37
   

Mass Shooting At Denver Batman Movie Premiere

 
 
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 28 Jul, 2012 06:45 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:
That's not in the 2nd. So it's unconstitutional.


Wasn't there a scene from Braveheart where some snot-nosed punk presumed to give Longshanks advice on military strategy, and went flying out a window for his presumption?
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  -2  
Reply Sat 28 Jul, 2012 06:56 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
There is NO SUCH THING as an "effective gun ban."
I 'd make them myself, if it came to that.
I already have a manual for home-made submachineguns from Paladin Press.
http://www.paladin-press.com/product/A_Do-It-Yourself_Submachine_Gun/Home_Workshop_Guns_and_Ammo


Making ammo for a full auto is likely to be a lot of work.

The equivalent of a sawed-off shotgun is likely to be easier to produce ammo for.
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sat 28 Jul, 2012 06:57 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:
That might work with a moron like Oralboy


You trash shouldn't run around falsely accusing your betters of your own stupidity.



izzythepush wrote:
who seems to think that if he imagines something it's true.


You can't show a single fact that I've ever been wrong about.
snood
 
  1  
Reply Sat 28 Jul, 2012 08:09 pm
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:

izzythepush wrote:
That might work with a moron like Oralboy


You trash shouldn't run around falsely accusing your betters of your own stupidity.



izzythepush wrote:
who seems to think that if he imagines something it's true.


You can't show a single fact that I've ever been wrong about.


He couldn't show you a fact that you'd ever accept as proving you wrong. That's not a commentary on the non-existence of those facts, just on your inability to absorb them.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 28 Jul, 2012 08:13 pm
@oralloy,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
There is NO SUCH THING as an "effective gun ban."
I 'd make them myself, if it came to that.
I already have a manual for home-made submachineguns from Paladin Press.
http://www.paladin-press.com/product/A_Do-It-Yourself_Submachine_Gun/Home_Workshop_Guns_and_Ammo
oralloy wrote:
Making ammo for a full auto is likely to be a lot of work.
Its worth it.

I love the H & K MP5 ( my favorite )
but the Uzi is very good too.





David
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Sat 28 Jul, 2012 09:26 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:
He couldn't show you a fact that you'd ever accept as proving you wrong. That's not a commentary on the non-existence of those facts, just on your inability to absorb them.


Nope. He can't show a single fact I've gotten wrong in any of the arguments I've made here, and neither can you.

You may think your vague yammering about "me supposedly being wrong somewhere" is a substitute for you actually providing a concrete argument, but it isn't.

Stop trying to bluff. You can't make a factual argument, and you know it.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 12:16 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

How are those arm gangs doing that are forcing British cops to patrol some areas of your country with sub-machine guns?
To my personal knowledge that might happen. Like here in Germany or elsewhere, namely when they search for armed persons of such a gang. (You see sub-machine gun armed policemen/-women here in Germany more often than in the UK, though - mainly, because every policeman/-woman is armed here. And a MP5 is in every patrolcar.)

0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 12:19 am
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

Taking away a few hundred thousands deactivated guns from collectors because a few had been return to working order is going to solve the problems perhaps?
Collectors can have their arms if they are collecting them legally - to what jurisdiction are you referring here?
oralloy
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 01:17 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Walter Hinteler wrote:
BillRM wrote:
Taking away a few hundred thousands deactivated guns from collectors because a few had been return to working order is going to solve the problems perhaps?


Collectors can have their arms if they are collecting them legally - to what jurisdiction are you referring here?


I think he is talking of the UK, and is speculating that outlawing such gun collecting might be their next move in reacting to the failure of their existing gun laws.
0 Replies
 
FOUND SOUL
 
  2  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 02:21 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
Plus, such a ban would be illegal. Americans are free people. You don't get to disarm us.


IDK. The President wants to stay as a president, winning votes and all that, it will be interesting what he chooses to do.. I'm betting guns are in, but the type is not.

He was 24? Highly intellegent? And, been planning this for weeks on end, including taking out anyone that entered his home...and his Mother knew he was capable. All with orange hair and quitting Uni in June.. .

She knew him as a kid, child. She saw there were issues then. If she believed that they had the right person, internally, she always knew he was capable, how friggen sad.. I imagine he went to alot of Doctors throughout his life, but none could change his mental problem... No one suggested he was totally nuts either.. They always seem to have an extremely high eye cue, in my opinion.

Shirt, sorry I changed the subject from guns but ...........................................
spendius
 
  2  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 04:54 am
@oralloy,
Quote:
Irrelevant. Banning the private ownership and use of cars would save untold lives.


That's just ridiculous. Banning medical practice could be argued for on that principle. Banning electricity as well.

If you can't, or won't, see the difference between cars and guns you are not someone it is worth having a discussion with.

I can't find the number of gun permit holders for the USA but Florida has 850, ooo, mostly male, in a population of 19 million. Which means that Florida has 18 million residents who don't have a permit.

How many permit holders don't carry their guns around with them?

And applications for permits can easily be seen as a data gathering and fee collecting operation.

How many Floridians have used their guns in self defence?

You're having your paranoia exploited for business and bureaucratic reasons and your mind controlled and in a permanent ferment of righteousness based on a faux obsession with an old, out of date, mouldering document written for a world as different from ours as to be unimaginable in any realistic sense. Movies are not reality.

And your solution for the paranoia can only cause it to get worse.

Freedom would be having a gun and nobody knowing about it. Having one at the discretion of the authorities is faux freedom.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 05:05 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Quote:
Collectors can have their arms if they are collecting them legally - to what jurisdiction are you referring here?


Sorry but they are seriously talking about in England forcing all collectors to turn over their deactivated firearms by a date certain. No idea if they would get pay for such collections or not after turning them in.

The others idea was to have those collectors with weapons purchase under the laws before 1998 or so would need to prove that their deactivated firearms meant the harder standards post 1998 for deactivation.

Then the last idea was to license all those collectors however from my reading the government feel that would be too must of a burden to do.

All this is to address a few cases of such guns being return to fully functional firearms but the police feel repeat feel that this is more of a problem then is currently showing up.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 05:20 am
@izzythepush,
Quote:
Provide a source for your ridiculous rants. That might work with a moron like Oralboy, who seems to think that if he imagines something it's true.

Some of us can construct basic sentences. Which parts of the UK are patrolled by police with sub-machine guns? Provide a credible source.



You do not know what is happening in your own country why am I not a bit surprise at that fact!!!!!!!!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/6407137/Armed-officers-placed-on-routine-foot-patrol-for-first-time.html

Telegraph.co.uk Sunday 29 July 2012

Police officers armed with submachine guns are to be deployed on routine patrol of Britain's streets for the first time.

1:43PM BST 22 Oct 2009
A hand-picked team from CO19, the Metropolitan Police's elite firearms unit, will walk the beat in gun crime hotspots where armed gangs have turned entire estates into "no go" zones.

Local politicians and anti-gun campaigners have reacted with anger at the news that the officers will carry Heckler & Koch MP5 submachine guns – capable of firing up to 800 rounds-per-minute – and Glock semi-automatic pistols.

CO19 currently provides armed support in volatile situations like sieges and terrorist attacks, with its officers on constant call in vehicles around London.

But this is the first time that armed officers will be sent on permanent foot patrol anywhere in the country outside Northern Ireland.

"Historically, CO19 was only called out when someone rang up to report a gun crime," said Inspector Derek Carroll, head of the new unit.

"But a lot of streets in London have young people in postcode gangs, aged 14 and upwards, and a lot of communities feel that they are controlling areas of estates.

"We are looking at gangs that have access to firearms and will be robust in dealing with them and disrupting and deterring them."

The team of 18 constables, led by an inspector and two sergeants, will begin their patrols of Brixton, Haringey and Tottenham on Nov 9, following successful trial schemes.

The officers – some on motorbikes – will carrying out weapon "sweeps" of their neighbourhoods in an effort to deter gang members from carrying guns, and are also intended to be a reassuring presence for residents.

"My view is that just because you carry a gun, it should not affect the way you police," Inspector Carroll added. "We chat to people and they love it."

Unlike their counterparts in the United States, British police officers do not routinely carry guns, although armed patrols are frequently deployed in the aftermath of shootings and to guard potential terrorist targets.

In October 2000 armed officers on the beat were temporarily introduced in Nottingham after a string of drug-related deaths.

Jennette Arnold, a Labour London Assembly member for northeast London constituency, said that the patrols threatened to tear up the contract between the community and the police.

"No one asked us or the people I represent if this was acceptable and when they do I shall tell them it isn't. It isn't acceptable to throw away the principle of policing by consent," she said.

Gill Marshall-Andrews, chairwoman of the Gun Control Network campaign group, described the routine arming of officers as a "very retrograde step" and warned that it could lead to higher levels of gun crime.

"This is likely to raise the stakes and encourage more criminals, especially young criminals, to arm themselves," she said.

"Gun crime in this country is very low by international standards and that's largely because there aren't many guns about. Arming police officers sends out all the wrong messages."

The Police Federation, which represents rank-and-file officers, has long campaigned against attempts to arm a larger section of the force, but said it had no objection to the new scheme.

Simon Reed, vice-chairman of the national federation, said that although majority of his members did not wish be to armed, forces must be free to respond to particular threats.

"The ethos will always be that the British police are unarmed, but we need officers to be able to use firearms when appropriate," he said. "My feeling is that the current balance is just about right."

The Home Office declined to comment, saying that the operational use of firearms was a matter for local forces.

Officers from CO19, formerly known as SO19, have been involved in a number of high-profile incidents in the capital, including the shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes at Stockwell station in 2005.

Gun-related crime is on the increase in London with 1,736 gun crimes reported in London between April and September this year – up 17 per cent on 2008.

The problem of turf violence between drugs gangs was highlighted earlier this month with a spate of shootings in north London linked to two Turkish gangs, the Tottenham Boys and the Bombacilar.
spendius
 
  2  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 06:04 am
@BillRM,
You think small pockets in Brixton, Haringey and Tottenham is "our country" for your own reasons Bill. Even in those districts the problem is one of a minority with a race element.

We all know where The Telegraph is coming from. There's a savage propaganda battle going on over the spending cuts. The article is part of that. You're either very naive or think A2Kers are.

With the exception of a few idiots we don't judge the USA on the basis of a couple of districts of Chicago.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 06:08 am
@BillRM,
Quote:
The team of 18 constables, led by an inspector and two sergeants, will begin their patrols of Brixton, Haringey and Tottenham on Nov 9, following successful trial schemes.


Leaving aside the fact that your source is about three years out of date, we're talking about an extremely tiny force in a few London boroughs. Hardly the epidemic your original post suggested.

The thing that you keep ignoring that although such rampages happen in other countries they are rare, and they are always carried out by legally held weapons. The last significant instance we had was Derek Bird in Cumbria who killed 12 and injured another 11. Since then you've had them on almost daily basis. Gabrielle Gifford's shooting being another celebrated example.

Quote:
On the same Saturday as the Tucson shootings, there were at least five other gun-related killings in the US: a police officer and a civilian were fatally shot outside a Baltimore bar, while three others died in a shooting at a Colorado nightclub.


That's just one day in America.

http://www.thenational.ae/news/world/americas/killing-reopens-us-gun-law-debate
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 06:17 am
@spendius,
spendius wrote:
You're either very naive or think A2Kers are.

Exactly.
izzythepush wrote:

Leaving aside the fact that your source is about three years out of date, ...

Exactly.
Walter Hinteler
 
  2  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 06:25 am
@Walter Hinteler,
Police use of firearms in England and Wales 1 April 2009 to 31 March 2010 (I don't have access to newer data):

The number of police operations in which firearms were authorised was 18,556—a decrease of 1,395 (7%) on the previous year.
The number of authorised firearms officers (AFO’s) was 6,979—an increase of 111 (1.6%) officers overall on the previous year.
The number of operations involving armed response vehicles was 14,089—a decrease of 2,475 (15%) on the previous year.
The police discharged a conventional firearm in six incidents (up from five incidents in 2008-09).

Source: Home Office
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 06:28 am
@Walter Hinteler,
So what izzy arm cops needed to patrol your nice firearms free nation with submachine guns because of arm gangs and I had yet to see any story that they are not still doing so.

But izzy go and placed your head up your rear end over the problems in your country as you have no crime or firearm problems.
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 06:34 am
@BillRM,
I'm not izzy.

The UK is indeed a nice nation, but I don't think it's a firearm free nation - there are about 1.8 million firearms legally owned in Britain.
OmSigDAVID
 
  2  
Reply Sun 29 Jul, 2012 06:37 am
@izzythepush,
BillRM wrote:
How are those arm gangs doing that are forcing British cops to patrol some areas
of your country with sub-machine guns?
izzythepush wrote:
Provide a source for your ridiculous rants. That might work with a moron like Oralboy,
who seems to think that if he imagines something it's true.

Some of us can construct basic sentences.
Which parts of the UK are patrolled by police with sub-machine guns?
Provide a credible source.
I can 't comment about Heathrow, in England
because my memory is un-availing,
but I remember discussing his submachinegun with a Chinese Police Officer in Hong Kong
at the airport, while it was still under English control. He took pride in his H & K MP5.
That was good taste -- no kidding.

Its a very, very sweet submachinegun -- my favorite
( tho the .45 caliber Thompson Sub will always have a special place in my heart ).

Spendius,
I re-iterate, in the fullness of good faith
that we in the pro-freedom community do not regard our guns
with any element of the erotic and thay have no relation to our genitalia,
but candor moves me to admit warm-hearted affection for my gun collection,
as I have for my cars, for my gold coins, and more than for my collection of automatic Kaleidoscopes.


From my perspective as a retired trial attorney in my Golden Years,
I remember my mom giving me a stuffed panda bear
when I was about 2. In retrospect, I wish that she had begifted me
with a nice submachinegun; MP5s did not yet exist,
but I coud have dearly loved a nice .45 caliber Thompson Sub,
with round drum magazine and no shoulder stock. I coud have cuddled up in bed with that.
Note that I had NO erotic interest in the stuffed panda, either. We kept it platonic.

OK, I 'll admit that maybe 2 years is too young to fully appreciate
the better points of a submachinegun, but I coud have loveingly
gotten my head around it (and my arms around it) at around 3.
( That is 5O% older than 2. )





David
0 Replies
 
 

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