@georgeob1,
Quote:My background is in the mathematical aspects of physics with a specialty in fluid dynamics. The perspective I gained from that gives me a very strong impression of the remarkable simplicity of the basic laws of physics; the remarkable fine tuning in the values of the seven or so basic physical constants that permit our existence; and the uncanny complexity (at small scales) resulting from these laws which in many applications is accompanied by relative simplicity at larger scales.
farmerman wrote:
Quote:....I think we would be missing whole batches of findings because ID is a conclusion, plain and simple. Its not a path to learn anything. Its base is not science, Its always been a
religious derivation no matter how much the Discovery Institute guys(and the ICR) bleat.
I largely agree with you there. Unfortunately, on both sides of the question of design, people tend to get needlessly tied up on nonessential questions: i.e. ID 'rs arguing about evolution (perhaps in defense of literal interpretations of obviously metaphorical scripture.) , and the scientifically inclined often forgetful that science cannot provide answers to the question of the origin of our universe.
It is not the, "remarkable simplicity of the basic laws of physics; the remarkable fine tuning in the values of the seven or so basic physical constants" that permit our existence. Constants don't have the ability to permit anything.
For example, the gear ratio in the rear axle of my truck is a "physical constant" relating input RPM to output RPM. That constant has nothing to do with causing my truck to go a certain ground speed compared to the transmission output shaft RPM. What causes it to do that is how many teeth are on the ring gear and pinion gear in the rear end.
The math and the constants derived from knowing the two RPM's doesn't tell us much more about the truck and how it operates than knowing what color it is. Understanding it is a constant and determining the constant does not mean you understand how the rear end works. That knowledge is much deeper and requires removing the back plate of the rear end and looking inside and determining how it works. Once inside you will find highly machined parts (housings with bearings and races and shafts). And, it is how those parts interact over time, that shows us how what appears as a simple ratio is the result of a ring and pinion gear system. and, it is obvious that system involved tremendous design and manufacturing that can only be done by an intelligent being.
How much that truck can haul is easily determined by other constants that determine the amount of tension in the suspension springs. Once again the complex construction of the suspension provides us with things we can measure to determine a constant, but the constant itself tells us very little about the truck and how it works. What tells us about how the truck works is the way information is "built into" different parts of the truck. The rear end is a universe storing information that is embedded in the universe of the truck as a whole. The rear end is also embedded in the universe of the suspension which is embedded in the universe of the truck.
These layers of information stored in the reality of the truck, and the observation of the truck operating as a system over time, "explains" how the truck works and implies its purpose; not the constants describing the relationship between forces and rpm's.
You have a specialty in fluid dynamics. Fluids are made up of quarks that are embedded in atoms that are embedded in molecules that are all embedded in a fluid that is usually embedded in a solid container. And that container is also made up of embedded universes of atoms quarks and molecules. And finally the whole works is embedded in the Higgs field that is a perfect fluid made up of embedded higgs bosons that are made up of embedded virtual quarks.
We have different types of forces (electromagnetic, weak nuclear, strong nuclear, and gravity) interacting according to constants that determine the how these different universes interact, but in the end they are all made of interacting universes of information and groups of these universes interacting creates fields and fluid dynamics.
When you look at a truck from outer space it looks like a speck floating on a fluid let alone a complex system of embedded universes of information designed by highly intelligent beings. On an even large scale the same is true for the Earth when viewed from another galaxy and on the smallest scale the same is true for a single molecule of hydraulic oil flowing down a brake line in the above truck.
We are each individual universes of information, made up of universes of information, embedded in universes of information. We experience some of the universes (the one we live in that our senses can easily observe and measure) as Newtonian reality. We view the large universes (gravitational fields,galaxies and solar systems and the effects of Dark Energy and Dark Matter on those galaxies ) from Einstien's Relativistic point of view (which is from the point of view from a speck inside the universe). And we measure the smallest effects (atomic, molecular,strong nuclear force fields, weak nuclear force fields, electromagnetic force fields, fluid dynamics, and what "causes" Dark Matter and Dark Energy) from a quantum mechanical, quantum gravity, and string theory point of view (which is like the point of view similar to a view from a planet in one galaxy looking at another galaxy).
Scientists love to over simplify the quantum point of view for two reasons.
1. It is mostly invisible because the information is embedded in molecules, atoms and higgs bosons which requires the use of the imagination to visualize the physical mechanisms that constructs the reality that gives us the physical constants that simplify your interpretation of reality. We try to explain this reality by the data we collect at particle colliders like Cern (This would be similar to determining what the interior of an automotive rear end, suspension and all the other components of a car look like by rolling it down a hill and then blowing it up with a M1 tank and multiple 120 mm sabot rounds and finishing off the small pieces with the 50 call machine gun to determine why the constant that determines the ratio between engine rpm and ground speed is what it is.
The problem with that is,"you don't get to visualise the embedded systems operating overtime because they are destroyed the instant the atom is opened up. The same would happen to the components of a truck if we used the same M1 tank procedure to probe the embedded systems.
Right now science is arguing whether or not there even is embedded components, that are highly organized, constructing the the space contained inside the atom and the space contained in the higgs field.
The correct answer is "there are embedded components"(embedded universes) because the universal constants apply to the atom and the universe just like the gear ratios do to the truck.
Which brings up the following three questions:
1. Why do I even have a truck to push down the hill when it is constructed of complex embedded components?
2. Why do I even have matter to destroy in a particle accelerator (and live in as a biological organism) when it appears (from the existence of universal constants and ratios and the classification of the particles in qm) that it is made up of complex embedded components?
3. Is it reasonable to assume that the answer to both questions could be the same answer?
