128
   

How can we be sure that all religions are wrong?

 
 
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 12:28 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
I wrote:
Double that. Read what you said
I am not sure if you understand what I was saying. Let me try and make it more clear.

We all have confirmation biases and we like to hear other information that supports our beliefs but we do not like to hear information that counters our belief.
We will try"unknowingly" at times to defend what we believe by finding more information that supports our belief and give little to no credit at all to other factual information that goes against our beliefs.
What is the issue? Frank simply averred that he guessed all things occur according to natural law. I have been saying that all along - from before you joined the board, in fact. Therefore, if there is a God, he operates according to natural law. Naturally, I did not include my belief that natural law has an author. That would not have been as much fun and was not relevant to Frank's well considered post.
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 12:37 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
neo, referring to an old nonsense statement wrote:
"I know you may think you understand what you believe I said but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
What are you saying? If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about a god existing and why he would guess this way. Idea
You really don't have a clue, do you?
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:00 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:

Quote:
What about the people who do not "believe" it to be true...but who also do not "believe" that it is impossible?

This is now getting so twisted that a reasonable discussion is almost impossible.

I do not KNOW if gods exist. Do you?

I do not KNOW that no gods exist. Do you?

I have no problem with you making a guess...but if you do not KNOW...then it will be a guess. (If you do not KNOW.)


This is where I find a value in stats, I think by using statistical odds in the equation "do Gods exist" does seem to add value to the problem. Do not get me wrong because other forms of logical reasoning also have to be considered in the equation.


Well, that might be...but I guess it depends on who is making up the statistic odds.

0 Replies
 
Cyracuz
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:02 pm
Here's how I see it.
The concept 'god' is not delivered to us from on high. It is conjured up in human imagination. Whatever god is, it is known to humans only through the experience of being human.

I say it is likely that anything we care to name only merits those names in the context we see them in. It is not the highest absolute truth, merely the best we can come up with.

Just... anything you can come up with. Just name something. A drangle, for instance. It's an entity that feeds on wi-fi signals, and that binds the internet together. Does this entity exist?
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:02 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:

Quote:
"I know you may think you understand what you believe I said but I'm not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."


What are you saying? If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about a god existing and why he would guess this way. Idea


You could have asked me that, RL.

And I would have answered: Not only do I not know if gods exist or not...I can see no evidence upon which to base a meaningful guess.

But I can flip Mr. Coin...which I have right next to my keyboard.

Want me to do it?
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:26 pm
@Cyracuz,
Cyracuz wrote:
. . . Just... anything you can come up with. Just name something. A drangle, for instance. It's an entity that feeds on wi-fi signals, and that binds the internet together. Does this entity exist?
From what I've been told, those who are prone to rely on drangles may be able to collect WiFi signals without even using their computer. Mad
0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:29 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
You could have asked me that, RL.


That would not have been as much fun. Did I ask the below question in a way that you could not give a good hypotheses?

Quote:
What are you saying? If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about a god existing and why he would guess this way


Let me reword my question and see if you still respond the same.

If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about the god of the bible existing and why he would guess this way.
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:41 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
Frank wrote:
You could have asked me that, RL.
That would not have been as much fun. Did I ask the below question in a way that you could not give a good hypotheses?
RL, directed at neo, wrote:
What are you saying? If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about a god existing and why he would guess this way
Let me reword my question and see if you still respond the same.

If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about the god of the bible existing and why he would guess this way.
Frank! Were you tickling my ears or just stating your educated guess?
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:42 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
I did not include my belief that natural law has an author.


I thought all along that you thought there was an author to all of this who's name is Jehovah. What I would like to know is why you would or would not think that something as intelligent as a god would not need a designer it self but yet you think that things less intelligent need a designer.


Quote:
You really don't have a clue, do you?


No, Please clue me in.
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 01:50 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
Frank! Were you tickling my ears or just stating your educated guess?


He was giving his educated guess but just by serendipity it tickled your ears.
0 Replies
 
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:07 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:

Quote:
You could have asked me that, RL.


That would not have been as much fun. Did I ask the below question in a way that you could not give a good hypotheses?


I already answered that. I cannot make a reasonable guess.

Quote:
Quote:
What are you saying? If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about a god existing and why he would guess this way


Let me reword my question and see if you still respond the same.

If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about the god of the bible existing and why he would guess this way.


My best guess feelings about the Bible is that it is an self-serving history of the early Hebrew people...interspersed with a rather primitive, imaginative mythology.
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:09 pm
@neologist,
neologist wrote:

reasoning logic wrote:
Frank wrote:
You could have asked me that, RL.
That would not have been as much fun. Did I ask the below question in a way that you could not give a good hypotheses?
RL, directed at neo, wrote:
What are you saying? If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about a god existing and why he would guess this way
Let me reword my question and see if you still respond the same.

If you really do not have an interest in having your ears tickled you may want to ask Frank what his guess is about the god of the bible existing and why he would guess this way.
Frank! Were you tickling my ears or just stating your educated guess?


Not sure of the specific of your reference...but I am not much into tickling anyone's ears, so I would say "no" to that possibility. Probably I was stating a guess...although once again, I am not sure of what you are referring to.
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:15 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Quote:
My best guess feelings about the Bible is that it is an self-serving history of the early Hebrew people...interspersed with a rather primitive, imaginative mythology.


Frank I do not think that you mean this as an attack on Christians Jews or Muslims but can you see how they might think they are being viewed in the same light as being rather primitive, and believing in imaginative mythologies because many of them think it is true and some of these people are quite educated in many fields.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:18 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:

Quote:
My best guess feelings about the Bible is that it is an self-serving history of the early Hebrew people...interspersed with a rather primitive, imaginative mythology.


Frank I do not think that you mean this as an attack on Christians Jews or Muslims but can you see how they might think they are being viewed in the same light as being rather primitive, and believing in imaginative mythologies because many of them think it is true and some of these people are quite educated in many fields.


I cannot help what others may or may not think of my comments. I certainly do not mean them as an attack. You asked my guess...and I gave it. I think a realistic guess about the Bible is that it is a history (a self-serving history) of the early Hebrew peoples. And it contains a mythology that, like the Egyptian, Norse, Greek, and Roman mythologies...is very imaginative.

If anyone takes offense at that guess...I have to endure it.
Frank Apisa
 
  2  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:20 pm
@Frank Apisa,
By the way...I cannot imagine a truly educated, intelligent, reasonable individual actually taking offense at that guess.
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:38 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic wrote:
I, in another post wrote:
I did not include my belief that natural law has an author.
I thought all along that you thought there was an author to all of this who's name is Jehovah. What I would like to know is why you would or would not think that something as intelligent as a god would not need a designer it self but yet you think that things less intelligent need a designer.
I wrote:
You really don't have a clue, do you?
No, Please clue me in.
The juxtaposition of the posts says it all, I think.

But perhaps I should refer you to the God referred to in the KJV at Revelation 4:11 "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created." Emphasis mine. The phrase "created all things" pretty much eliminates the idea of the need for a higher level designer. Of course, its just my belief, is all.
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:40 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
Not sure of the specific of your reference...but I am not much into tickling anyone's ears, so I would say "no" to that possibility. Probably I was stating a guess...although once again, I am not sure of what you are referring to.
And I guess RL is not sure as well.
0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Fri 10 May, 2013 02:57 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
KJV at Revelation 4:11 "Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created." Emphasis mine. The phrase "created all things" pretty much eliminates the idea of the need for a higher level designer. Of course, its just my belief, is all.


What is the reason that you believe the author in the bible to be correct?
Do you think that there could be a possibility that the author had mental issues that made him believe that he knew a God, "spoke to a God and also knew what the will of that God was?
neologist
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 03:16 pm
@reasoning logic,
The question was (simplified) Does a god need a designer?. The answer was " the creator (designer) of all things would not/ could not. Sorry I introduced the bible; but consider your question answered
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Fri 10 May, 2013 03:21 pm
@neologist,
Quote:
The question was (simplified) Does a god need a designer?. The answer was " the creator (designer) of all things would not/ could not. Sorry I introduced the bible; but consider your question answered


What is it that makes you believe there has to be a creator? What is it that you know with certainty that we can not just exist like the way you think a god can?
 

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