37
   

The politics of hoodie wearing

 
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 11:02 am
@DrewDad,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
U have the right... that no one interfere with u.
DrewDad wrote:
Didn't you just object to me saying the same thing on another thread?
I don 't remember. I hope that I was not inconsistent.
In any case, the exercise of free speech in the streets is not interference.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 11:11 am
@MontereyJack,
MontereyJack wrote:
As I say, David, sheer fantasy.
U seem lost in yours. I guess that 's harmless.


MontereyJack wrote:
Your scenarios are full of "might haves" and "could happens".
That is because we don 't know the operative facts, with any certainty. I was not there looking.



MontereyJack wrote:
They both "could have been abducted by aliens and false memories implanted".
Notwithstanding your quotation marks, I did not say that.



MontereyJack wrote:
Probably didn't happen that way though.
A kid is dead and you''ve done nothing but defend the shooting
and INVENT scenarios where it was his fault. Disgusting.
It u wanna be disgusted, then DO it. U have permission.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 11:15 am
@parados,
Quote:
Anyway, you seem to have some emotion invested in trying to say this guy is white. Why is that?
parados wrote:
Facts are facts. You are the one that is trying to deny his being white by putting him in a category that is NOT race.
Its not always ez to select who will violently attack u.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 03:38 pm
@ossobuco,
No, I'm not wishing I hadn't looked like a druggie, I was a druggie and it didn't bother me if anyone assumed I was.

It would have been pretty stupid, in my opinion, if I looked like I looked, but didn't take drugs, and got pissed when someone assumed I did drugs.

There's a lot of willful ignorance in this thread.

Like many kids in the 60's and 70's dressed in a manner that shocked, alarmed or angered conventional society, many kids do so today. For black kids the look is "gangsta." This doesn't mean they are all actual gangsters but it's a look they affect to be perceived as cool.

Hoods with the hood up are part of the look. The utilitarian aspect of a hood is a bonus.

If you adopt the trappings of popular images, no matter what that image may be, don't be surprised or outraged if people buy it.

MontereyJack
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 04:34 pm
Doesn't give you a right to shoot them.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 04:42 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
You're welcome to your opinion, naturally.

Me, I'm more than I ever was before weary of clothing and hair police.
I fully understand people wanting to avoid some kind of universal uniform.
I do understand how uniforms can work in some circumstances, how certain attire is appropriate for some work categories, and also get how rebellious clothing or hair can become a new kind of uniform.
Any perception of connection between clothing and drugs or hair and drugs is fraught with presumptions that may well be false.

Thought you were a libertarian, Finn.
0 Replies
 
Ceili
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 05:21 pm
Where I live the hoodie is part of everyday wear. You see babies to grannies wearing them. I would never equate them with a counter culture uniform. I've been all over the US and I've seen them on army guys to college students wearing them emblazoned with Harvard and the like, in campgrounds to malls. The sell them at balls games and schools. I've seen cowboys wearing kerchiefs, I didn't assume they would pull 'em up and rob a bank. I seen guys who wore wife-beaters.. I didn't assume they were.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  3  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 06:47 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Does it factor into your piercing analysis of popular dress habits that it was raining when he put his hoodie up?
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 07:59 pm
The BBC has laid claim that hoodies are a political issue

Cameron to make 'hoodie' appeal

Conservative leader David Cameron is expected to call for greater understanding of teenage "hoodies" in a forthcoming speech on social justice.

Sunday, 9 July 2006

Quote:
Mr Cameron will say teenagers who hide under hooded tops are trying to "blend in" rather than appear threatening.

In a speech on Monday he will describe them as "a response to a problem, not a problem itself".

And he will argue that while teenage criminals must be punished, they should also be shown "a lot more love".

Hooded tops have come to be viewed by some as a symbol of social disorder.


In a dangerous environment the best thing to do is keep your head down, blend in
David Cameron
Last year the Bluewater shopping centre in Kent banned people wearing hooded tops, and said youths were using the hoods to shield their faces from CCTV cameras while committing crimes.

"We - the people in suits - often see hoodies as aggressive, the uniform of a rebel army of young gangsters," the Tory leader is expected to say.

"But hoodies are more defensive than offensive. They're a way to stay invisible in the street. In a dangerous environment the best thing to do is keep your head down, blend in."

Mr Cameron will say that, for some people, "the hoodie represents all that's wrong about youth culture in Britain today".

However, he will go on: "For me, adult society's response to the hoodie shows how far we are from finding the long-term answers to put things right."
.
.
.
However, former Tory MP and newspaper columnist Michael Brown said traditional Tory voters may not agree with Mr Cameron's stance.

"David Cameron is pushing at the envelope with regard to his backbench support and the support in the grassroots constituencies," he told BBC Breakfast.

"I suspect this isn't going to go down too well in the Bromleys and the Chislehursts.

"I suspect he's going to have to watch his back and as he seeks new friends, as he seeks the new liberal constituency he's got to make sure he doesn't lose his conservative constituency."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_politics/5162010.stm
Lash
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 08:30 pm
@parados,
Dude. He's not white.
ABE5177
 
  1  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 08:49 pm
@Lash,
Lash wrote:

Dude. He's not white.

that's a fact and heres his father
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/dr/hln/www/release/sites/default/files/imagecache/textarticle_640/2012/03/29/zimmerman.1_3.jpg
like father like son

whats the prob with saying this zilmmerman not white?
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  3  
Reply Thu 29 Mar, 2012 10:01 pm
@Lash,
Lash, do you think that his being half white (or whatever he is) has any bearing on whether or not he may have had a bias toward black men that could affect his actions? I'm trying to figure out what your point is. If he was biracial black and white and had shown a propensity to be suspicious of young black men and everything else in this case remained the same, would it affect whether or not an injustice had been done here? You've pointed out that he is most assuredly not white. I'm trying to figure out how that is despositive of anything.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 01:16 am

I live in a quiet area; not much crime,
but if there were burglaries around here,
then I 'd be pleased if some of my nabors kept a sharp eye on what was going on in the area.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 01:35 am
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:
The BBC has laid claim that hoodies are a political issue

Cameron to make 'hoodie' appeal

Conservative leader David Cameron is expected to call for greater understanding
of teenage "hoodies" in a forthcoming speech on social justice.


Sunday, 9 July 2006

Quote:
Mr Cameron will say teenagers who hide under hooded tops are trying to "blend in" rather than appear threatening.
I wonder as to the source of his information, on this point.




Quote:
In a speech on Monday he will describe them as "a response to a problem, not a problem itself".
I wonder how he discovered that???



Quote:
And he will argue that while teenage criminals must be punished, they should also be shown "a lot more love".
Is he going to DO that????
Maybe he 'll take counsel from Bill Clinton.





Quote:
Hooded tops have come to be viewed by some as a symbol of social disorder.
If thay r big enuf, thay make good de facto masks.




Quote:
In a dangerous environment the best thing to do is keep your head down, blend in
I consider England to be "a dangerous environment"
in that the future victims wonder around in an unarmed, docile, helpless condition; inglorious
.





Quote:
David Cameron
Last year the Bluewater shopping centre in Kent banned people wearing hooded tops, and said youths were using the hoods to shield their faces from CCTV cameras while committing crimes.

"We - the people in suits - often see hoodies as aggressive, the uniform of a rebel army of young gangsters," the Tory leader is expected to say.

"But hoodies are more defensive than offensive. They're a way to stay invisible in the street. In a dangerous environment the best thing to do is keep your head down, blend in."

Mr Cameron will say that, for some people, "the hoodie represents all that's wrong about youth culture in Britain today".

However, he will go on: "For me, adult society's response to the hoodie shows how far we are from finding the long-term answers to put things right."
.
.
.
However, former Tory MP and newspaper columnist Michael Brown said traditional Tory voters may not agree with Mr Cameron's stance.

"David Cameron is pushing at the envelope with regard to his backbench support and the support in the grassroots constituencies," he told BBC Breakfast.

"I suspect this isn't going to go down too well in the Bromleys and the Chislehursts.

"I suspect he's going to have to watch his back and as he seeks new friends, as he seeks the new liberal constituency he's got to make sure he doesn't lose his conservative constituency."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_politics/5162010.stm
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  4  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 06:05 am
@snood,
Additionally, there is racism between minorities too -- that is, just because someone is Hispanic doesn't mean he can't hold racist attitudes towards black people.

I saw puh-lenty of that in L.A. (Both directions.)
snood
 
  6  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 06:44 am
@sozobe,
sozobe wrote:

Additionally, there is racism between minorities too -- that is, just because someone is Hispanic doesn't mean he can't hold racist attitudes towards black people.

I saw puh-lenty of that in L.A. (Both directions.)


Yes!!! Like, some of the well reported crazy police shootings of young black men have involved black or hispanic cops doing the shooting and it's pretty widely accepted that they too can have preconceived notions about black men that affect their performance..
Zimmerman didn't need to be 100% Wasp to have perceptions clouded by bigotry.

In the case of Trayvon, I see the racial aspect as more of a nasty footnote than the overriding factor. I think what should be focused on (and what those close to the case who are of good faith ARE focusing on) is the fact that this was an unlawful killing, and a possible cover-up.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  4  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 06:50 am
@Lash,
White is a race.
Hispanic is ethnicity.

http://www.diffen.com/difference/Ethnicity_vs_Race
ABE5177
 
  1  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 07:51 am
@snood,
snood wrote:

Lash, do you think that his being half white

You've pointed out that he is most assuredly not white. I'm trying to figure out how that is despositive of anything.

do YOU gthink so many blacks would demo0nstrate if the shooter was balack?

be honest
parados
 
  3  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 08:00 am
@ABE5177,
I always thought football coaches were hoodlums


http://assets.espn.go.com/i/eticket/20080131/photos/etick_g_eadams05_645.jpg



Even playing golf, he wears a hoodie

http://cdn2.sbnation.com/imported_assets/981514/AlZ41C9CMAEWPEd.jpg
snood
 
  4  
Reply Fri 30 Mar, 2012 08:05 am
@ABE5177,
No, of course not. And that whole theme of "blacks are supporting a black" is interesting. But I think it's a diversion. I think all that is marginal to what this particular case is about. This case is about an unlawful killing and possible coverup by law enforcement involving a young black man, and about a possible instance of systemic injustice.

Anyway, since we're entertaining tangiential notions -Do you think Zimmerman would have been let go that evening if he had been a young black man, and the decedent white? Be honest.
 

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