Elliot Rodger

@firefly,

Quote:

You sound somewhat like the whites in the 1950's and 1960's--who preferred to ignore the more moderate voice, and non-violent strategy of the Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr., and focused instead on the initially more alarming and radical rhetoric of Malcolm X, in order to claim that the entire black civil rights movement was a "dangerous threat".

WOW.

Women are NOT, I will repeat NOT being persecuted, oppressed, or discriminated against like black people were during the civil rights movement.

Good lord, will the B.S. ever end?

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@nononono,

nononono wrote:

Did you pick yours because your name is David?

Just a guess.

See my profile.
I used my e-mail address from Yahoo.

Do u wish to conceal your reasoning???

Did u choose your name while u were fiercely defending yourself
from predatory violence? or maybe a flood? or a fire?

U don t want us to know ?

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@nononono,

Quote:

Women are NOT, I will repeat NOT being persecuted, oppressed, or discriminated against like black people were during the civil rights movement.

Oh, but women were very much being treated in a discriminatory manner socially/politically/economically prior to the civil rights movement. Women were also dis-empowered and disenfranchised much longer than blacks--blacks received the right to vote considerably before women did. And that led to advancements in other areas faster than women.

The civil rights movement included both black rights and women's rights components. The resurgence of feminism, which occurred at that time, was in support of women's rights.

Now you are trying to deny the reality of history.

African Americans are less discriminated against now than they were before the civil rights movement, but that doesn't mean all vestiges of racism and discrimination by race have vanished. The same is true for women. They are less discriminated against now, but all vestiges of discrimination on the basis of their gender haven't vanished either. That's why both groups still need advocates to continue to challenge the status quo.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Geez, Finn, I get you.

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@ossobuco,

Catherine Mackinnon and Andrea Dworkin are the reasons I hate feminism because their philosophes are easily believed by impressionable young college women.

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@Buttermilk,

Buttermilk wrote:

Catherine Mackinnon and Andrea Dworkin are the reasons I hate feminism because their philosophes are easily believed by impressionable young college women.

women who have been conditioned over their entire life to believe that they are victims. I am pleased that as many do resist the programming attempt. If only the blacks would resist equally well,

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@Finn dAbuzz,

But that is the point I will always argue that feminism sets to argue that its entire premise is about equal rights between men and women. That idealistically I agree with, but feminist never touched on why white women have for decades on average make more than black men, or how white patriarchy is systematically harmful.

It took black a feminist like Angela Davis to really point out how those issues

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@firefly,

Well at least I am honest with myself. I primarily see feminism as a threat because the likes of feminist who are like Andrea Dworkin and Mackinnon. If I sound like "those whites in the 50's" I don't see how, and in fact that is a horrible comparison you just made.

1 Reply

@firefly,

Women dis-empowered longer than blacks? Hmm you including slavery in that line of thought or post slavery? White women have since the creation of the United States have benefited off the persecution of others. I would love to read your argument how women have been dis-empowered I am assuming white women so please explain.

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@Buttermilk,

Women were considered property longer than black Americans, and are still openly as a group underpaid. Dare to pay blacks Americans less openly. Women got the right to vote after blacks.

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The greatest sin in religious history - referring to the religion that has largely ruled the world - was attributed to a woman. Due to this - or reflecting historical man's desire to control and dominate women that led to this - women have been pushed into the world's corner, controlled and dominated by a patriarchal society.

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@Buttermilk,

And I, an oldie, haven't read them - they are not me or any woman I know. So it's likely I might agree with you if I did read. But those women don't speak for all of us.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

Yes to all that.

This is annoying, we are supposed to be spatting.

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@Buttermilk,

Does Angela Davis being black make her any less of a feminist? When you disparage "feminists" you're disparaging her too--despite the fact you apparently approve of her advocacy.

And Ms. Davis is not the only feminist to touch on issues of race...

This is currently on the N.O.W. Web site.

Quote:

Are black women MIA in the equal pay debate?

Marjorie Valburn writes for The Washington Post: “Black women are among the lowest paid workers in the United States. In many professions they’re near the bottom of the pay scale. They earn less than white men – on average just 64 cents for every dollar paid to white men – and less than women overall, who earn on average 77 cents for every dollar earned by white men. And despite far outnumbering black men in the labor market, black women also earn less than their low-wage male counterparts.”

Read the original source

http://now.org/read-this/are-black-women-mia-in-the-equal-pay-debate/

These are N.O.W.'s current issues...

Quote:

NOW is a multi-issue, multi-strategy organization that takes a holistic approach to women’s rights. Our priorities are winning economic equality and securing it with an amendment to the U.S. Constitution that will guarantee equal rights for women; championing abortion rights, reproductive freedom and other women’s health issues; opposing racism and fighting bigotry against lesbians and gays; and ending violence against women.
http://now.org/issues/

Stop singling out one or two radical feminists--who many other feminists do not agree with-- to give yourself an extremely lame excuse to attack all feminists or to give yourself an extremely lame excuse to use the terms "feminist"or "feminism" in a pejorative manner.

What you're doing--in referring to the most radical/extreme feminists, and then stereotyping all feminists as being like that-- is like saying that Glenn Close's character in "Fatal Attraction" is a valid representation of how all women act.

N.O.W.--the National Organization for Woman-- represents the face of current feminist advocacy in the real life political/social/economic arena. As a lobbying group they carry far more clout, and influence actual policy far more than any individual academic/philosophical feminists you are coming up with and deeming to be an alleged "threat".

If you think "feminism" is such a "threat', I ask you again, what is N.O.W. doing that poses a "threat" to you?

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@Buttermilk,

I'm really not very interested in a contest concerning which group of people deserve the title of America's Greatest Victims... with white patriarchy being the root of all evil thrown in for good measure.

Blacks are not monolithic, women are not monolithic and white patriarchs are not monolithic. Hell, even feminists are not monolithic.

White Western society is hardly the only patriarchal society in history and women have been and continue to be oppressed by men of all sorts of colors and creeds, just as oppression based on differences (race or otherwise) has been going on since social groups were first formed.

I need to be judged by my actions and attitudes toward women, not by my heritage. I have absolutely no justification to demand a trophy, but I'm not about to wear a hair-shirt either.

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@Buttermilk,

Your negation of something as important as the rights of women due to your dislike of two extremist mouthpieces is equally as disgusting as bigots of different stripes.

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@firefly,

Excellent comparison, firefly.

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@Finn dAbuzz,

I wrote:

I'm not, at all, immediately put-off by a woman who considers herself a feminist unless it's clear that that's about all she considers herself. Anyone so obsessed with anything that it provides them with the near totality of their identity will invariably prove, at the very least, to be obnoxious, and probably dangerous.

Although I hadn't told her about this thread, my wife just sent me the following link:

http://www.truthrevolt.org/commentary/millett-no-gun-ever-killed-anyone

It was written by Mallory Millett the sister of Hall-of-Fame feminist, Kate Millett:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kate_Millett

Interesting reading relative to both Elliot Rogers and Feminists (or at least one famous feminist). Mallory Millett relates that her sister was dangerously, mentally ill and describes her as a "brutal sadist." She further charges she is, in part, responsible for the state of mental illness treatment in this country; the release of thousands of mentally ill patients to city streets.

1 Reply

@firefly,

Again, you're putting words in my mouth.

What I said was that it's ridiculous to equate women in CURRENT society to them struggling like black people did during the civil rights movement. But now you're saying that white women struggled just as much as black people did during slavery?!?!?!?!?

Let's all take a ride down BULLSHIT river while we're at it!!

Black people were treated worse than animals; and you're equating that to women getting the right to vote? Boo Frickin Hoo!

The truth is women in today's society (in the western world at least) have more privileges than ANY OTHER group of people!!! Not only do they get all same rights as men, but they don't have to take anywhere near as much of the responsibilities!! All they have to do is proclaim that they're victims/martyrs/oppressed by men; and the media, the courts, the government, and society in general comes running to their aid!!!

If you want to live your life with a persecution complex, that's fine. But go sell crazy somewhere else..

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@Lash,

Quote:

women have been pushed into the world's corner, controlled and dominated by a patriarchal society.

The "Patriarchy" does not exist!

And generally speaking women do lie, deceive, tempt, and manipulate more than men do. Just look at the deceit in altering one's true appearance on a DAILY basis with makeup. It's part of daily life to women; second nature.

1 Reply

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