The Great Christmas Debate

You're talking bollocks.
The Normans kept taking the French king up the backside with their skirmishes and raids, and in the end the only way that the French king could get peace was to GIVE them Normandy, but save face in the process by getting them to agree to the title Duke, thereby indicating that they were technically lower in rank.
France had NO control whatsoever over Normandy, and William the Bastard was king in all but name, and even then he rectified that situation by taking the English throne.

If you want to talk DNA, then do some research and you will find that the vasf majority of Brits are made up from Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Frisians, Picts and Celts.
There may be a smattering of French (Gaul?), because we're all mongrels to a certain extent, but I would guess that it is a miniscule drop in the ocean in the great scheme of things.
Have you ever seen a true Norman? You'll see them all over the place in Northern France.......round face, shortish, blond, stocky.....just like their counterparts in Scandinavian countries....and Britain.
Now look at a proper Frenchman....the vast majority of people born south of Normandy.
Black or very dark brown hair, brown eyes...just think Sarkozy.....much more Mediterranean.

Genetically, the Brits and the French are surprisingly different, considering only 20 odd miles separate the two countries.

If you have time ( there are 3 episodes, but very much worth a look) I would recommend this series.....

Episode1.....

Plenty of Brits with dark hair... And many French have blond hair. The Franks were a German tribe. We're all mongrels anyway. But I find it funny how many Brits hate their French heritage. They should be proud of it!

At the historical period of which you speak (11th century c.e.) the term "French" is pretty meaningless. The King of France actually had a lot less power than some of his vassals, the Dukes who ruled as absolute monarchs in their provinces. England was never conquered by "the French." It was subdued by the Duke of Normandy, William, at the Battle of Hasings (1066) who then claimed the throne and made himself King of England as well as Duke of Normandy. The French king or court had nothing to do with it nor any say in the matter.

Bryan Sykes of Oxford is a geneticist who has done extensive studies of both modern DNA (MtDNA in particular) and samples from old burials. From the Wikipedia article (which can be read by clicking here):

Ok, I withdraw "France". Knights from Normandy, the rest of France and Flanders invaded England, under the leadership of a man of Norse origins but wholly assimilated culturally speaking. None of these guys appeared to speak Norse, lest we forget...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_words_of_Old_Norse_origin

I am proud of my heritage, which goes way way back to probably Roman times and centres around Anglesey and the North Coast of Wales.
I also have great pride in the French arm of my modern day family, who live and work around Geneve, Gex, Ferney and other remote parts of the Jura.
I have lived and worked with the cattle farmers in and around Charolles and have enjoyed their company immensely.
I intend to move to the Charolles area, or possibly the Auverne or Dordogne regions within the next two to three years if all falls into place, and am looking forward to it immensely.
I have a brother who has lived in France so long, that he actually says that he now dreams in French, and when I take him an english novel, he finds himself naturally translating it into French as he reads.....and he was a true Brit for over 30 years before he went to live there.

So don't try second guessing me as to what I hate and what I sbould be proud of, Olly.

You posted stuff which needed correcting, and you did it to wind me up, which worked a treat.
See? You must be French!

"Words of Old Norse origin have entered the English language, primarily from the colonisation of eastern and northern England between 865 and 954 CE "

So these words, in the main, don't come from the Franco-Normans, who spoke some version of old French or another...

Yes, I am French, and yes, I did post this to fire Britons up. but I still find if surprising how this part of our common history is euphemised, hidden or ridiculed in the English culture.

You were talking of the impact of French on English, implying Norse had less of an impact which is patently not true.

See? That's exactly what I am saying. How many Brits know that close to half the words they use in every day life come from French?


According to surveys,[1][2] the percentage of modern English words derived from each language group are as follows:
Latin (including words used only in scientific / medical / legal contexts) ≈29%
French ≈29%
Germanic ≈26%
Greek ≈6%
Others ≈10%

Considering that many Latin words are scientific, the impact French had on common English surpasses that of any other language.

Given that French borrowed heavily from English from end of 19th century onward, there are some words which crossed the Channel twice. 'Ticket' is one of them. The English word is now standard French ("un ticket de cinema") but comes originally from 'etiquette' (a small piece of paper, a tag).

Why no link to your source?

Even if one accepts his claim without knowing the source, 29% is not close to half, it's only slightly more than one quarter. Who cares, anyway? Is he stroking his ego?

Forgot to post it. That was wiki.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_English_words_of_international_origin

I'm educating you Set. You should be thankful.

The map of the y Haplogroups in European populations (mostly acquired from cadaver specimens of known ages I more revealing than arguing about linguistic travels

DAMN, wouldn't let me resize. Heres another version (wame stuff different colors)

See? On the first diagram I am mainly green with purple wedge and only a sliver of black......and pointing from twelve o'clock to two.
No yellow at all, and certainly not pointing to almost six o'clock!

Told you!

Who belongs to R1b?

Not to put too fine a point on it . . . bullshit.