The Qur'an and/or the Bible

Cults of the dead. Their masters long gone. Sheep wandering all over the hills.

Easily spooked too.

Belief is a dangerous thing. It is best to do away with it. The only way to dispel belief is with direct perception. Only then will you know what the word of God is.

You'll know it never comes from a book.



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The two largest monotheistic religions in the world stems from these two scriptures, the qur'an and the bible. But which of these scriptures are the actual word of God? Let's have a dialogue.

The two largest monotheistic religions in the world stems from these two scriptures, the qur'an and the bible. But which of these scriptures are the actual word of God? Let's have a dialogue.

Response: Then how can humankind be guided towards God without some sort of revelation?

The two largest monotheistic religions in the world stems from these two scriptures, the qur'an and the bible. But which of these scriptures are the actual word of God? Let's have a dialogue.

Firstly, this topic has already been discussed throughly (with solid proofs/evidences) in this following thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/all-religions/if-jesus-god-1097.html

And here http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/all-religions/quran-leads-way-science-video-998.html

Secondly, most of those who will respond to you here are atheists who can not present anyting except laughing and insults (refer to this thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/islam/jesus-muslim-3666.html). They falsely claim to believe in only scientific facts but whenever they are given such scientific facts they will be the first to reject them!

.....

Secondly, most of those who will respond to you here are atheists who can not present anyting except laughing and insults (refer to this thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/islam/jesus-muslim-3666.html). They falsely claim to believe in only scientific facts but whenever they are given such scientific facts they will be the first to reject them!

Your "proofs" turned out to be none of any such thing. How chewed gum looks is not proof :rollinglaugh:

Firstly, this topic has already been discussed throughly (with solid proofs/evidences) in this following thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/all-religions/if-jesus-god-1097.html

And here http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/all-religions/quran-leads-way-science-video-998.html

Secondly, most of those who will respond to you here are atheists who can not present anyting except laughing and insults (refer to this thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/islam/jesus-muslim-3666.html). They falsely claim to believe in only scientific facts but whenever they are given such scientific facts they will be the first to reject them!

For those pathetic atheists who hate the TRUTH because it is against their self desires, and who know nothing about anything.

Originally stated by SWORD of GOD
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Secondly, most of those who will respond to you here are atheists who can not present anyting except laughing and insults (refer to this thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/all-religions/reli...slim-3666.html). They falsely claim to believe in only scientific facts but whenever they are given such scientific facts they will be the first to reject them!

Originally stated by Numpty
Well i just found out I am about to lose my job, so you will have to wait.

Got any issues with that?

Origionally stated by SWORD of GOD
Well, I can proceed (continue) with my new evidences and in that case you have no right to return back and argue later about my basic probability methodolgy and no more talk about that atheist video guy (you watched three times!).

Okay ?

Neither. Both the words of men.

Response: On the contrary, the qur'an can actually be proven to be the word of Allah (God). In ch.4:82 of the qur'an we read "Will they not, then, meditate upon the qur'an? Had it been from anyone other than Allah, they would surely have found therein much discrepancy". Also, in ch.2:23 we read "And if you are in doubt as to what we have sent down to our servant, then produce a chapter like it, and call upon your helpers beside Allah, if you are truthful".

Here are two logical test to prove the authenticity of the qur'an. When applied, one can easily discover that the qur'an is the word of Allah. You disagree? Then apply the tests and prove the qur'an wrong.

The burden is not mine to bare. The Quran has not shown itself to be any better than other holybooks. None show any considerable advantage over the others, only in how certain their followers claim to be, but certainty does not constitute validity. Perhaps if the Quran predicted next years lottery number then I would be impressed.

Response: Very well then. But when a person fails or refuses to take up the challenge it only shows a disfavor to their own logic, not the qur'an.

Firstly, this topic has already been discussed throughly (with solid proofs/evidences) in this following thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/all-religions/if-jesus-god-1097.html

And here http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/all-religions/quran-leads-way-science-video-998.html

Secondly, most of those who will respond to you here are atheists who can not present anyting except laughing and insults (refer to this thread http://www.conflictingviews.com/religion/islam/jesus-muslim-3666.html). They falsely claim to believe in only scientific facts but whenever they are given such scientific facts they will be the first to reject them!

A challenge made upon a bad assumption. A "begging the question" of sorts. How would inability to produce a chapter like that in the quran prove that it is the word of god? And in what sense must it be "like" a chapter in the quran, and who decides?

Negative proof: Information from Answers.com

Response: Well, the qur'an is within itself a miracle. Allah is challenging you to produce just a chapter as inspiring and as successful as the qur'an or at least a chapter. Why? Because is trying to show you that it is impossibe, I repeat, absolutely impossible, for anyone to create a religious scripture and use this made up scripture to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation. This is the challenge. By doing so, Muhammad conquered all of Arabia. Now, it's your turn. Create your man-made religion and go out into the world, propogating it and see if you can conquer a nation in the same manner. I can guarantee you, you will not only fail, you will fail miserably. You won't even be able to convince the block you live on, let alone a nation. Once you fail, you will be forced to ask yourself a question, "why was it possible for Muhammad but impossible for me"? Then you will come to realize that the only logical answer is because Allah (God) was on the side of Muhammad. Without Allah, even Muhammad would have failed. You still disagree, then take the challenge and prove the qur'an wrong.

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
In it's most basic sense the Quran is shifting the burden of proof. The Quran must show that it is the word of god rather than asking me to show that it is not. If I had to disprove every book that claimed to be the word of god, then I would be a really busy person.

Response: Well, the qur'an is within itself a miracle.

Allah is challenging you to produce just a chapter as inspiring and as successful as the qur'an or at least a chapter. Why? Because is trying to show you that it is impossibe, I repeat, absolutely impossible,

for anyone to create a religious scripture and use this made up scripture to inspire enough followers to conquer a nation. This is the challenge. By doing so, Muhammad conquered all of Arabia. Now, it's your turn. Create your man-made religion and go out into the world, propogating it and see if you can conquer a nation in the same manner. I can guarantee you, you will not only fail, you will fail miserably. You won't even be able to convince the block you live on, let alone a nation.

Once you fail, you will be forced to ask yourself a question, "why was it possible for Muhammad but impossible for me"? Then you will come to realize that the only logical answer is because Allah (God) was on the side of Muhammad.

The burden of proof is not being shifted. The challenge being made is coming from the qur'an itself.

The qur'an is filled with many logical explanations to prove that it is the word of God

but for whatever reason, you do not acknowledge them.

So Allah is challenging those in doubt.

You can look at it one way and say that the burden of proof has been shifted on you but it is also you that claimed that the qur'an is man-made so it is also the burden of proof on you to prove that it is man-made. So Allah has placed a challenge addressing both scenarios.

And If I challenge you or anyone else to produce a work like that of Shakespeare it would also be impossible, but does that mean Shakespeare is a prophet of god?

Response: Many atheist like to use your example as a rebuttle against the challenge but fail to see the incomparison. Your challenge says to produce a work like that of Shakespeare which is not impossible at all and addresses no specific miracle. For example, I have written many poems before and have heard poems and novels myself which many would say is better than Shakespeare. There are some people who don't even like or understand Shakespeare. But what you have done is changed the challenge. I pointed out a specific accomplishment that the qur'an and Muhammad did which is the challenge for those who disbelieve to match. Not to just simply produce another book of literature.

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
Yet as any christian or historian can tell you, the bible has already met the challenge and superseded the Quran in every way. So why then do you not believe the bible?

Response: You see, here is the problem. Naturally, as you should have expected, I as a muslim and all other muslims as well will disagree. Let's not forget the other part of the challenge made in ch.4:82 of the qur'an where it asks to find discrepancy in the qur'an. God can not be able to produce a book with any discrepancy and the bible is full of them so this alone eliminates the bible from being the word of God.

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
Except the Quran was written in a time when people believed in dragons and sea-monsters, so it is hardly a fair comparison.

Response: Atheist (assuming you are one) always want the believers to provide evidence but never do so themselves. Where is your proof for the statement above?

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
Even if I could write a religious text that inspired millions to conquer foreign nations, I wouldn't want to. Why would I want to purposefully deceive millions of people and potentially end many lives.

Response: I don't know why. Only you know best as to why you would want to do something or not.

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
For someone to make a religious text with the intention of starting a religion they must believe their own lies or otherwise be entirely despicable human beings. The challenge is intentional meant to be impossible so as to not have people threaten their faith.

Response: So you do admit that the challenge is impossible? Your words, not mine.

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
And why would I go through all of that trouble to prove something that I already know?
Even if I succeeded would that prove my work to be the work of god? No, it proves my ability to deceive, which is exactly what the Quran and the Bible does.

Response: That's a statement? Where's the proof? Without taking the challenge, all you are doing is stating things without proof.

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
No it would only show Muhammad was a better writer and persuader than I.

Response: Again, where's the proof?

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
Then show them to me and do not assume they are there. I would like to see this supposed "proof". I've heard there is proof but I've yet to see any, just a bunch of pish-posh sales pitches and assumptions.

Response: Allah poses a similar challenge several times in the qur'an. If you are an atheist, then Allah asks a simple question and says "how did the universe and life come into existance"?

Quote: Fatal Freedoms
The Quran was written by Muhammad, and he was a man. If you say he was inspired by god, then show me the evidence. This is the same poor argument Christians give me, yet somehow they both can't be correct, can they?