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Should Fathers Be Incarcerated for Child Support?

 
 
roger
 
  2  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 12:51 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Apparently these things are true

1) SCOTUS said that states dont have to offer a lawyer before they jail deadbeat dads

2) some states don't


They don't have to. He knows of at least one instance in Kansas in which a lawyer was provided.


Quote:
3) transcripts are not taken in these proceedings so it is impossible to tell if alleged deadbeat dads are actually offered lawyers in the states that claim to provide them

That is a little disturbing, at least to me.

Quote:
Tico saying that he once saw deadbeat dads getting lawyers in Kansas is non responsive.



No, that's perfectly responsive.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 01:02 am
@roger,
roger wrote:
Quote:
3) transcripts are not taken in these proceedings ...

That is a little disturbing, at least to me.
I can't imagine any court procedure where no transcript is taken. I would find it disturbing to file an objection based on oral testimony of a court's ruling.
roger
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 01:04 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Thanks Walter. I was starting to feel like the odd man out.
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  0  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 03:53 am
Perhaps there is a misunderstanding . In Australian Family Law Courts transcripts are not taken, however recordings are contracted to various external organisations and transcripts can be obtained from those recordings . Transcripts can be purchased only by the parties to the proceedings or their lawyers. Only the transcript of proceedings will be included; the documentation will not include judgments, rulings or orders . Under its current records retention policy, the courts retain recordings for 10 years . Therefore, requests for transcripts of proceedings beyond 10 years cannot be processed .
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 10:55 am
@Ionus,
Quote:
Thirteen states have a filed a brief asking the high court to side with South Carolina. They argue that the Constitution’s Sixth Amendment right to counsel applies only to criminal cases, and that a ruling in Turner’s favor quickly could expand to require lawyers for poor people in a number of other civil proceedings, such as child custody hearings — a costly prospect at a time of big budget deficits.

http://bangordailynews.com/2011/03/22/uncategorized/facing-jail-time-deadbeat-parents-seek-out-lawyers/

The fact that 13 states are in this in favor of being able to jail citizens who dont have a lawyer is alarming.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 12:36 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Ticomaya wrote:

hawkeye10 wrote:
I have read that some states run the deadbeat dad jailings through family court, which does not provide lawyers. Is that not correct?

In my particular case, and it was in Kansas, it was through family court, and the state provided lawyers.


Are you claiming to be ignorant of Turner v Rogers? Talking about your personal experience reads as a dodge.

http://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/turner-v-price/

No, I was merely relaying my professional experience in Kansas in the 1990's, where the District Court appointed indigent deadbeat dads counsel if they were facing incarceration. Dumbass.
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 02:15 pm
@Ticomaya,
Quote:
No, I was merely relaying my professional experience in Kansas in the 1990's, where the District Court appointed indigent deadbeat dads counsel if they were facing incarceration.


Have you given any thought to being useful, of taking a position on whether the state should make sure the citizens have a lawyer before they are imprisoned for more than a short time and then putting what ever intelligence you possess into arguing it?

Quote:
Dumbass.

I have done nothing to you, and in this tread all I am trying to do is explore an issue. Your incivility, and all of those other assholes around here who do the same thing, are the ones who drive up the suckage factor around here. Not me.
AdamLOV
 
  0  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 02:26 pm
@ZarathustraReborn,
I highly recommend David Benatar's The Second Sexism. It deals extensively with the many forms of sexism men face in various societies.

http://www.amazon.com/The-Second-Sexism-Discrimination-Against/dp/0470674512
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  3  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 02:30 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
Quote:
No, I was merely relaying my professional experience in Kansas in the 1990's, where the District Court appointed indigent deadbeat dads counsel if they were facing incarceration.


Have you given any thought to being useful, of taking a position on whether the state should make sure the citizens have a lawyer before they are imprisoned for more than a short time?

You querying whether I have given thought to begin useful, is exceedingly rich.

Quote:
Quote:
Dumbass.

I have done nothing to you, and in this tread all I am trying to do is explore an issue. Your incivility, and all of those other assholes around here who do the same thing, are the ones who drive up the suckage factor around here. Not me.

Bullshit. You're not just trying to explore an issue -- you're obviously pushing your agenda, something I am not doing. I relayed my personal experience, and your idiot response was to ask if I was ignorant of a Supreme Court case, which has nothing at all to do with what I posted about, and then you accused me of trying to "dodge" something -- what, I'm not at all clear about. What I am clear about, is that YOU are frequently an asshole, and the "suckage factor" increases exponentially whenever you are online at this forum.

If the "suckage factor" has you down in the dumps, please don't let the door hit you in the ass as you make your final departure from these fora.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2015 02:32 pm
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:
Perhaps there is a misunderstanding . In Australian Family Law Courts transcripts are not taken, however recordings are contracted to various external organisations and transcripts can be obtained from those recordings . ...

That is how we did it in Kansas, and that's how we do it in Arizona.
0 Replies
 
 

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