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I just don’t understand drinking and driving

 
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 11:49 am
@firefly,
Quote:
It is fairly safe to assume that his blood alcohol level was over .08 when he got behind the wheel of his car if he consumed those 4 Long Island Iced Teas.


No it not if the drinking was over hours with food thrown in.

It could had done so and it might not had done so.
jcboy
 
  2  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 11:56 am
I’ve been to Alibi on Long Island ice tea night. They make them with four different kinds of liquor and in a 20 oz. mug, this is a pretty good size mug. I think they’re nasty tasting. I’m 185lbs and one was enough for me. I’ve seen Thom many times, he’s probably 5’9 5’10, slim, maybe 150lbs.
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 12:10 pm
@jcboy,
Jcboy I am 220 lbs and I am no longer willing to drive with more then one drink in me but I am not of the opinion you can guess at the blood alcohol level in a person at a time of an accident with the information given.

I am sure both the prosecutors and the defense will have experts on the subject at a trial assuming it does not go to a plea bargain.


0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 12:20 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM, the man is charged with DUI. And, even if, as David has suggested, he went home, and possibly had a few more drinks, before calling police, he'd just be digging himself into a deeper hole, all things considered. At the time of his arrest, he apparently had a BAC over .08. And he was known to have consumed a considerable amount of alcohol at the bar.
Quote:
No it not if the drinking was over hours with food thrown in.

You don't know what you are talking about.

Food does not remove alcohol from the body--it may just help to slow down the absorption rate of the alcohol.

And the 4 drinks in question were each 22% stronger than other cocktails, and larger than other cocktails--making those 4 drinks more like 5 or more.

Quote:
Why You Should Never Drink and Drive
Impairment Begins Long Before You Are Legally Drunk
By Buddy T
June 23, 2011

It's not a question of whether you are legally intoxicated, it's a question of whether or not it is safe to drive when you have consumed any amount of alcohol. Research shows that impairment begins long before a person reaches the blood alcohol concentration level necessary to be guilty of drunken driving.

The Legal Limit
In all 50 states, the legal limit for drunk driving is a blood alcohol concentration (BAC) level of .08. A 120-pound woman can reach a .08 BAC level after only two drinks and a 180-pound man can be at .08 after only four drinks.
A "drink" is either one shot of liquor, a five-ounce glass of wine or one beer, all of which contain the same amount of alcohol.

At a .08 BAC level, drivers are so impaired that they are 11 times more likely to have a single-vehicle crash than drivers with no alcohol in their system. But 25 years of research has shown that some impairment begins for both males and females even after one drink.

.02 BAC Level
At the .02 blood alcohol concentration level, experiments have demostrated that people exhibit some loss of judgment, begin to relax and feel good. But tests have also shown that drivers at the .02 level experience a decline in visual functions, affecting their ability to track a moving object, and experience a decline in the ability to perform two tasks at the same

These changes may be very subtle and barely noticable to the person who has had only one drink, but in an emergency situation while behind the wheel of a vehicle, they could cause the driver to react (or not react) as they would without having had a drink.

.05 BAC Level
At the .05 BAC level, people begin to exhibit exaggerated behavior, experience loss of small-muscle control -- such as being able to focus their eyes quickly -- have impaired judgment, lowered alertness and a release of inhibition.
If someone with a BAC level of .05 gets behind the wheel, they would be operating the vehicle with reduce coordination, a futher deminished ability to track moving objects, more difficulty in steering and a markedly reduced response in emergency situations.

.08 BAC Level
When someone drinking is approaching the borderline of legal intoxication, studies show that he or she has poor muscle coordination -- affecting their balance, speech, vision, reaction time and hearing -- find it more difficult to detect danger, and exhibit impaired judgement, self-control, reasoning ability and memory.
A driver with a BAC of .08 will find it more difficult to concentrate, judge the speed of the vehicle, experience reduced information processing capability and exhibit impaired perception.


Slower Reaction Time
For the person who is drinking, the above impairments may be hardly noticeable at the time, but the slow reaction times that they can produce could prove fatal in a emergency driving situation. That's why it is not a good idea to drive no matter how much or how little that you have had to drink.
There is another consideration: Alcohol affects people differently. Some people have a higher response to drinking alcohol than others. In other words, people with a high response to alcohol can experience signs of impairment at the .02 BAC level that others do not experience until the .05 level.

The Safe Limit
For this reason, in some states drivers can be arrested for driving while impaired even if their blood alcohol concentration is lower than the legal limit, if the law enforcement officer believes he has probable cause based on the behavior and reactions of the driver.
It's simply not a wise choice to get behind the wheel no matter how much you have had to drink. The only safe driving limit is .00 percent
http://alcoholism.about.com/od/dui/a/impaired.htm

Quote:
I am sure both the prosecutors and the defense will have experts on the subject at a trial assuming it does not go to a plea bargain.

The arguments would also have to focus on his BAC level at the time of his arrest--and that level was at least .08 since he is charged with DUI. And that was some time after the accident.

This man's actions are so unjustifiable he'd be crazy to go to trial.

BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 12:45 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
The arguments would also have to focus on his BAC level at the time of his arrest


Love that you are such an expert on the subject and the blood alcohol level at the time of the accident matter not before or afterward.

There been a case that I remember reading about where someone had drunk enough to place him over the limit and got behind the wheel of a car and had an accident however it was shown by experts that the time between the drinking and the accident was not enough for the alcohol to reach an over the limit level in his blood before the accident occur. The testing sometime later that show an over the limit results was beside the point.

In other word it not that simple.
firefly
 
  2  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:04 pm
@BillRM,
Quote:
however it was shown by experts that the time between the drinking and the accident was not enough for the alcohol to reach an over the limit level in his blood before the accident occur.

But, in this case, they do know when he was served those drinks, and what time he left the bar, and what time he hit the cyclist. And the effect of those exceptionally potent, and large, 4 Long Island Iced Teas, consumed by a 150 pound man, prior to the collision with the cyclist, could easily have pushed his BAC beyond .08. when he got behind the wheel of his car. And his BAC was over .08 when he was arrested.

Your hypothetical examples are not really germane to this case. A defense attorney for this particular driver really does not have much of anything to maneuver with. His client didn't even bother to stop his car to look at the victim he just hit.

This driver is in very serious legal difficulty. And he got himself into that difficulty. And he killed someone. It is hard to feel much sympathy for him.
Setanta
 
  3  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:10 pm
Bill, apart from the eternal observation that he's an idiot, is just arguing with you because it's you.
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:27 pm
@firefly,
Quote:
Your hypothetical examples are not really germane to this case. A defense attorney for this particular driver really does not have much of anything to maneuver with. His client didn't even bother to stop his car to look at the victim he just hit.


There was nothing hypothetical about the one case I wrote about and it never as simple as you seems to thinks all cases are.

Yes he is very likely to plea out that I happen to agree with you.
jcboy
 
  2  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:28 pm
@BillRM,
I don’t believe Thom made himself another cocktail after getting home. He’s good friends with my friend Jonathan and he told Jon he called the police as soon as he got home and told them he was involved in an accident but wasn’t sure what he hit. The guy on the bike hit his windshield, not sure how you couldn’t know when a body hits your windshield.
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:36 pm
@Setanta,
Quote:
Bill, apart from the eternal observation that he's an idiot, is just arguing with you because it's you.

I know that. He also hates to pass up any opportunity to display his idiocy. Laughing
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  3  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:41 pm
@jcboy,
Quote:
The guy on the bike hit his windshield, not sure how you couldn’t know when a body hits your windshield

If you're drunk enough, and you don't bother to stop, you might not be sure of anything.

How are Thom's close friends dealing with this situation, jcboy? Are they trying to help him in some way? Do you know how he is doing?
jcboy
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:53 pm
@firefly,
The last time they talked to him was Saturday evening. He hasn't been answering the phone. Jon said he stopped by his house yesterday and nobody answered the door.

His parents live in Tampa, they think he might be staying there.
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 01:57 pm
@jcboy,
jcboy wrote:

The last time they talked to him was Saturday evening. He hasn't been answering the phone. Jon said he stopped by his house yesterday and nobody answered the door.

His parents live in Tampa, they think he might be staying there.


smart move after the state publishes your name and address and thus attempts to sic a mob onto you.
jcboy
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 02:00 pm
@hawkeye10,
That could be true, I noticed the address, however they spelled the name of the street wrong Smile but anyone knowing this area would be able to figure that out.
0 Replies
 
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 02:01 pm
@jcboy,
Quote:
not sure how you couldn’t know when a body hits your windshield.


It looks like it is pretty dark at night in that block, not a lot of street lights and it looks like a lot of homes have been bulldozed over the years as it is a busy street, thus the lots are now empty and provide no light.....people dont like to live on busy streets. His story sounds credible to me.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 03:49 pm
@ehBeth,
ehBeth wrote:
I don't really understand why we're getting all caught up in one accident.

I look at the thread title and just think yup - don't get it.
OK, then u post another one,
and we can post to that one too; we r not discriminating against u.

Pick a good one.





David
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 04:55 pm
@BillRM,
Firefly wrote:
A defense attorney for this particular driver really does not have much of anything to maneuver with. His client didn't even bother to stop his car to look at the victim he just hit.
I 'm not sure things r all that bleak n dreary
for defense counsel, here, Firefly.
Maybe it coud be possible that he'll get a Miranda suppression of his confession.
If not, he might plausibly modify it with explanation of what he meant.




BillRM wrote:
Yes he is very likely to plea out that I happen to agree with you.
I believe that to be true;
a plea, with no incarceration (I suspect).
That CAN have negative consequences qua subsequent tortious litigation.

Just speaking as a citizen (one who has been rear-ended by tipsy drivers,
especially at this time of Year) I don 't see this as a case that cries out
for raw vengeance. It will not help decedent.





David
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 05:17 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
I don 't see this as a case that cries out
for raw vengeance. It will not help decedent
.

As a night cyclist I had mxed feelings but if the cyclist was on a dark road and not lit up it is likely that a driver who is a non drinker would had hit him also.

Not sure at all how must the condition of the driver had to do with this accident.
0 Replies
 
firefly
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 05:25 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Quote:
I 'm not sure things r all that bleak n dreary
for defense counsel, here, Firefly...
a plea, with no incarceration (I suspect).

You are very optimistic, David.

These are the possible penalties in Florida. It would be difficult to plead this down to a deal without incarceration. And why would a D.A. want to do that?
Quote:
Manslaughter and Vehicular Homicide-s. 316.193 (3), F.S.

DUI/Manslaughter: Second Degree Felony (not more than $10,000 fine and/or 15 years imprisonment).

DUI Manslaughter/Leaving the Scene: A driver convicted of DUI Manslaughter who knew/should have known accident occurred; and failed to give information or render aid is guilty of a First Degree Felony (not more than $10,000 fine and/or 30 years imprisonment).

Vehicular Homicide: Second Degree Felony (not more than $10,000 fine and/or 15 years imprisonment).

Vehicular Homicide/Leaving the Scene: A driver convicted of vehicular homicide who left the scene of an accident is guilty of a First Degree Felony (nor more than $10,000 fine and/or 30 years imprisonment).
http://www.flhsmv.gov/ddl/duilaws.html
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Tue 27 Dec, 2011 05:43 pm
@firefly,
A lot of things could harm a jury likely willingness to put the hammer down on the driver such as it turn out that the cyclist was high on drugs or alcohol himself.

I love how you are so sure of everything Firefly before it get near a court room.
 

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