Mass Shooting At Denver Batman Movie Premiere

@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

"Bomb making supplies" are fairly well regulated

Depends on what kind of bomb. A large pile of matches and a few lengths of pipe could be used to create something pretty nasty.

I believe the Columbine shooters also rigged up large propane canisters to blow, and that only failed because they made one silly mistake. The next whacko to try might not make such a mistake.

0 Replies

@oralloy,

Krumple wrote:

and even where there are places where carry permits are not allowed
there is still violent crimes and murders.

oralloy wrote:

Not going to be such places for much longer (at least in the US).

The Supreme Court is only a couple years away from ruling
that the right to carry guns in public applies to everyone nation-wide.

Regarding HELLER on April 3, Justice Scalia told me:
"well, we didn 't say that u can ONLY carry a gun in your house."

That had been the litigated question presented to the Court.

Indeed, in the HELLER decision itself,
the Court said:

"As we said in United States v. Verdugo-Urquidez,
494 U. S. 259, 265 (1990):
“ ‘[T]he people’ seems to have been a term of art employed
in select parts of the Constitution... . [Its uses] sugges[t]
that ‘the people’ protected by the Fourth Amendment,
and by the First and Second Amendments,
and to whom rights and powers are reserved
in the Ninth and Tenth Amendments, refers to
a class of persons who are part of a national community
or who have otherwise developed sufficient connection
with this country to be considered part of that community.”

We start therefore with a strong presumption
that the Second Amendment right is exercised individually
and belongs to all Americans.

* * * Putting all of these textual elements together,
we find that they guarantee the individual right
to possess and CARRY weapons in case of confrontation."

[All emfasis has been added by David.]

David

2 Replies

@farmerman,

Quote:

many would be terrorists have a penchant for blowing their own asses up while in transit or in preparation

This "gentleman" once more was a Phd candidate in science and as such must had have many credit hours in Chemistry so having him blowing himself up seems not to be all that likely.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

Regarding HELLER on April 3, Justice Scalia told me:
"well, we didn 't say that u can ONLY carry a gun in your house."

That had been the litigated question presented to the Court.

Yes. And don't forget that Gura's next case (nationwide carrying of guns in public) has already been launched and is now arcing its way through the appeals process.

When the case reaches the Supreme Court, I imagine Scalia will delight us all with yet another brilliant ruling.

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

How horrible it must be to spend every day of your life thinking someone might attack you therefore you must arm yourself for self-defense.

**** happens. Airplanes crash on a frequent basis. Does that mean you daren't ever try to fly somewhere?

Nutcases shoot up schools and movie theatres. Does that mean you don't educate yourself or see a movie?

If you're going to be ruled by fear, you might as well just stay home, but wait - there's no guarantee a burglar won't try to enter your home. And if one did, there's no guarantee he won't kill you before you get your gun out.

3 Replies

@BillRM,

Quote:

many would be terrorists have a penchant for blowing their own asses up while in transit or in preparation

BillRM wrote:

This "gentleman" once more was a Phd candidate in science
and as such must had have many credit hours in Chemistry
so having him blowing himself up seems not to be all that likely.

Yes. The victims r lucky that he did not choose to hurl Molotov Cocktails, instead.
Burning deaths r known to be very painful.
It takes about a minute to make a Molotov Cocktail,
if u pour the gasoline slowly.

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

Yes. The victims r lucky that he did not choose to hurl Molotov Cocktails, instead.
Burning deaths r known to be very painful.
It takes about a minute to make a Molotov Cocktail,
if u pour the gasoline slowly.

David as I already stated simple but deadly flame throwers can be put together is short order.

1 Reply

@Mame,

Quote:

How horrible it must be to spend every day of your life thinking someone might attack you therefore you must arm yourself for self-defense.

By that logic it must be horrible to had fire extinguishers in your home and car thinking your home or car might caught on fire.

0 Replies

@oralloy,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

Regarding HELLER on April 3, Justice Scalia told me:
"well, we didn 't say that u can ONLY carry a gun in your house."

That had been the litigated question presented to the Court.

oralloy wrote:

Yes. And don't forget that Gura's next case (nationwide carrying of guns in public)
has already been launched and is now arcing its way through the appeals process.

When the case reaches the Supreme Court, I imagine Scalia will
delight us all with yet another brilliant ruling.

Yes. There r a few suitable cases headed in his direction.
A critical consideration is the Constitution's requirement of "equal protection of the laws".

Additionally, there is the matter of uniting the right to bear arms
with the right to travel (as the USSC has already done with welfare for the indigent).

The USSC shud and I predict WILL analogize it to the right to freely carry Bibles,
your favorite newspapers, and a copy of the Constitution over State borders.

Fundamentally, u have the ABSOLUTE RIGHT
to defend your life WHEREVER u r attacked by the violence of man or beast.
The Founders knew that and thay put that into the Bill of Rights (2nd, 9th and 14th Amendments).

David

0 Replies

@Mame,

Mame wrote:

How horrible it must be to spend every day of your life thinking
someone might attack you therefore you must arm yourself for self-defense.

I hope that no one lives in such fear, Mame;
the same way that we don't continually dread flat tires,
but we carry spare tires in our trunks and we don't live in terror
of heart attacks, but we carry health insurance, anyway.
Personally, I have never met anyone who fears like that,
but its good to be prepared anyway.

(Admittedly, I myself felt a little uneasy at age 8,
when I was home alone a lot, before I got my first gun.)

Mame wrote:

Airplanes crash on a frequent basis. Does that mean you daren't ever try to fly somewhere?

Nutcases shoot up schools and movie theatres. Does that mean you don't educate yourself or see a movie?

If you're going to be ruled by fear, you might as well just stay home, but wait - there's no guarantee a burglar
won't try to enter your home. And if one did, there's no guarantee he won't kill you before you get your gun out.

Yes; it pays to keep your gun handy.
U have raised good points, Mame. U have a good mind.

David

0 Replies

@BillRM,

Quote:

Yes. The victims r lucky that he did not choose to hurl Molotov Cocktails, instead.
Burning deaths r known to be very painful.
It takes about a minute to make a Molotov Cocktail,
if u pour the gasoline slowly.

BillRM wrote:

David as I already stated simple but deadly flame throwers can be put together is short order.

That is undeniable, Bill.
I have not yet read your post.

I 'm glad that the murderer did not apply the Tim McVeigh approach.
That woud have been worse.

David

0 Replies

@oralloy,

Quote:

I for one would very much like to bring back the militia as the Constitution dictates. It would allow the widespread private ownership of much heavier weaponry than is justified by self defense.

Do not forget the interesting fact that any weapon manufacture before 1898 is not consider a weapon and is legal for a citizen to own by the federal government even up to rifle beach loading artillery that can reach out three miles or so and level a building.

As I had posted here before I know a gentleman who own a real civil war field piece and the only problem he had with the government was being order not to fire it in Florida city except on the fourth of July and new year.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

DAVID wrote:

If the audiences in those theaters are better armed than the other one, then thay 'll be a lot safer.
That 's what guns are FOR.

BillRM wrote:

The guy had full body armor

No. It was not all that "full".
There was exposure of the throat and high chest. (facial exposure??)

BillRM wrote:

and for an example of how useful handguns [little 9mm] are against a modern set of body armor
see the shoot out at the bank where two bank robbers could not
be stopped by an army of cops until they got heavy weapons themselves.

I 'm under the impression that THIS armor
was less thorough than those.

BillRM wrote:

I question if I had been in that theater if my .357 would had done a lot of good
even those I would had given it a try.

Shot placement counts for a lot.
My sense of the situation is that a .357 magnum coud handle the job.
If the round failed to penetrate, I suspect that it 'd knock him over, if its a magnum round.

One kid said that he was only 3 feet away from the killer.

David

2 Replies

@OmSigDAVID,

Quote:

There was exposure of the throat and high chest. (facial exposure??)

Not from the TV interview of a local police officer I saw.

He had throat protection and a full swat type helmet covering his face.

In any case the likelihood of successfully engaging him with most handguns seem off hand tiny.

1 Reply

@BillRM,

Quote:

There was exposure of the throat and high chest. (facial exposure??)

BillRM wrote:

Not from the TV interview of a local police officer I saw.

He had throat protection and a full swat type helmet covering his face.

Maybe we saw different TV coverage.
I don't believe that gas masks r bulletproof.
If he were wearing one, then there was facial exposure.
Facial penetration stands a good chance of contacting
the medulla oblongata; i.e.: lights out.

BillRM wrote:

In any case the likelihood of successfully engaging him
with most handguns seem off hand tiny.

Even just hitting him in the ankle
woud have the effect of knocking him off his stride; distracting,
even with a little .22, let alone a .357 magnum
(or in my case, a .44 special with hollowpointed slugs).

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

Once more those bank robbers was hit many many times from all directions by handgun rounds without slowing them down to any real degree.

Next directing fire in broad daylight and sharing the attention for return fire with many others shooters is not the same as being in a one on one gun fight in a dark smoke/tear gas full theater.

1 Reply

@Mame,

Mame wrote:

How horrible it must be to spend every day of your life thinking someone might attack you therefore you must arm yourself for self-defense.

Such is human existence.

Mame wrote:

Airplanes crash on a frequent basis. Does that mean you daren't ever try to fly somewhere?

I don't fly. I wish air travel would be banned. It is so unnecessary to subject innocent people to such a horrific death.

My dad had a close call with a plane when I was in high school. At the time (being adolescent) I thought it was kind of cool that he had such a close call, but now the entire event just pisses me off.

Mame wrote:

but wait - there's no guarantee a burglar won't try to enter your home. And if one did, there's no guarantee he won't kill you before you get your gun out.

Never any guarantees. Just buy a good gun and stay away from planes, and try to enjoy life and help others until something finally brings you down (then hope the Atheists are wrong and there is a God, and he finds favor with you).

0 Replies

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Do not forget the interesting fact that any weapon manufacture before 1898 is not consider a weapon and is legal for a citizen to own by the federal government even up to rifle beach loading artillery that can reach out three miles or so

I'm actually a big fan of black powder artillery. I have a friend who can make artillery pieces up to four feet long (and if I remember correctly up to two feet in diameter).

He makes a lot of replica 12-pounder mountain howitzers for Civil War reenactors I think.

I'd guess he could also make Revolutionary War 3-pounder grasshopper cannons, but do not know that he has ever done so.

Should I ever acquire enough excess cash to commission a piece from him, I'm going to have him make me a 4-foot-long howitzer that fires bowling balls (to a distance of many miles I'd expect). Such a device should fit the parameters of his manufacturing capability.

BillRM wrote:

and level a building.

Black powder artillery is allowed, but not explosive shells.

Grape shot and canister might make for interesting close-range self defense though.

BillRM wrote:

As I had posted here before I know a gentleman who own a real civil war field piece and the only problem he had with the government was being order not to fire it in Florida city except on the fourth of July and new year.

It's funny to see how the neighborhood reacts when you fire a canon. About five minutes later people from miles around are slowly driving up and down the road looking for the boiler explosion. Mr. Green

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

OmSigDAVID wrote:

BillRM wrote:
The guy had full body armor

No. It was not all that "full".
There was exposure of the throat and high chest. (facial exposure??)

I heard something on the news about a throat guard I think.

Not sure about the face. I've heard reports of a gas mask, night vision goggles, and a riot helmet.

The riot helmet comment came from a theater-goer, who may or may not have known what they were talking about. Possibly someone uninformed could refer to a gas mask/night vision goggles as a riot helmet.

Seems like it might be kind of crowded to have all three devices in conjunction (though I think some riot helmets are bulky looking, with the face shield well in front of the face, perhaps for that very reason).

1 Reply

@BillRM,

BillRM wrote:

Once more those bank robbers was hit many many times from all directions by handgun rounds
without slowing them down to any real degree.

WHATAYA EXPECT from little 9mm pistols, Bill???

BillRM wrote:

Next directing fire in broad daylight and sharing the attention for return fire with many other shooters
is not the same as being in a one on one gun fight in a dark smoke/tear gas full theater.

As I said before,
with a .357 magnum round u coud knock him over,
regardless of penetration.

1 Reply

Mass Shooting At Denver Batman Movie Premiere

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