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Three questions form two sentenses from Aesop's Fables

 
 
Reply Tue 12 Feb, 2013 10:23 am
Two grammatic questions, thank you in advance.

1 what should he see but a Lamb just beginning to drink a little lower down.

2 What did it turn out to be but a Pearl that by some chance had been lost in the yard?

3 How glossy you feathers, how bright your eye.

I feel confused about the usage of "but " in the first two questions, what do they mean, if it is a prep. and means "except", maybe I can understand because both "what should he see" and "what did it turn out to be" can make a sentense. But somebody says it is an adv. and means "merely, only", but I think if that is the case, the author should add a "is" before the "but". Am I right? Why?

And in the third sentense, I used to think "eyes" should be used instead of "eye". Why is "eye" used here? Is the crow blind in one eye?
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contrex
 
  1  
Reply Tue 12 Feb, 2013 11:48 am
@translatorcz,
translatorcz wrote:

Two grammatic questions, thank you in advance.

1 what should he see but a Lamb just beginning to drink a little lower down.

2 What did it turn out to be but a Pearl that by some chance had been lost in the yard?

3 How glossy you feathers, how bright your eye.

I feel confused about the usage of "but " in the first two questions, what do they mean, if it is a prep. and means "except", maybe I can understand because both "what should he see" and "what did it turn out to be" can make a sentense. But somebody says it is an adv. and means "merely, only", but I think if that is the case, the author should add a "is" before the "but". Am I right? Why?


No. You are wrong. To say "What [verb phrase] but [something]" is idiomatic and is a way of describing an event or action which is surprising or notable.

What did I see but John on a horse!
What did he do but shoot his wife dead!

Quote:
And in the third sentense, I used to think "eyes" should be used instead of "eye". Why is "eye" used here? Is the crow blind in one eye?


No mistake. This is poetic. I say to my girl: "How bright your eye; how soft your hand; how warm your breast; how small your foot; how pretty your ear." I am not implying that she only has one of each of these things.




translatorcz
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Feb, 2013 10:57 pm
@contrex,
Sorry for the delay of my reply. Thank you very much. Your answer is accurate. You answered my questions perfectly. But two other questions arise in my mind:

1 Should I use a "period" or a "question mark" or a "exclamatory mark" in such a sentense(with "What [verb phrase] but [something]" ) or when should I use a "period" and when a "question mark"?

2 If "how bright you eye" is poetic, why the usage of "feathers", which I think is a plural noun. When should I use a singular noun, and when a plural noun?
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 04:58 am
@translatorcz,
A question mark comes after a question, and only after a question, every time.

Birds have so many feathers, it would be unusual to refer to them in the singular...but not impossible.

"How glossy your feather, how bright your eye" works okay, but only in a poetical sense. It is not a normal form of expression.
translatorcz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 06:49 am
@McTag,
1 Thank you but how do you know "What did it turn out to be but a Pearl that by some chance had been lost in the yard" is a question, and should be followed by a question mark, and how do you know "what should he see but a Lamb just beginning to drink a little lower down" is a declarative sentence, and should be followed by a period, that is what I'm confused about.

2 "Birds have so many feathers", but birds have two eyes", why is the two words' usage of such difference, that is what I'm confused about.

Could you please explain further for me? Thank you for that in advance.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 10:36 am
@translatorcz,

These are difficult questions, and I would be interested to see the views of (qualified) others.

I think that
Quote:
What did it turn out to be but a Pearl that by some chance had been lost in the yard" is a question,

is correct, it is a question of sorts, but can also bee seen as a declaration.
It can be simplified as "it turned out to be a pearl that by some chance had been lost in the yard".
The other one is just the same, it is a question as written, but it could be simplified as " He saw a lamb which was just beginning to drink, lower down".

So I think the author is justified in writing either on with a full stop or a question mark.
I think I personally would treat both as a statement, and write them both without a question mark, since the statements "it turned out to be a pearl" and "he saw a lamb" seem to be the most important parts of the sentences.
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McTag
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 10:44 am
@translatorcz,
Quote:
2 "Birds have so many feathers", but birds have two eyes", why is the two words' usage of such difference, that is what I'm confused about.

Could you please explain further for me? Thank you for that in advance.


Again, difficult to say. It is a kind of poetic or fanciful construction, and rather old-fashioned.

"He was strong in the arm, and fleet of foot" (he had two of both)

"He had a roving eye" (but the other one stayed home?)

"She was long of leg, graceful and supple"

Unusual, but you see it from time to time.
translatorcz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 10:16 pm
@McTag,
It seems I should read some poems to be familiar with this. McTag, thank you very much.
0 Replies
 
translatorcz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Feb, 2013 10:20 pm
@contrex,
Contrex, thank you.
0 Replies
 
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 11:27 am
When we say bright of eye or strong of arm or fleet of foot we are concentrating on a quality or attribute of a person, not on their anatomy. We know that in general people have two of these things.
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 12:10 pm
@contrex,

Disagree. " Of glittering eye" is a reference specifically to eyes, which glitter.
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Feb, 2013 12:24 pm
@McTag,
McTag wrote:


Disagree. " Of glittering eye" is a reference specifically to eyes, which glitter.


You're missing my point. I know it is a reference to eyes (plural) but the singular form removes from the reference the kind of view or perspective that, say, an ophthalmologist would have.

0 Replies
 
translatorcz
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Feb, 2013 10:15 am
@contrex,
You mean "in a poetic context" or we can always say that when we are not concentrating on their anatomy?
contrex
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Feb, 2013 11:56 am
@translatorcz,
translatorcz wrote:

You mean "in a poetic context" or we can always say that when we are not concentrating on their anatomy?


I mean in a poetic context or in archaic forms of English, such as the very old translation of Aesop that you quote from.
translatorcz
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Feb, 2013 12:15 am
@contrex,
Copy. Many thanx.
0 Replies
 
 

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