FOUND SOUL
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 04:32 pm
@FOUND SOUL,
http://topconservativenews.com/2014/05/splc-tries-to-capitalize-on-jewishasian-spree-killer-who-targeted-blonde-women/

Elliot Rodgers is a self-described “Eurasian.” His father, Peter Rodger, is a British born Jewish Hollywood big shot. His father is married to Soumaya Akaaboune, a Moroccan born French actress.

His biological mother is Asian.

Rodger was an extreme narcissist that referred to himself as “drop dead gorgeous, fabulous, stylish, exotic gem among thousands of rocks” and “a superior Alpha male.”

This has not prevented the SPLC, and extreme left-wing fundraising hustle, from attempting to profit on the slaughter. They are calling the perp an extreme misogynist and “racist” while completely omitting the fact that he is a Middle Easterner who targeted white blonde women.

The SPLC has posted three articles now on their fundraising site.

Some reports say the death toll has increased to nine victims.


But his grandfather was a photographer responsible for spreading dirty anti-German propaganda LIES.

"Rodger was one of many photographers to enter the concentration camp at Bergen-Belsen in 1945, the first being members of the British Army Film and Photographic Unit. His photographs of the survivors and piles of corpses were published in Life and Time magazines and were highly influential in showing the reality of the death camps. Rodger later recalled how, after spending several hours at the camp, he was appalled to realize that he had spent most of the time looking for graphically pleasing compositions of the piles of bodies lying among the trees and buildings."
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 04:37 pm
@FOUND SOUL,
Middle easterner?

On the grandfather photographer, I take that quote as rue.

That source seems to have an very weird agenda.

0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  3  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 04:46 pm
@hawkeye10,
This tragedy was also a hate crime--clearly fueled by extremely misogynist views of women, and hostility toward women, and jealousy of other men who were favored by women.

And, in your posts, you seem to support such misogyny and hostile views of women--you seem to think these are, not only normal and acceptable, but completely valid. But part of this man's alleged "mental illness" is the fact that he held such views in the extreme, and he was paranoid in blaming whatever social problems he did have with women, on all women. He saw women as conspiring to make him miserable, and conspiring to make most men miserable. But you also see an anti-male conspiracy of women making the lives of men, particularly young men, miserable. Your constant blaming of women for the problems of men is not that dissimilar from his. And I'd suggest there is pathology and danger in these virulent anti-women views, just as there is pathology and danger in extreme racist or anti-Semitic views. I don't find anything normal and acceptable about any of it.

I think the conversation about this tragedy has to include discussion of the misogyny and hatred of women that fueled his motivation to commit mass murder, and how such misogyny and hostility toward women is promoted and expressed in all sorts of ways in our culture, and the dangers in accepting such views as "normal" or justified. Elliot Rodger could find confirmation for his paranoid anti-female feelings all over the internet, including in many posts made by you. It was the depth of his rage, and his final manner of expressing it--his "retribution"-- that everyone can agree was definitely aberrant, but I think we have to regard his thinking about women as also aberrant because it involves delusional thinking.

I don't think this mass murder likely could have been prevented. Elliot Rodger had not had any history of harming or hurting or threating behavior, he had never been psychiatrically hospitalized, so he could legally buy his guns. He was delusional in his thinking, but apparently not overtly psychotic or schizophrenic--the consensus, right now, from the mental health experts I've listened to, appears to be that he suffered from a personality disorder.

Until he posted a YouTube video, and e-mailed out his "manifesto" just before he committed mass murders, no one might have had reason to suspect he would act out in this way. He knew how to conceal his more extreme thoughts and his plans. He was functioning, he was a college student. Unless someone could have found his "manifesto" and his guns in his apartment, prior to Friday, I doubt that they could have held him in a psych hospital for more than a 72 hour evaluation, if they even would have admitted him, because he knew what to conceal, and he wouldn't have sounded dangerous. He was in therapy, he was receiving treatment, and that had been the case on and off since he was a child. So I'm not sure the mental health system, or his parents, or anyone else is to blame. It is possible that his roommates became aware of his plans just before he was about to execute them, and that might be the reason he killed them, he stabbed them to death--so he wouldn't be stopped.

This isn't like Sandy Hook, Adam Lanza's overt behaviors, before his mass murders, were far more bizarre. Elliot Rodger also wasn't living a socially isolated life, as Lanza was. He was going to college, he lived with roommates, etc. and whatever social problems he did have apparently were not overly alarming to the other people around him. He was also intelligent, and able to express himself quite articulately, and coherently, in his writing.

Unfortunately, we can't lock people up until they act, or until they threaten to act, or show evidence they are planning to act, to harm themselves or others. As delusional as Elliot Rodger's anti-woman thinking was, he apparently wasn't threatening to harm anyone until just before he acted, and lots of people hold extreme, and biased, views, and neither law enforcement nor psychiatry can really take action just on those views.

But maybe we need to look at why it's so easy for a person to purchase multiple guns, and a substantial amount of ammunition, with no red flags raised about that. So far, it's those multiple gun purchases, and the large supply of ammo, that should have raised the most red flags about what might be coming next. Maybe we should monitor those types of multiple gun purchases.

I'm sure we'll learn more as more information comes out. But, right now I think this tragedy should also be regarded as a hate crime, fueled by irrational rage toward women, and not just another mass killing we chalk up to one deranged individual's mental illness. The ramifications of widely promoted "anti-female" thinking, and the acceptability of hostile attitudes toward women, in our culture, also deserve our attention, because these can become manifest in all sorts of harmful ways and acts toward women--carrying out a mass murder is just an aberrant and extreme example.

Elliot Rodger apparently frequented particular Web sites on which hatred of women was expressed and promoted--along with entreaties to rise up and not take oppression by women any longer. Well, his grandiose and disturbed response to that was to buy his guns. While that's obviously not the response most young men would turn to, we should think about the extreme "anti-female" messages of hate young men are being exposed to on the internet, and talk about those, and their impact, as well as other factors that figured into this tragedy.
Moment-in-Time
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 04:50 pm
@ossobuco,
I have posted a link of Elliot Rodgers' parents and he appears in one shot along side them. Elliot had an androgynous appearance in the face and was a slender young man, but there doesn't seem to be anything abnormal regarding his height. His delicate features might have been a turn off to females. At any rate, I do believe this young man to be seriously disturbed. Normal people do not stab to death 3 room mates and mass kill others whom she/he doesn't know.

http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=pictures+of+Elliot+Rodger's+mother&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 06:25 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
This tragedy was also a hate crime
as you well know because we have talked about it a few times I dont believe in hate crime laws, they contribute to injustice and they should be illegal. State of mind should only speak to what the perp intended to do, why someone wants to violate another should be irrelevant. That SCOTUS went along with this makes the top ten list for why SCOTUS sucks.
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 06:26 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
He was a fairly good looking young man. I don't think his inability to ever get a female to go out with him had anything to do with his appearance. It may have been something else about him, like his personality, or the type of girl he was trying to go after. He keeps talking about "beautiful girls"--well, maybe he shouldn't have limited his choices to just the beautiful ones, if that's who he was trying to interest. And he seems rather clueless and shallow about women and about what's attractive to women--like, in his thinking, his $300 sunglasses, and his BMW should have been enough to get him dates.

He's got a whole bunch of YouTube videos posted describing how he feels.

https://www.youtube.com/user/ElliotRodger

I just watched 2 of them, which he had posted 2 days ago. He's clearly not crazy in those, but he was wallowing in self-pity, and anger, because he didn't feel he was getting what he was entitled to get from women. He didn't know why woman weren't falling at his feet. He sounds very narcissistic, and limited in real social awareness, but he definitely didn't sound crazy in the two videos I watched. There's no inking he was planning to carry out a horrendous mass murder very shortly, until that last video he posted, which was not one of the two I just watched. And, by the time that last video had been posted, and his manifesto had been received by others, it was too late to stop him.

Maybe it's because of his strong sense of entitlement, but I thought he didn't come across as at all sympathetic in the 2 videos I just watched, considering the loneliness he talked about. He's more angry and resentful and envious than anything else, but his affect was also somewhat flat--you'd never know he was concealing a murderous rage that he was about to act on.

He complains of feeling "invisible" to women in one of those videos. Well, he certainly found a way to get himself noticed, by everyone, didn't he?
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 06:28 pm
@Buttermilk,
Buttermilk wrote:

God you are so sick...Did you see this kid's videos? I watched it yesterday and today. This kid was clearly mentally unstable and also misogynistic, racially prejudiced, and he was clearly a narcissistic individual on so many levels.


I am sure that you have a great explanation for why a particular persons alleged imperfections make me suck. Drunk
0 Replies
 
panzade
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 06:52 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
He was a fairly good looking young man. I don't think his inability to ever get a female to go out with him had anything to do with his appearance. It may have been something else about him, like his personality, or the type of girl he was trying to go after. He keeps talking about "beautiful girls"--well, maybe he shouldn't have limited his choices to just the beautiful ones, if that's who he was trying to interest. And he seems rather clueless and shallow about women and about what's attractive to women--like, in his thinking, his $300 sunglasses, and his BMW should have been enough to get him dates.

Yeah, i gotta agree firefly.
What's ominous to me is the role social media has in ramping up the social pressures on this young generation; the pressure to conform and the blatant narcissism that must be suffocating to those suffering from mental issues.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 06:58 pm
@hawkeye10,
Who abused him?
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:00 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
as you well know because we have talked about it a few times I dont believe in hate crime laws

I didn't say anything about hate crime laws in my post, so your response is irrelevant.

What I did do in that post, was to compare Elliot Rodger's anti-female attitudes, and the paranoid nature of those, to your own similar paranoid views of women--hostile, and somewhat delusional, views you not only consider normal and acceptable, but also perfectly valid. Well, he thought his views were normal and acceptable, and valid too, when they really weren't.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:05 pm
@firefly,
Quoting firefly, whom I oft agree with, but in this case, no -

"I think the conversation about this tragedy has to include discussion of the misogyny and hatred of women that fueled his motivation to commit mass murder, and how such misogyny and hostility toward women is promoted and expressed in all sorts of ways in our culture, and the dangers in accepting such views as "normal" or justified. Elliot Rodger could find confirmation for his paranoid anti-female feelings all over the internet, including in many posts made by you."

He seemed to have that on his own very early in reaction to one woman. This is one time hawkeye is not the cause.

0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  0  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:07 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

Who abused him?


everyone who helped sell him the message " MEN SUCK!"

Everyone who lied to him about what women want.

Everyone who lied to him about what behavior will get men ahead in life.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:11 pm
@Moment-in-Time,
Agreed.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  2  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:14 pm
I guess that David (Mr. NRA) has no problem that Rodger had little difficulty in gaining a nice legally-obtained collection of guns. It is truly absurd that everyone, even psychos, have easy access to guns.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:15 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
What I did do in that post, was to compare Elliot Rodger's anti-female attitudes, and the paranoid nature of those, to your own similar paranoid views of women--hostile, and somewhat delusional, views you not only consider normal and acceptable, but also perfectly valid. Well, he thought his views were normal and acceptable, and valid too, when they really weren't.


If one feels that the collective is ignoring them, feels that the collective is not fair, feels like the collective will not allow them to have what they want, then they are going to be angry at pretty much everyone in the collective. I dont think his displays of hostility towards groups means anything, it was just a more efficient way of communicating that he was angry with everyone. The entire standard trope of prejudice and bias is useless here.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:23 pm
@hawkeye10,
Hawkeye, you come from Mars to me. I don't know anybody, and I know a great many people, who think men suck (in the sense you mean it), much less assault young boys with that attitude.

You are working your own resentments up the wazoo.

I do know some women who are afraid of men, from past experience, but even so connect to and love a good man.

Sorry, tangent to answer.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:36 pm
@ossobuco,
Back to all that happened.

This child had a lot of trouble, but very many do.
I think this case will, for better or worse, be studied for quite a while.
0 Replies
 
Lash
 
  4  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 07:45 pm
@hawkeye10,
Quote:
I have still a lot to learn about this guy, but my first reaction is " abuse young men and then you will watch them burn this society to the ground as sure as night follows day".

Unintended consequences of us following the feminists in their anti male vendetta. It serves us right, stupidity needs to be punished.

In effect, you're saying that the people who were murdered by this kid - and society at large - deserved this.

Considering women were legally property recently in history, some chicks are making noise about their rights. Women are ramping up vigilance for the care and safety and rights of other women. The NRA, the abortion lobby, the effing teachers' union (hell, any union) and everybody who's anybody is doing it.

Yeah, they can all go too far in my opinion, but women - nor society - deserves to be murdered over it. I know it can seem like overkill to white guys who sort of stand around wondering what the hell is everybody so goosed up about... Your group has been running the world and owning people without the perspective of having ever suffered that treatment as a group.

Promoting women's rights isn't man bashing - though of course, some women like to take it there.

I'd like to know what rights constitute an anti-male agenda. And specifically why women are to blame for this kid's crime.

panzade
 
  3  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 08:06 pm
@Lash,
Quote:
Your group has been running the world and owning people without the perspective of having ever suffered that treatment as a group....Promoting women's rights isn't man bashing

Somebody had to say it. I'm glad it was you.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 25 May, 2014 08:14 pm
@Lash,
No I am not saying that the individuals deserved to be killed, I am saying and did say directly that we the collective deserved this assault. I am also saying and did say that the problem will only get worse until and unless we stop repressing men. Men need to feel good about themselves, men need to have something useful to do, and women need to stop trying to make men into women..


The feminist and all who support them have a lot of culpability in this tragedy, but I would not say all women do. I think these days a minority of women support feminist male bashing.
 

 
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