17
   

American Atheists Barred from holding Office

 
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 02:43 pm
@Thomas,
Well that was a loud laugh from me.

Plate thief!
0 Replies
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 02:54 pm
@edgarblythe,
I didn't know about any of this because, frankly, it never occurred to me that it would be possible for any state to have such an anti-atheist law, given the clear proscription of establishment of religion in the 1st Amendment to the US Constitution. It boggles the mind.
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 03:01 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
The provisions were mostly enacted before the 14th Amendment, when none of the US constitution's Bill of Rights applied to the States yet. Also, the original intent of the provisions was often to broaden religious minorities' access to public service. Under the Brits, it had pretty much been Church-of-England only.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 03:04 pm
@Thomas,
Ok, thanks for chasing this. I thought something was weird.

Maybe it was the Reuters article.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 03:30 pm
@Thomas,
Thomas wrote:
The provisions were mostly enacted before the 14th Amendment, when none of the US constitution's Bill of Rights applied to the States yet.

I did a little googling: All the provisions happened before the Supreme Court incorporated the non-establishment clause via the 14th Amendment in Everson v. Board of Education (1946). (I was not able to find the case in which the Supreme Court incorporated the no-religious-tests clause.)

Still, three State Constitutions --- Arkansas, Mississippi, and Texas --- enacted their prohibitions after the 14th Amendment came into effect in 1868.
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 03:35 pm
@Thomas,
I gather this isn't active, ignored like a lot of other old stuff. So, a kind of pfeffernusse put up by the Reuters reporter/s.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_cfsT733VnQU/SuIKYyzZCeI/AAAAAAAADIY/O3CYndY5jDk/s400/PICT6869.JPG
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  3  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 03:37 pm
Both Massachusetts and Connecticut had religious establishments (the Congregationalist Church) well into the 19th century. That old faker Thoreau was actually threatened with jail for failing to pay his church tax. A well-wisher paid it for him.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 03:40 pm
@edgarblythe,
Quote:
The thing to do it seems to me is to first get elected and then announce one's atheism.
Yeh but youd have to get thgrough the bvlahblah blah blah"so help you God" part, and youd be LYING under oath no?
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 03:42 pm
@farmerman,
No, I guess you can put your hand on something else, if you dare.
0 Replies
 
tsarstepan
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 04:21 pm
@Thomas,
Thomas wrote:

Still, three State Constitutions --- Arkansas, Mississippi, and Texas --- enacted their prohibitions after the 14th Amendment came into effect in 1868.

Is it fair to suggest these state laws are dormant like most states' blue laws and have never been enforced in the past ... say 20 or so years?
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:02 pm
@tsarstepan,
I suggested that already. Don't ignore me because I talk cookies.



I'm giving myself solace with some gelato.
0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:04 pm
@farmerman,
Why wouldn't an Atheist just lie. It is not like oaths would matter to someone who doesn't believe in God.
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:08 pm
@maxdancona,
Tell me you are kidding.
0 Replies
 
Lustig Andrei
 
  4  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:08 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:

Why wouldn't an Atheist just lie. It is not like oaths would matter to someone who doesn't believe in God.



Well, max, lying under oath constitutes a felony. Some people might be a wee bit leery of the possible consequences of having perjured themselves. God is quie beside the point.
Thomas
 
  3  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:10 pm
@maxdancona,
maxdancona wrote:
Why wouldn't an Atheist just lie. It is not like oaths would matter to someone who doesn't believe in God.

No, but there are other reasons why people, including atheists, despise liars and hypocrites. Why would an atheist want to become one of them?
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:14 pm
@Lustig Andrei,
edit, this was to Max, not Andrew

I think I was brought up in lies of many sorts. I try not to do that.

So, tell me about yourself.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:17 pm
@tsarstepan,
tsarstepan wrote:
Is it fair to suggest these state laws are dormant like most states' blue laws and have never been enforced in the past ... say 20 or so years?

No, they are still being enforced. Here is Herb Silverman telling his story on YouTube. (If you want to skip the introduction, the actual talk starts at 1:40 minutes.) He appplied to become a South-Carolina notary public. South Carolina rejected him. He sued in court and won. South Carolina kept appealing until, after seven years, the South Carolina Supreme Court decided for Silverman. I found the talk fun to watch.

0 Replies
 
maxdancona
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:19 pm
@Thomas,
This thread assumes that the Atheist in question does want to become a liar and a hypocrite.

If he didn't then he would choose an honest profession like nursing or teaching.
Setanta
 
  3  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:21 pm
That's an idiotic contention. The thread assumes no such thing. There is nothing inherent in being an atheist which would mitigate against public service.
maxdancona
 
  0  
Reply Fri 14 Dec, 2012 05:27 pm
@Setanta,
That wasn't my contention. You completely turned around what I said.
0 Replies
 
 

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