Did Jesus Actually Exist?

@Krumple,

Quote:

It calls into question the reliability of the stories.

Ahhh...so you think the gap in time calls into question the reliability of the stories of him raising the dead, walking on water, feeding a thousands with a few fish and loaves...and stuff like that.

Hummm. I see!

Anyway...this is much more fun if you ignore my questions! Wink

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

Quote:
It calls into question the reliability of the stories.

Ahhh...so you think the gap in time calls into question the reliability of the stories of him raising the dead, walking on water, feeding a thousands with a few fish and loaves...and stuff like that.

Hummm. I see!

Anyway...this is much more fun if you ignore my questions!

Well yeah. If those things were to occur now they would be heavily reported on because they are so unusual, not just unusual but they have never occurred before.

So you see a man walk on water and feed a thousand people with two fish and two loaves of bread and convert water into wine, yet not say anything about these things or record them? You wait 40 years before doing so and no first hand eye witnesses are doing the recording.

Is it possible that these things supernaturally occurred? Well sure there is a possibility but they are highly unlikely and the fact that they were not recorded as they were conducted calls them into question especially since no first hand eye witness did any of the recording.

1 Reply

@Krumple,

There is no first hand account of anyone inventing the wheel...but you see them all over the place That is a fairly monumental achievement...but we have no archive of who the person was.

We do not know the name of the man who built the pyramids...but they are there for us to see. That is a fairly monumental achievement...but we have no archive of who the person was...or the plans he used...or the foremen who supervised the project.

Stonehenge...great thing. Unique. Monumental.

Who???

The lack of the kinds of evidence you are looking for, Krumple, may be due to all sorts of (reasonable) things.

My point: The answer to the question is: We do not know...not "no, he did not" or "yes, he did."

2 Replies

Recording of events at the time the wheel was invented would have been spotty and possibly not in use as yet.

1 Reply

@edgarblythe,

edgarblythe wrote:

Recording of events at the time the wheel was invented would have been spotty and possibly not in use as yet.

Absolutely. And that is a good reason...a reasonable reason that it was not.

But there may be good, reasonable reasons for why the ministry of Jesus was not recorded...despite the fact that some things were. There certainly is the possibility of good, reasonable reasons for why they were not...just as the ministries of Aarnonon and Rapientias were not.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

There is no first hand account of anyone inventing the wheel...but you see them all over the place That is a fairly monumental achievement...but we have no archive of who the person was.

We do not know the name of the man who built the pyramids...but they are there for us to see. That is a fairly monumental achievement...but we have no archive of who the person was...or the plans he used...or the foremen who supervised the project.

Stonehenge...great thing. Unique. Monumental.

Who???

The lack of the kinds of evidence you are looking for, Krumple, may be due to all sorts of (reasonable) things.

My point: The answer to the question is: We do not know...not "no, he did not" or "yes, he did."

You are comparing tangible things to written claims? Really?

I can see the pyramids and stonehenge as well as a functioning wheel. I don't need their inventors to claim that they constructed them. The same would be true if there were people living today who could take two loafs of bread and two fish and feed over a thousand people. Or convert water into wine magically. Raise the dead, ect.

If there were people living today who could do these feats then it WOULD validate the claims in the bible. But there aren't any. I don't need to interview the person who invented the wheel to know how it functions. There is a **** load of archaeology behind the construction of the pyramids. I don't need to speak with the builders to believe they exist.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Yeah - Like nobody saw any of those things.

0 Replies

@Krumple,

Quote:

You are comparing tangible things to written claims? Really?

I can see the pyramids and stonehenge as well as a functioning wheel. I don't need their inventors to claim that they constructed them. The same would be true if there were people living today who could take two loafs of bread and two fish and feed over a thousand people. Or convert water into wine magically. Raise the dead, ect.

If there were people living today who could do these feats then it WOULD validate the claims in the bible. But there aren't any. I don't need to interview the person who invented the wheel to know how it functions. There is a **** load of archaeology behind the construction of the pyramids. I don't need to speak with the builders to believe they exist.

Are you suggesting that Christianity does not exist?

It does...and it is bigger and more substantial than the pyramids and Stonehenge combined.

Somewhere…someone started what we now call Christianity. It had to start somewhere…and if we could trace it back to the first moment it began…whatever we find would be the beginning.

Why could it not be someone names Jesus who had such an impact on some people…that they started to make the man into more than he actually was?

The answer to the question at the top of this page is:

We do not know.

1 Reply

Is there someone here who can help me with the name of the first person who used the expression “my bad” to mean what it means right now?

Big thing.

Very popular.

We have recording devices everywhere.

Do you suppose because in this day and age…where we record just about everything…that since we do not know that person’s name…that means that the person who FIRST USED THAT EXPRESSION that way…does not exist?

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Frank Apisa wrote:

We do not know the name of the man who built the pyramids...

I think it probably a group effort.

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Is there someone here who can help me with the name of the first person who used the expression “my bad” to mean what it means right now?

No, but I can tell you "where" it came from, Frank, to wit: some streetball asphalt basketball court.

1 Reply

@izzythepush,

izzythepush wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
We do not know the name of the man who built the pyramids...

I think it probably a group effort.

Undoubtedly.

If the words "conceived of and designed" need to be added, I accept that as a clarifying condition.

Thanks.

0 Replies

@layman,

I'd make that same guess...or one very similar to it.

But which one...and who was the person who first used it that way?

1 Reply

@Frank Apisa,

In general the practice of using "bad" as a synonym of (or, replacement of) it's (former) antonym "good" was revived in the 60's. I say "revived" because that substitution had occurred back in the 1920's, and probably even earlier.

It is not uncommon for those who feel oppressed to turn "negative" words into positive ones.

That's why homosexuals will frequently refer to themselves and others as "fags." Just don't let anyone else do it.

Same with blacks, and the word "nigga."

Not that "my bad" is supposed to mean "my good," cause it aint.

0 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

Are you suggesting that Christianity does not exist?

Quote:

It does...and it is bigger and more substantial than the pyramids and Stonehenge combined.

Somewhere…someone started what we now call Christianity. It had to start somewhere…and if we could trace it back to the first moment it began…whatever we find would be the beginning.

Why could it not be someone names Jesus who had such an impact on some people…that they started to make the man into more than he actually was?

The answer to the question at the top of this page is:

We do not know.

Frank, I think your example isn't a true analogy. I think you are arguing apples and oranges. krumpie ask you about the tangible wheel, an item such as a physical item which we can examine today for ourselves. Your comparison to Christianity, one which is ideology and not a physical item is depended upon personal accounts that cannot be tested or verified. That does not seem like a true comparison.

1 Reply

@Krumple,

Quote:

So any written account is at the bare minimum second hand but to be realistic it is probably a lot further along than second hand.

Of course, like 99.999% of the stuff we know. How much direct contact did you personally have with Sitting Bull, Joan of Arc or Gengis Khan?

1 Reply

@Olivier5,

Olivier5 wrote:

Quote:
So any written account is at the bare minimum second hand but to be realistic it is probably a lot further along than second hand.

Of course, like 99.999% of the stuff we know. How much direct contact did you personally have with Sitting Bull, Joan of Arc or Gengis Khan?

None but then again they weren't attributed with doing "supernatural" things either. Besides that I already gave an example of how people tend to exaggerate the characteristics of an individual and their accomplishments. So if I am researching anyone I always keep this in mind of how factual their accomplishments were but at the same time their accomplishments are far more likely than what the bible claims Jesus pulled off.

Also on a side note there are historical figures who even had a hand in self promotion of their accomplishments and embellished them to further their own cause. Now I know you can't hold every historical figure to this one standard but it is always good to keep a health level of skepticism when their claims are beyond measure. The further away the accomplishment is than what is actually possible the less believable it tends to be and the more evidence that is required.

1 Reply

@Krumple,

So what's your own favorite theory about Jesus?

1 Reply

@argome321,

You are welcome to that opinion, Argome.

As for me...I think Christianity has more structure than a brick wall.

In my opinion...my analogy (if that is what you want to think of it)...is spot on.

2 Replies

@Frank Apisa,

You're being disingenuous, Frank.

1 Reply

Did Jesus Actually Exist?

Related Topics

Quick Links

My Account

able2know