15
   

What Christmas Means To Me

 
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 05:16 am
@maxdancona,
Quote:
There is a basic assumption to this thread that if you do not like the idea of the government taking your money to spend on other people you are not very "Christian," and if you are a Christian and feel this way, you are a hypocrite.

I'm hardly a student of the New Testament, but I do recall Jesus was said to have commented something like "Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's, and unto God that which is God's"

It's pretty popular these days for liberals to insist that Jesus was a liberal himself or even a socialist.
maxdancona wrote:
It is much more than that.

Jesus was about forgivenness. Todays "Christians" are militantly against amnesty.
U mean for illegal aliens to sneak into America??
Its OUR country, not theirs.



maxdancona wrote:
Jesus said "turn the other cheek".
Todays "Christians" are passing deadly Stand your Ground laws.
Yeah, he said to buy a sword,
if u don 't already have one,
even if u have to sell your cloak to finance it.
Luke 22:36
We can EXTRAPOLATE to modern personal defensive ordnance.



maxdancona wrote:
Jesus said "do not judge".
Today's "Christians" are doing everything they can to stop the "homosexual agenda".
Jesus said "love your enemy".
Today's "Christians" not only hate Muslims, they actively to stir up hatred among others.
Yeah, we r a little annoyed
qua what thay did on 9/11/1.


maxdancona wrote:
Jesus also said "love your neighbor" and "sell your possessions
and give to the poor". Anyone who lives like this has my full respect.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 05:20 am
@Finn dAbuzz,
Finn dAbuzz wrote:
There is a basic assumption to this thread that if you do not like
the idea of the government taking your money
ROBBERY is against the 1O Commandments.


Finn dAbuzz wrote:
to spend on other people you are not very "Christian,"
and if you are a Christian and feel this way, you are a hypocrite.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 06:16 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Jesus was about forgivenness. Todays "Christians" are militantly against amnesty.
Jesus said "turn the other cheek". Todays "Christians" are passing deadly Stand your Ground laws.
Jesus said "do not judge". Today's "Christians" are doing everything they can to stop the "homosexual agenda".
Jesus said "love your enemy". Today's "Christians" not only hate Muslims, they actively to stir up hatred among others.

Jesus also said "love your neighbor" and "sell your possessions and give to the poor". Anyone who lives like this has my full respect.



Whoa there Old Paint. If a Christian is trying to be Christ like, that is a tall glass of water to drink. When do mere mortal men have the capacity of a divine presence? Don't forget that Jesus healed the sick, lame and brought Lazarus back from the dead. I guess that plain old citizens should start doing that too?

And, if Jesus said "do not judge," then what was he doing with the Romans? He seemed to have his message for only fellow Jews, not Romans, since he was allowing himself the liberty of judging Romans?

All quite complicated when one analyzes the message.

The use of the word Christian to denote any follower of Jesus might be the problem. Remember, some Christains look to both Testaments to see what God laid out as a story line. Others just look to a hierarchal organization for the current episode of "Being a Christian." Perhaps, Catholics should fine-tune their moniker with, "Forgiving Christians," and Protestants should refer to themselves as, "Realistic Christians"?

0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 07:14 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
There is a basic assumption to this thread that if you do not like the idea of the government taking your money to spend on other people you are not very "Christian," and if you are a Christian and feel this way, you are a hypocrite.

I'm hardly a student of the New Testament, but I do recall Jesus was said to have commented something like "Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's, and unto God that which is God's"

It's pretty popular these days for liberals to insist that Jesus was a liberal himself or even a socialist.


It is much more than that.


Jesus was about forgivenness. Todays "Christians" are militantly against amnesty.
Jesus said "turn the other cheek". Todays "Christians" are passing deadly Stand your Ground laws.
Jesus said "do not judge". Today's "Christians" are doing everything they can to stop the "homosexual agenda".
Jesus said "love your enemy". Today's "Christians" not only hate Muslims, they actively to stir up hatred among others.

Jesus also said "love your neighbor" and "sell your possessions and give to the poor". Anyone who lives like this has my full respect.



Since you've decided to use quote marks around the word, just who are these "Christians?" for which you have such contempt?

Anyone who sells their possessions and gives the proceeds to the poor has my respect as well. I can't imagine that there are more than a relative handful of such people, irrespective of their religious views, and so it is a highly unrealistic standard for living one's values.



Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 07:26 am
@maxdancona,
Well, there are several interpretations of this comment and yours is but one...and by no means the most highly regarded of them all.

One non-Christian, for whom I have great respect, had this view of it's meaning:

"Jesus evaded the direct question put to him because it was a trap. He was in no way bound to answer it. He therefore asked to see the coin for taxes. And then said with withering scorn, "How can you who traffic in Caesar's coins and thus receive what to you are benefits of Caesar's rule refuse to pay taxes?" Jesus' whole preaching and practice point unmistakably to noncooperation, which necessarily includes nonpayment of taxes"

0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 07:33 am
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
Since you've decided to use quote marks around the word, just who are these "Christians?" for which you have such contempt?


I don't see how I could have been any more clear. I even gave specific examples.
maxdancona
 
  3  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 07:35 am
@OmSigDAVID,
I don't think you would have liked Jesus very much.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 07:43 am
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Quote:
Since you've decided to use quote marks around the word, just who are these "Christians?" for which you have such contempt?


I don't see how I could have been any more clear. I even gave specific examples.


So you quite tacitly have acknowledged that your original statement was bigoted.

Let's try a different avenue to make things more clear and narrow down who these contemptible Christians are.

What percentage (routghly) of all who self-describe as Christians in America (presumably your "Christians" are American) are, by your measure, "Christians?"

Who are their spiritual leaders? (And if you can be specific here it would be helpful).

0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  0  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 08:54 am
Finn DaBuzz said: "Jesus' whole preaching and practice point unmistakably to noncooperation, which necessarily includes nonpayment of taxes"
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Hmm...here's the verse- "They asked him if they should pay taxes to Rome or not. Jesus said 'Caesar's head on is on the coin, so give to Caesar that which is Caesar's, and give to God that which is Gods'" (Matt 22:21)

so his advice was that they should pay taxes to keep out of trouble, rather than refuse to pay and have the Roman Army go on a killing spree which would benefit nobody.
Paul said the same sort of thing when he wrote a letter to the christian community in Rome itself, telling them to be cool and keep their heads down-
"The one in authority is God’s servant for your good....therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience" (Romans ch 13)

That makes sense, because the early christian church in Rome and Israel were able to grow without fear of invasion by other countries because nobody dare attack Rome or its province of Israel..Smile
trying2learn
 
  0  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 09:32 am
"What Christmas Means To Me"
Nothing
0 Replies
 
Eva
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 02:34 pm
A nice conversation in my middle school Newspaper class last week... The boys were discussing article ideas for their December issue.

Me: Who's next? Let's hear your ideas...
1st Boy: I could write an article on what everyone wants for Christmas.
2nd Boy: Can we do that? Write about Christmas?
3rd Boy: Yeah, I'm Muslim. We don't celebrate Christmas.
(short silence)
1st Boy: Hey, I'm Muslim too, but we always have presents!
3rd Boy: No fair!
2nd Boy: Well, I guess it's OK then!

Me: (goes off into explanation of cultural vs. religious holidays...)
0 Replies
 
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 03:01 pm
I wrote this a few years back on my regular Christmas thread:
A holiday without joy is no holiday at all. I am sad for the ones with no joy in the season. It's like a chunk out of my joy. I wish for just once there could be a true Father Christmas to visit all the people of the world. I believe that one visit would alter history for the good.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 06:05 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Romeo Fabulini wrote:

Finn DaBuzz said: "Jesus' whole preaching and practice point unmistakably to noncooperation, which necessarily includes nonpayment of taxes"
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Hmm...here's the verse- "They asked him if they should pay taxes to Rome or not. Jesus said 'Caesar's head on is on the coin, so give to Caesar that which is Caesar's, and give to God that which is Gods'" (Matt 22:21)

so his advice was that they should pay taxes to keep out of trouble, rather than refuse to pay and have the Roman Army go on a killing spree which would benefit nobody.
Paul said the same sort of thing when he wrote a letter to the christian community in Rome itself, telling them to be cool and keep their heads down-
"The one in authority is God’s servant for your good....therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience" (Romans ch 13)

That makes sense, because the early christian church in Rome and Israel were able to grow without fear of invasion by other countries because nobody dare attack Rome or its province of Israel..Smile


First of all Finn did didn't say what you quoted, Gandhi did.

Secondly, Paul was, obviously, not Jesus.

Perhaps Jesus was just trying to keep his followers from stirring up the Romans, but I think not. You can though.

0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 08:04 pm
Finn said: "First of all Finn did didn't say what you quoted, Gandhi did"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well you should have said so!
Here's part of your Gandhi quote again-
"Jesus' whole preaching and practice point unmistakably to noncooperation, which necessarily includes nonpayment of taxes"

The fact is, Jesus said "Pay your taxes", so I don't know where Gandhi got the idea that Jesus didn't want people to pay taxes.
It sounds as if Gandhi was trying to make it look like Jesus would have backed Gandhi's non-cooperation policy against the British!
Hey Mahatma, get on here..Smile-

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g64/PoorOldSpike/naughty-step_zpseb4d36c1.jpg~original


JTT
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 08:34 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
U mean for illegal aliens to sneak into America??
Its OUR country, not theirs.


Yeah, we stole it!
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 09:31 pm
@JTT,
We stole it legally. Jesus wanted us to have it.

0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Mon 18 Nov, 2013 10:12 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
You should have taken a breath and read what I wrote. If you go ba ck and read my post you should realize there is no way a rational reading would conclude it was something I was laying claim to. Can't any of you clowns ever admit you we're wrong?

You have a problem with Gandhi? I bet it's the first time ever.

In any case take it up with him .
0 Replies
 
 

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