The Great Christmas Debate

@Olivier5,

This site has members from several Country's, some are Americans but there are also Canadians, Australians, British and at least one member posts from Germany. I may have left some nationalities out, but if I did, I probably just don't know who they are. I'm third generation Irish heritage, American, married to a Frenchman who is also an American.

I am sorry you feel as if everyone is picking on you, but as an American I am grateful to France for supporting the American Revolution. Many Americans died in France during WW I and WW II, and are buried there. And don't we all have enough on our plate, why has this become my country is better than your country arm wrestling contest.

However, because I like France does not mean I don't enjoy the British, Australian, Canadian and New Zealand cultures. I'm not leaving our German member out, most of us are friends and some of us are cousins.

I'm not going to participate in trading insults based on country of origin, just not that invested. Everybody in America came from someplace else, so kind of hard for me to get spun up.

1 Reply

@glitterbag,

Thanks for this, it helps. For the record, I did not say nor do I think everybody is picking on me. There are many wonderful people on A2K who never picked on anyone I'm sure, let one on me.... But it is an observation of mine that some ganging up can happen on occasion, and it did happen here. Not that I care, I can handle it, but it explains a lot.

I personally likes language and languages. I particularly love English, like many foreign speakers, and of course I also love my native language. To me, the inter-penetration of English and French has a strong positive message: we speak the same language, we share much in common across the Chanel, etc. Language does not only divides us, it also ties us. We're all mongrels, even in Europe. Sharing is the rule of the game. I appreciate your post very much because it does start from a positive attitude.

But as it happened, the point I made was met with such staunch, stubborn resistance, diversions, and -- to borrow a very Setantanesque word -- by such SNEER, that I started to suspect something. And then Foofie spilled the beans on how bad the French are...

I believe what happened is very simple: Lordtwat and Izzy's national pride and 'ambivalence' about the French was fired up, and played a sad role in this debate. For Set, it less clear, it has to do with culture rather than nation: apparently the French can't be said to have influenced English culture... Whatever.

I don't care -- my skin is thick enough and it's their loss in the end... It doesn't affect my take on other posters, it was just a fun fight, and I have learned something interesting during the discussion, and I hope others have been entertained and informed as well. All is well that ends well. Smile

2 Replies

@Olivier5,

Well good, that makes me feel better. As a rule of thumb I don't read Foofies posts, they are always, (I hate to generalize! But) just a tad stupid. I do have a soft spot for HisLordship, perhaps you two got off on the wrong foot. Try to start over with HisLordship, he has a great sense of humor, and frankly I'm a lot less likable, I'm a much bigger smart ass (3rd generation Irish) and I have a ton of non-friends on A2K who get steamed every time I show up. Some posts are great, some are a nightmare and hey, it won't be long before the Holidays are over and things can get back to normal. Hope everything from now on gets better.

0 Replies

@Olivier5,

Nobody's picking on you. You act in a very boorish manner by taking over a thread, and telling everyone we should appreciate the French more. You said 50% of the English language was French which is wrong, and that our culture was predominantly French which is also wrong. You were the one who started with the racist insults about small cocks and low intelligence, then you like to act the martyr.

It's really quite pathetic, if you don't want people to be rude to you don't be rude to them, or insist on being the centre of attention, especially as you have don't have a sense of humour.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

We're just tired of your endless clichés about us. Anti-froggism has become the only acceptable form of racism among Anglo-Saxons. You wouldn't dare to say on a public forum that black people need to wash more, that Indian Americans are lazy or that the Jews think too highly of themselves, now would you? But the French can be abused at no cost, they'll take it in the chin right? Your attitude is racist, and no better than JTT's attitude towards America.

Same ****, different assholes...

And that's valid for Set and Izzy and Lordtwat and the rest of the assholes gang, with the difference that they are more 'constipated' than you are. Too PC probably.

Awww.....who's a widdle diddle dumpling den.... It's OK, the nasty Anglos didn't mean it. Here, have my handkerchief and a Sherbet Lemon.

Disclaimer: Only one of the above words originated from French. Although three definitely point towards being Danish, this in no way means that the Viking culture is in any way responsible for this thread. 'Diddle Dumpling' is a trademark name and can be copied only under license. Sherbet Lemons are high in sugar and are not recommended by the British Dental Association.

1 Reply

@Lordyaswas,

Save that handkerchief to wipe out the tears, sweat and blood off Izzy's face, sweety. I think he's a bit traumatized by these 41%... And if you don't know where best to put your sherbet, I'll be glad to explain.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Good Morning, Hamish!

Had your breakfast yet? Wink

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@Olivier5,

Quote:

"40% of the commonly used words" was what I predicted,

You don't seem to realize that your posts aren't deleted. Anyone can go back and read them and see what you actually said.

http://able2know.org/topic/228713-1#post-5516337

Quote:

Half of the English vocabulary is of French origin, too.

The last time I checked vocabulary doesn't mean 'commonly used words.' The English vocabulary would consist of all English words.

You then posted this.
http://able2know.org/topic/228713-2#post-5516635

Quote:

How many Brits know that close to half the words they use in every day life come from French?

No, you didn't start out predicting that 40% of the 10,000 most common words were of French origin. You made statements that upon examination were clearly false and your attempt to now claim 40% of commonly used words was your prediction is nothing but an attempt to rewrite what you said.

I would suggest anyone go back and read your posts rather than listening to you or me on this subject.

You don't seem to understand that because you changed your statements based on data provided by others it was you that didn't have the data and never cared to look before you made your statements.

Once again....

I would suggest anyone go back and read your posts rather than listening to you or me on this subject.

2 Replies

@parados,

Actually, he first stated that Brits were of French origin.

The first seven posts on this thread were various bits of silly jollity, with no question of nationalities and their good/bad points being raised, and then Hamish MacDubois turned up and changed the entire subject.

By the "superior" knowing smile icon he used on that post, it would be a fair guess that his intention was either to belittle or provoke.

He was then quickly proved wrong regarding the origin question, then got the hump and moved on to language, where he testiculated again and was once again shown to be wrong.

That he now states that the big bad boys are ganging up on him is laughable. He blustered in and shot his mouth off. Various people then shot him down.
It's all a bit old hat now, really. The only thing I've actually learnt from all this is that he is as French as Derek Trotter.

Bonnet de douche!

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

We're just tired of your endless clichés about us. Anti-froggism has become the only acceptable form of racism among Anglo-Saxons. You wouldn't dare to say on a public forum that black people need to wash more, that Indian Americans are lazy or that the Jews think too highly of themselves, now would you? But the French can be abused at no cost, they'll take it in the chin right?

Au contraire. Using statistics of how many words were of French origin is a non-sequitor to any French pride, since as I recently read in Bill Bryson's 1990 book, Mother Tongue (a history of the English language, spelling, speaking, etc.), the Academie Francaise, founded by Cardinal Richelieu in 1635, has literally "policed" the French language to be pure French. And, English never had such an Academy, not in Britain, nor in other English speaking countries. It was just the latest dictionaries that were either prescriptive (how one should talk), or descriptive (how the word is used) that English speakers had as a language guide.

In effect, in my opinion, this thread is adding apples to oranges, since the two languages have evolved under totally different paradigms. And, English prides itself it its ability to incorporate foreign words into the language.

If you feel the French are the brunt of anti-French sentiment, are you sure that none of that sentiment is warranted in a "general sense." Considering the U.S. had to win their country back for them two times in the 20th century, could it be that after each war the French collectively reverted back to loving their Frenchness, ever so much, and seemed to forget how they nearly lost their country, if it was not for the U.S. and Britain. I know the veteran cemeteries are well taken care of in France, but I am talking about the culture. Do you think the word "humble" is part of the French national character? It might be hard to admit that a people that you have affection for might act a bit self-absorbed at times, in my opinion.

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@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

A lot of it's down to how you classify a word. Take vaccination for example, it comes from the French word for cow, vache. That was because Edward Jenner used cowpox to vaccinate against small pox.

That doesn't make the word French. Prior to Edward Jenner the French didn't have a word for vaccination, they had a word for cow. Vaccination is an English word using a French root, it doesn't come from French.

That root is just a Romantic Language root. In Spanish, cow is vaca. Spanish milkmaids were getting the same protection from smallpox. Was Edward Jenner French? It could have been called "uber udder"?

0 Replies

All this debate about the origin of the word vaccination and nobody checked this?

Quote:

As early as 1881, Louis Pasteur honored Jenner by christening the process "vaccination", for the vaccinia virus of cowpox.

Source

1 Reply

@Lordyaswas,

Quote:

By the "superior" knowing smile icon he used on that post, it would be a fair guess that his intention was either to belittle or provoke.

My intention, as evidence by the REGULAR SMILE EMOTICON, was to crack a joke, but you guys have no sense of humor, and judging from what you just said and all these sinister intentions you suspect in me, you're paranoid too. And delusional too, if you think you proved me wrong.

This tangent sub-thread has lasted too long and has become dominated the bad vibes emitted by a few sore losers, so I'd rather leave it alone. But one lesson I draw is: I should have asked for your own guesstimate first. Then we would be in a better position to objectively conclude who won the argument, whose estimate proved the closest. I started with half and arrived at 41%, so yes I had to revise my position based on data I COLLECTED AND PRESENTED HERE. Izzy said: less than Danish/Norse words and hasn't arrived at anything yet, from what I can tell. What was your and Parados' and Set's starting point, we will never know now...

So let me wish you a happy retirement on our shores, and lots of love and all for the season. I'm at your disposal if you want to receive another spanking on another thread.

1 Reply

@parados,

Code:I would suggest anyone go back and read your posts rather than listening to you or me on this subject.

I second that if they care as much, which I kinda doubt...

1 Reply

@timur,

timur wrote:

All this debate about the origin of the word vaccination and nobody checked this?

Quote:
As early as 1881, Louis Pasteur honored Jenner by christening the process "vaccination", for the vaccinia virus of cowpox.

Source

Now who does this Pasteur guy think he is? He's just French, right? So how could he possibly have had any influence on anything??? ;-)

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@izzythepush,

Quote:

if you don't want people to be rude to you don't be rude to them

And when was I rude to you? Please be specific.

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Code:I would suggest anyone go back and read your posts rather than listening to you or me on this subject.

I second that if they care as much, which I kinda doubt...

Again, I suggest anyone go back and read your posts to see how you misrepresent what you said.

1 Reply

@parados,

Anyone interest enough should look at this post or that post, way up-thread on PAGE 7 of this now 17 pages long debate, where I was guessing the correct percentage and you were arguing against it. And at the post where I provided data supporting the "41% out if the 10,000 most frequent words" fact.

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@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

My intention, as evidence by the REGULAR SMILE EMOTICON, was to crack a joke, but you guys have no sense of humor,

If you have to point it out, it's not really a joke. Do you carry a horn about to parp when in frivolous mood?

0 Replies

@Olivier5,

Your whole manner was rude, in that you took over the thread just to scald us all for not appreciating the French. You exaggerated and downright lied about French influence, and told us how grateful and proud we should all be of our collective French heritage. When nobody was prepared to kiss your arse, which came as no surprise to anyone but you, you took umbrage, accused us of ganging up on you, and of hating the French.

That's when I accused you of acting like a stereotype.

1 Reply

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