of Michigan. All the Swift Boat men know me as Friar Tuck. I served in Vietnam as a boat officer from June of '68 to July '69 with three months in Coastal Division 13 in Cat Lo, nine months with Coastal Division 11 in An Thoi while John Kerry was there. I'm here today to express the anger I have endured over 33 years, being accused of war atrocities.

When I leave here, I'm going down to the wall to tell my two crew members and the other 49 Swiftees who are on the wall, that it's not true, that they were, and still are, the best.

My name is Steve Gardner. I served from '66 to '67 and from '68 to '69. The last tour was An Thoi and Cat Lo. I served for over 2 ½ months with John Kerry. I was the third class gunner's mate, within five feet of John Kerry at all times. While I was not on the 94 boat, the boat where he put in for his purple hearts, I did watch his indecisiveness put his boat and crew in jeopardy time after time. His is inability to manage a six man crew properly; I do not believe Kerry is qualified to be our commander-in-chief. I left the Navy, lived in Clover, South Carolina and managed boat dealerships. I'm an ordinary guy with no political agenda and no party affiliation.

Admiral Roy Hoffmann (ret.), Commander of Coastal Division 11 and chair of the group, said many in the group had not seen each other for over thirty years. "I signed this letter because I do not believe John Kerry is fit to the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces of the United States. This is not a political issue. It is a matter of his judgment, truthfulness, reliability, loyalty and trust all absolute tenets of command. His biography, Tour of Duty, by Douglas Brinkley, is replete with gross exaggerations, distortions of fact, contradictions and slanderous lies. His contempt for the military and authority is evident by even the most casual review of this biography. He arrived in country with a strong anti Vietnam War bias and a self serving determination to build a foundation for his political future. He was aggressive, but vain and prone to impulsive judgment, often with disregard for specific tactical assignments. He was a ?'loose cannon.' In an abbreviated tour of four months and 12 days and with his specious medals secured, Lt. J.K. Kerry bugged of Vietnam and began his infamous betrayal of all US soldiers, marines, sailors and airmen, including our POWs in the Vietnam War. His leadership in the Vietnam Veterans Against the War, his testimony before Congress in 1971, charging us with unspeakable atrocities remain as undocumented but nevertheless malicious on the men and women who honorably stayed the course. Senator Kerry is not fit to command. The real ?'brothers' are my shipmates and veterans who reliably and honorably stayed the course. " said Admiral Hoffman.

I'm Charlie Plumly, Captain, USN retired. I served in Vietnam as Chief Staff officer for C.T.F. 115 during Lt. j.g. Kerry's tour, he was under my command for two or three specific operations before his rapid exit. Trust and loyalty are the key operative words. His turncoat performance in 1971 in his grubb shirt, his medal tossing escapade, coupled with his slanderous line in the recent book portraying us that served all POWs and MIAs as murderous war criminals I believe will have a lasting effect on all military veterans and their families, regardless of service affiliation.

In the navy, we have a term, ?'service reputation,' by-and-large, unofficial and unwritten. It means the few words that a sailor's colleagues would use to give a snap shot of someone. Kerry would be described as devious, self-absorbing, manipulative, distain for authority, disruptive, but the most common phrase would have been ?'requires constant supervision.' Admiral Elmo Zumwalt, as Chief of Naval Operations, said....

"REQUIRES CONSTANT SUPERVISION"[/color]....

Somehow or other, that's not the sort of trait I'd look for in a president.

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Yeah, we all know that the guys Kerry accused of committing war crimes are going to have a LOT of great things to say about him.

Quote:

"REQUIRES CONSTANT SUPERVISION"....

And this differs from Bush... how?

Cycloptichorn

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It just made me laugh that an admiral doesn't think his statement isn't political. Quote, "Admiral Roy Hoffmann (ret.), Commander of Coastal Division 11 and chair of the group, said many in the group had not seen each other for over thirty years. "I signed this letter because I do not believe John Kerry is fit to the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces of the United States. This is not a political issue."
This guys been living in Vietnam too long.

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Cycloptichorn wrote:

Quote:
"REQUIRES CONSTANT SUPERVISION"....

And this differs from Bush... how?

Cycloptichorn

Want me to spell it out? I mean, at this point, I'm judging George W. Bush as much by the things which HAVEN'T happened as by those which have. So far at least, in contrast to our last demmunist president, I haven't had to read about or worry about:

An American president porking teenage interns in government offices during working hours.
An American president lying about same both on TV and in front of a federal grand jury and then, when shown to be a total liar by forensic evidence, trying to tell us it depends on the definition of 'is'.
Credible rape allegations against an American president on newspaper headlines.
An American president bombing an innocent Christian nation for 80 days and nights to take same off same headlines.
An American president selling thermonuclear secrets to the chinese communists for campaign cash.
Agents of an American president killing somebody's cat and then telling them one of their children could be next.
An American president sealing a trillion dollar American mineral asset for the benefit of foreign campaign donors.
An American president and his cronies shaking down the Swiss banks for billions of dollars to allow a deal which should have gone through with no undue protocol.
An American president reducing our military to a state of ineffectiveness, delaying a necessary operation like Iraq for a year and a half...

I mean, how much do you want?

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I want more info about "Agents of an American president killing somebody's cat and then telling them one of their children could be next."

I hadn't heard that one...

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Michael Moore, Hero or Rogue

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