Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 12:02 am
@Walter Hinteler,
There are 3 compulsory languages from the State education Dept, the actual language is chosen by the school . The first is in Grade 4 . My boys chose Indonesian . There are another two languages in High School . My boys chose Japanese, Chinese and German . There are many others to choose from . Students who have a secondary language at home can usually choose it as one of their languages .

Indonesian, Japanese and Chinese are obvious because they are our neighbours . German is taught because of the amount of modern manufacturing done there .

When I went to school I had to learn French and Latin . French as a left over from the British education system and Latin because it gives a good basis for the sciences .
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 12:39 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Quote:
That is a very interesting opinion.
Gees, Walt, go easy on the severe criticism ! Very Happy From the time of the start of the merging of the Frank and Norman Language, the English language, although accepting far more foreign words since then, is closer grammatically to the original Northern French . If we take into count original words still remaining then English just wins over French . Both languages have gone through major pronunciation and accent changes so they both score about even there .
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 12:46 am
@Walter Hinteler,
My french is worse than I thought .
Does salopards mean bastard, son of a bitch, or we might say a dickhead, douchebag etc...? So if I specifically meant bastard, I would say bâtard ?
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 12:58 am
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:
... the original Northern French . ...
What do you consider to be the "original Northern French"? (And where is/was "Northern France" situated in your educated opinion?
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 01:02 am
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:
... the time of the start of the merging of the Frank and Norman Language ...
That happened when?

I mean, the oldest known sentence in the Frank language is "Maltho thi afrio lito" (early Medieval, 6th century). Later we got the Oaths of Strasbourg - had there been this merging already? (The Normans had settled already in France by this time for quite a period)
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 01:20 am
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:
Does salopards mean bastard, son of a bitch, or we might say a dickhead, douchebag etc...? So if I specifically meant bastard, I would say bâtard ?
I do think that it is easier for native English speaker to translate a French word to English than for a native German speaker to do so.
I only can tell you, the "bâtard" is Bastard in German. Schweinehund
is the equivalent for "salopard".
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 02:25 am
@Walter Hinteler,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langues_d%27o%C3%AFl

I've always known it as the langues d'oui
Quote:
The langues d'oïl (/ˈwiːl/ French: [lɑ̃ɡᵊdɔjl]),[2] or oïl languages (also in French: langues d'oui [lɑ̃ɡᵊdwi]), are a dialect continuum that includes standard French and its closest autochthonous relatives spoken today in the northern half of France, southern Belgium, and the Channel Islands
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 02:30 am
@Walter Hinteler,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langues_d%27o%C3%AFl#Langue_d.27o.C3.AFl


Quote:
Langue d'oïl

In the singular, Langue d'oïl refers to the mutually intelligible linguistic variants of romana lingua spoken since the 9th century in northern France and southern Belgium (Wallonia), since the 10th century in the Channel Islands, and between the 11th and 14th centuries in England (the Anglo-Norman language). Langue d'oïl, the term itself, has been used in the singular since the 12th century to denote this ancient linguistic grouping as a whole. With these qualifiers, langue d'oïl sometimes is used to mean the same as Old French (see History below)
(emphasis mine)

The emphasised part is what I regard as Medieval French . Particularly as it applies to the Île-de-France .

0 Replies
 
Olivier5
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 05:40 am
@Ionus,
Oh, now the ad was 'withdrawn'?

You're making that up as you go along, right?
0 Replies
 
Olivier5
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 05:54 am
@Ionus,
What a load of crapola.... Where does such massive amount of **** come from? Not from Ioio. He did not invent this...

Does this means that, just like there are websites spreading antisemitic 'arguments' explaining why one should hate the Jews, there are websites spreading hatred for the French?

What an honor... Next time i meet with my rabbi Shlomo (he sells shawarmas two blocks away) i'll tell him i feel his pain.
Olivier5
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 06:01 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Quote:
I mean, the oldest known sentence in the Frank language is "Maltho thi afrio lito" (early Medieval, 6th century). Later we got the Oaths of Strasbourg - had there been this merging already? (The Normans had settled already in France by this time for quite a period)

Nope, they came later, 8th century or so. I think.

Btw, bâtard comes from Frankish, and got into English through French. Gathered that last year during the epic Christmas 2013 debate. The one where I established that some 41% of English most common words are of French origin.
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 07:41 am
@Olivier5,
Quote:
Does this means that, just like there are websites spreading antisemitic 'arguments' explaining why one should hate the Jews, there are websites spreading hatred for the French? What an honor... Next time i meet with my rabbi Shlomo (he sells shawarmas two blocks away) i'll tell him i feel his pain.
You dare equate yourself and the French with the Jews ?

Wikipedia:
Quote:
The French national SNCF railway company under the Vichy Government played its part in the "Final Solution". In total, the Vichy government deported more than 76,000 Jews,[63] without food or water (pleaded for by the Red Cross in vain),[63] as well as thousands of other so-called undesirables to German-built concentration and extermination camps aboard the Holocaust trains, pursuant to an agreement with the German government; fewer than 3 percent survived the deportations .... The last train from France left Drancy on 31 July 1944 with over 300 children.


Some of those Jewish children were in nappies . Most camps had a pit for burning babies and children after they had their brains dashed out . Yeah, you poor French .
http://news.yahoo.com/holocaust-victim-descendants-sue-french-railway-us-110039926.html
Quote:
Descendants of Holocaust victims have filed a US lawsuit claiming France's national railway seized the property of tens of thousands of Jews and others sent to Nazi concentration camps.

The class-action suit seeks compensation for the confiscation and sale of personal property and for third-class train fares billed to the Nazis even though the victims were packed into cattle cars.

The suit was filed on Thursday, on International Holocaust Remembrance Day, in US federal court in Chicago.
Olivier5
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 09:07 am
@Ionus,
Apparently, the French share with the Jews the dubious privilege of being the target of much malignity over the Internet... The Americans too, I think: there's lots of anti-American BS on the web.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 09:49 am
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:
I've always known it as the langues d'oui
As the name indicates, it's a Romanic language. And actually, it's a dialect (a "dialect continuum"), not a language.
Modern French comes the langues d'oui which was spoken around and in Paris. The influence of any Nordic language as as large as it is e.g. with German (actually, the influence in German is a lot more).

When you look at where it has been spoken ...
http://i59.tinypic.com/r0cevd.jpg
... it has little to do with "North France".
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 09:17 pm
@Olivier5,
I've had enough of this . If you cant take back calling me a liar then to hell with you, but I dont want to malign the French people any more just because it suited me to bait you .

Every year, there are ceremonies in the North of France where the fallen of many nations are remembered in little villages that no one heard of before WW1 . These salt of the earth people, for the last 100 years, have and are still honouring the sacrifice of others for France . It is just a pity the French Government is so xenophobic towards English speakers and some French people have a chip on their shoulder .

There are very valid reasons why soldiers fail to fight and those reasons apply to any and all nations . No one is genetically predisposed to be a soldier because of where they come from, it is a question of national will and training .

Jews are targeted because oil money buys a lot of opinion .

The USA is targeted, often by its own people, because power attracts stone throwers .

The French are targeted because of their single minded arrogance to their own country without acknowledging the sacrifice of the English speaking world for it .

I still, and this must be the 5th or 6th time I have said it, count the French people I have met as some of the nicest ever...it just doesnt include you, little boy...grow up and learn when to apologise, especially if you call someone a liar .

I have had enough of this as I said at the start, and my parting thought is **** You and all arrogant fools like you .
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 09:28 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
I'm not sure if there is some subtle disagreement with me there or not . What do the pretty colours mean to you ?
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 10:28 pm
@Ionus,
The geographical spread of the Oïl languages (other than French) can be seen in shades of green and yellow on this map it says on your link.
If you look at that map at the ülace of origin, you'll see it as I pasted/copied it, with those regions in-Switzerland marked as well.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 29 Apr, 2015 11:00 pm
@Walter Hinteler,
The Oïl languages as of today are:
Berrichon, Bourguignon-Morvandiau,, Champenois or Campanois,, Franc-Comtois, French, Gallo, Lorrain, Norman, Picard, Poitevin and Saintongeais, Walloon, Angevin, Manceau, Mayennais, Romande, Anglo-Norman.
They are Gallo-Romance languages.
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Apr, 2015 01:10 am
@Walter Hinteler,
It certainly looks Northern France to me...
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Thu 30 Apr, 2015 01:30 am
@Ionus,
Which must be due to the fact that you look at upside down.
People in Belgium, Lorraine, Switzerland and central France certainly would disagree. (In Northern France, the regional language is Ch'ti besides, of course, Dutch/Flemish.)
 

 
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