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Is religion responsible for the opposition to peace in the Israel-Palestine conflict?

 
 
Frank Apisa
 
  0  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 03:00 pm
@georgeob1,
George, here is a question I have asked of Advocate on several occasions...one that seems to reflect on what you have written here:

Quote:
Advocate, you still have a question outstanding in another thread on this subject. Here it is again...just in case you forgot it:

We both agree that Jews and Arabs have lived in that area for centuries.

And the Jews and Arabs got along relatively peacefully, in relative harmony for all those centuries... until the middle of the 1940's.

Then...all hell broke loose...and now the Jews and Arabs can't seem to agree on anything these days.

What happened in the mid-1940's that could possibly account for this enormous difference in cooperation and relative commonality between the two?

C'mon, Advocate...give it an answer.

The answer matters...it is at the heart of what is being discussed here.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 10:44 pm
@RABEL222,
You mean, georgeob hasn't been labled anti-Semitic yet? That's very strange.
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 10:56 pm
@georgeob1,
He likely knows the truth but can't acknowledge it.

The Ottomans had an interesting solution to the coexistence of the many conflicting cultures in the region (Orthodox and Catholic Christians; Sunni, Shia and Alawite Moslems, and Druze). All paid taxes to Istanbul and served, when called, in the army. But each enjoyed its own civil law and independent civil courts with jurisdiction in their respective areas.

The British, aided by Russia and France ended all that with the destruction of the Empire during WWI in an effort to extend their empires. (France got what is now Syria, Lebanon and the Kurdish area in Northern Iraq (oil was a factor even then) ; Russia got Moldavia and some territory in eastern Anatolia, and the British got all the rest. A violent uprising in Iraq during the 1920s kicked the Brits out and prevented the French from getting their part of it. Worse still, the Brits promised Palestine both to the Arabs, who helped them overthrow the Ottomans, and to European Zionists, led by the Rothchilds.

These contradictions came to a head after WWII in the mass emigration of surviving European Jews who, after the destruction of the WWII, weren't often welcome back in their former European homes, all across Europe . Confronted with murder and a destructive civil war in the territory they had seized and then controlled, the Brits simply bugged out, leaving the mess to the then new UN, which at the time had virtually no Moslem member states (India, Pakistan, Algeria, Tunis, Egypt, Malaysia, etc. were then all European colonies.)

While I'm critical of the Israelis, I don't think the European powers have any moral right to that.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  -2  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 02:15 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Not at all, since he is not an anti-Semite...like you.

cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 03:31 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
I guess calling people anti-Semite really means something - to ignoramuses.

Even Jesus Christ was an anti-Semite.
Quote:

JESUS CHRIST, speaking to the Jews in the Gospel of St. John, VIII:44
"Ye are of your father the devil, and the lust of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is not truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar and the father of it. - then answered the Jews - "
(which makes it clear that Christ was addressing the Jews.)
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 03:37 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Well, to me, it means identifying someone who has demonstrated that they are anti-Semitic; whenever they advance a position they claim has nothing to do with their ill regard for Jews.

I wouldn't expect you to not try and dodge what you revealed in another thread, but it's out there. Better you just keep out of these threads. After all, you only repeat yourself ad nauseum.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 03:45 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
And you keep reading them. You're an idiot!
Finn dAbuzz
 
  0  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 03:47 pm
@cicerone imposter,
The price I pay for keeping the light on your anti-Semitism.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 03:50 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Hope you're successful; I just don't give a **** about what you think.
0 Replies
 
incognitoman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Mar, 2013 05:07 am
@maxdancona,
"Right wing Christian organizations are the most ardent supporters of Israeli militancy."

I think it is Democracy that is the most ardent israeli supporter. Democracy works on the premise that those who pay and bribe politicians are rewarded. And israel has the american congress in its pocket. Isn't that how it works??
0 Replies
 
fresco
 
  2  
Reply Sun 3 Mar, 2013 07:05 am
One of the social functions of religion is to rationize the tribalism we inherit from primates. This fact applies as much to internicene strife, as in Sunni-Shiite belligerence, as it does to to the Israel-Palestine conflict. The latter situation has been exacerbated by the vested interests of regional politics which cash in on a diversionary cause celebre, together with interference from the major powers. It will have no "satisfactory" solution whilst that exacerbation continues.
fresco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 3 Mar, 2013 01:28 pm
@fresco,
TYPO First sentence...."rationalize"....
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Sun 3 Mar, 2013 01:41 pm
@maxdancona,
I wouldn't go that far. But, I also agree that the US allows the Jews in Israel "the freedom" to do as they please including the cleansing out of Palestinians.

They steal Palestinians lands at will, and do nothing to stop them. It's a disgrace, but nothing in US politics is surprising.
nydia2013
 
  0  
Reply Wed 13 Mar, 2013 09:14 am
@maxdancona,
No, religion is Not responsible for the opposition to peace in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, with the exception of a small minority of religious extremists in the US who're waiting for the "End Times" and believe that only when all Jews return to Zion (Israel) will the Messaih come a second time.

What is frustrating the peace effort if one can call it that is politics, pure and simple. The American Israeli Lobby (AIPAC, one of the most powerful and influential lobbying groups for Israel, contributes huge sums of money to the US congress, buying their allegiance so the US congress will always be pro-Israel and f*ck the Palestinians.) As long as the current situation, the impasse to a two-state solution continues, expect no solution. Israel is persistent in grabbing more and more land in the occupied territories, i.e., the West Bank and some parts of Jerusalem along with the Golan Heights.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Wed 13 Mar, 2013 10:50 am
@nydia2013,
Even Obama is a robot when it comes to Israel: He's supposed to be a smart man, but he creates a lot of doubt when his actions shows difference to the Palestinians.
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Wed 20 Mar, 2013 11:08 am
@cicerone imposter,
From today's Yahoo News.
Quote:
JERUSALEM (AP) — Calling the U.S. Israel's "greatest friend," President Barack Obama assured the Middle East ally of his administration's commitment to Israel's security while cautioning that the region's "winds of change bring both promise and peril."


Obama really doesn't believe in "democracy" for the Palestinian people. Politics over others who live in misery - losing their rights to equality.

What a dork!
nydia2013
 
  0  
Reply Wed 20 Mar, 2013 02:33 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Re: cicerone imposter (Post 5277521)
From today's Yahoo News.
Quote:
JERUSALEM (AP) — Calling the U.S. Israel's "greatest friend," President Barack Obama assured the Middle East ally of his administration's commitment to Israel's security while cautioning that the region's "winds of change bring both promise and peril."


Quote:

Obama really doesn't believe in "democracy" for the Palestinian people. Politics over others who live in misery - losing their rights to equality.


Obama d oes indeed believe in "democracy" for the Palestinian people, but the Israeli government/AIPAC has bought the US congress and Obama's hands are tied. The US congress would throw their mother under the bus for Israel because of the huge contributions that's given to US politicians to remain in power. I'm afraid outside pressure, NOT THE US, will have to eventually force a resolution of the Israeli/Palestinian problem, like the International community, and neighborhood pressure from its Arab neighbors. Trust me, there will never be any peace for Israel and the US as long as Israel continues its apartheid occupation of the Palestinian people.

BTW, President Obama is not a "dork." Obama is my president and a very fine one given the problems he has to wade through. Netanyahu would like Obama to attack Iran, but the American people are war weary and if Israel wants to attack Iran, let the Zionist nation knock itself out but please don't ask the US military to give another life for that region.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Wed 20 Mar, 2013 03:13 pm
@nydia2013,
Obama's hands are not tied to anything except his own interests to further his political career. It's disgusting!
Frank Apisa
 
  0  
Reply Wed 20 Mar, 2013 03:20 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Obama's hands are not tied to anything except his own interests to further his political career. It's disgusting!


There is a brilliant comment. What is left on the ladder for him to climb?
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Wed 20 Mar, 2013 03:26 pm
@Frank Apisa,
The facts are in front of all of us; he chose to ignore the plights of the Palestinians for the sake of his own politics.
 

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