4
   

Oz Election Thread #4 - Gillard's Labor

 
 
Bootlace
 
  1  
Reply Tue 11 Sep, 2012 11:47 pm
@msolga,
msolga wrote:


Pity Australian governments have not been nearly so forthcoming in defending their own citizens in political strife & danger abroad ... like David Hicks, Mamdouh Habib (at Guantanomo Bay) & more recently, Julian Assange.

I for one don't have any sympathy for David Hicks. He was a mercenary fighting or preparing to fight Australian soldiers. He is not only lucky to be alive, but lucky to be allowed back into the country.
Our country is suffering enough deaths from " friendly" soldiers without Australian citizens fighting them as well.
Builder
 
  3  
Reply Wed 12 Sep, 2012 12:32 am
@Bootlace,
Technically, Hicks was a US ally at the time he joined the resistance fighters. His trainers were trained by the CIA to repel Russian invaders. Look it up.
0 Replies
 
hingehead
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 Sep, 2012 04:59 pm
http://sphotos-f.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/250198_516286088385473_1927805729_n.jpg
Dutchy
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 Sep, 2012 05:13 pm
@msolga,
I agree with you for a change msolga. We're deeply involved in the fishing industry in South Australia and being a Dutchman I have made it my business to know why these Dutchmen are a here, a world away from their homeland! The answer is quite simply,they have cleaned out the North Sea and the North Atlantic and know our waters are untouched. The fish they're after is the staple food of the Dutch but the lifeline for our Tuna Industry. I hope tyhe Government stick to their guns and ban them permanently.
0 Replies
 
Dutchy
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 Sep, 2012 05:20 pm
@msolga,
Again I agree with you msolga. LOL Our Government should be ashamed for their lack of action involving the people you mentioned, in particular the case of David Hicks. Johnny Howard conveniently overlooked the crimes committed against this young man by the US, an absolute disgrace.
Bootlace
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 Sep, 2012 11:34 pm
@Dutchy,
Hick's letters to his family :-
Quote:

I learnt about weapons such as ballistic missiles, surface to surface and shoulder fired missiles, anti aircraft and anti-tank rockets, rapid fire heavy and light machine guns, pistols, AK47s, mines and explosives. After three months everybody leaves capable and war-ready being able to use all of these weapons capably and responsibly. I am now very well trained for jihad in weapons some serious like anti-aircraft missiles.


Hardly a model citizen.
Dutchy
 
  3  
Reply Wed 12 Sep, 2012 11:59 pm
@Bootlace,
Aren't our soldiers taught the same things?
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2012 01:00 am
@Dutchy,
Quote:
Again I agree with you msolga. LOL

And I agree with you, Dutchy!
(Isn't being so agreeable good fun! Very Happy Wink )
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2012 01:01 am
@hingehead,
Haha, hinge.
So true!
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  2  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2012 01:17 am
@Builder,
Quote:
Let's just stay on track with vetoing the TPP.


I just read this via an email.
Read on if you're interested.
Very worrying indeed!

Quote:
Dear friends,

We have four days to stop a top-secret global corporate power grab that attacks everything from a free Internet to environmental protections. This agreement is being negotiated right now by bureaucrats backed by corporate lobbyists. Click below to crash their secret meeting with our global call to kill the TPP deal:


Details are leaking of a top-secret, global corporate power grab of breathtaking scope -- attacking everything from a free Internet to health and environmental regulations, and we have just 4 days to stop it.

Big business has a new plan to fatten their pockets: a giant global pact, with an international tribunal to enforce it, that is kept top secret for years (even from our lawmakers!) and then brought down like a Death Star on our democracies. Big Tobacco, Big Oil, Big Pharma, Walmart and almost 600 other corporate lobbyists are all in on the draft -- including limits on smoking laws, affordable medicines and free speech on the Net.

The latest round of negotiations ends in just 4 days -- but outcries in each of our countries could shake the confidence of negotiators and scuttle the talks forever. Let's get to a million against the global corporate takeover. Sign below and forward widely. Avaaz will project our petition counter on the walls of the conference so negotiators can see the opposition to their plan exploding in real time:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/stop_the_corporate_death_star/?bLzodcb&v=17866

The deal, called the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP), is written to protect investors from government regulation, even if that regulation is passed in the public interest. Leaked versions suggest the TPP would undermine protections for air and water safety and reintroduce measures from the US Internet freedom attack as well as steamrolling efforts to produce generic affordable medicines. Worse still, lawmakers who fail to conform to the TPP’s rules face sanctions in an international tribunal -- a place where corporations can sue us for deals previous governments signed in secret!

Negotiators say this is just a trade agreement, written to facilitate investment and profit for all. But the leaked draft imposes so many limits on citizen protections, it's clear this "trade" agreement is skewed to put corporate profit above people's needs -- that's not surprising since it's been drafted in secret with almost 600 corporate lobbyists.

But there is hope: Australia is bucking against the international tribunal system, and New Zealand is objecting to the takeover of its medicine-pricing protections that keep drugs affordable. Massive public opposition, casting doubt over each country's ability to sell TPP at home, could derail the talks for good.
Sign the petition now, and forward widely -- the delegates and lobbyists are watching the wave of opposition grow in real time:

http://www.avaaz.org/en/stop_the_corporate_death_star/?bLzodcb&v=17866

US candidate for Senate, Elizabeth Warren in a recent speech said: “Corporations are not people. People have hearts, they have kids, they get jobs, they get sick, they cry, they dance. They live, they love, and they die. And that matters, because we don't run this country for corporations, we run it for people." Let’s reach one million to stop the corporate takeover of our governments.

With hope,

MORE INFORMATION

The Nation: "NAFTA on Steroids"
http://www.thenation.com/article/168627/nafta-steroids

The Guardian: "The Pacific free trade deal that's anything but free"
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/aug/27/pacific-free-trade-deal

Huffington Post: "Leak Cracks Open Trans-Pacific Partnership Scandal"
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ian-fletcher/leak-cracks-open-transpac_b_1594675.html

Reuters: "Lawmakers press for open Trans-Pacific trade talks"
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/27/us-usa-congress-trade-idUSBRE85Q1MK20120627

TechDirt: "Hollywood Gets To Party With TPP Negotiators; Public Interest Groups Get Thrown Out Of Hotel"
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20120131/23161417605/hollywood-gets-to-party-with-tpp-negotiators-public-interest-groups-get-thrown-out-hotel.shtml

Electronic Frontier Foundation: "Background and analysis of the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement"
https://www.eff.org/issues/tpp


4 Days to Stop the Corporate Death Star:
http://www.avaaz.org/en/stop_the_corporate_death_star/?bLzodcb&v=17866

.
msolga
 
  2  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2012 01:46 am
@msolga,
Just finished reading all the linked articles about the TPP from The Nation, The Guardian, Huffington Post, Reuters, Tech Dirt & the Electronic Foundation (in my post above).
This is absolutely appalling!
No wonder the negotiations have been shrouded in secrecy.
This is not about free trade, it's a corporate takeover!

Who is representing us at these talks?
And how do we extricate ourselves from this?
msolga
 
  2  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2012 02:06 am
@msolga,
And this is how our government describes the Trans-Pacific Partnership negotiations.
Quote: "Australia's decision to participate in the TPP in 2008 followed an extensive public consultation process."
Extensive public consultation process?
And how come hardly anyone knows anything about the details of the negotiations which have been going on since 2008? Confused
Even members of the US congress are having trouble gaining access to the details!

from DFAT: About the TPP negotiations:
http://www.dfat.gov.au/fta/tpp/index.html
Builder
 
  2  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2012 02:46 am
@msolga,
Thankyou for your research efforts, Miss Olga.

I've been on the tools again, trying to make ends meet.

It (TPP) is absolutely appalling in scope and possible impact.

It's not enough to just buy yourself a president, and the whole of congress (Bernie Sanders aside), these greedy pricks want it all, and they want it without any kind of regard for environmental safety, or any regulatory body oversight.

It's criminal in intent, and underhanded in the way they are keeping it from the nations that will be effected.

It's a class war, and the upper class want it all for themselves. At any cost.

Time to get serious about what kind of future we want to leave for our children, because our governments have been bought off, and can't be trusted at all.

msolga
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 01:51 am
@Builder,
Another email just now from AVAZZ.:

Quote:
Urgent -- Negotiators are locking civil society out from the entire TPP conference. The talks end in 36 hours, let's make an urgent call for transparency and accountability, not corporate greed.


Why can't we mere citizens have a say in what our government agrees to, or not, on our behalf?
The implications for all of us are huge.

I am so disappointed in the lack of interest from Oz A2Kers, apart from a couple of us.


Builder
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 02:15 am
@msolga,
Apathy, along with self-interest, has been nurtured by the corporate criminals. Never in history have our youth been so self-absorbed and dis-interested in what is happening outside of their own little domain.

I did hear that the NDAA has been revoked by the SCOTUS yesterday, so that's a small hedge against what is obviously the start of the oligopoly takeover of our privacy in every respect.

It scares the **** outta me. But it would seem like we're not making any headway in spreading the news. News channels themselves have long been owned by these criminals, and even the indy news channels are accessing their data, so it's not like we can ever really hope for help in that quarter.

What's a poor boy to do?
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 02:31 am
@Builder,
Quote:
Apathy, along with self-interest

I don't think that's the problem here.
There aren't enough of us posting here, or responding to what others post.
Sometimes I wonder about posting here at all.
Feels like I'm talking to myself, most of the time. Neutral
Builder
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 03:47 am
@msolga,
There's a board that I started many moons ago that is still kinda humming along. It's dominated by ranting right-wingers, but there's a few centrists and lefties there to balance things out.

It's kinda rough-and-tumble, and typically Aussie in a lot of ways. Check it out. At least you get replies to your posts almost every day. http://www.debaterelate.com/forum/index.php
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 04:27 pm
@msolga,
Catching up on the news on this Saturday morning.
Here's what the cartoonists have to say.
Pope on the super-trawler bunfight.

http://images.theage.com.au/2012/09/14/3636266/li-gal-pope-20120914192153991034-600x400.jpg

Leunig on the super-trawler:

http://images.theage.com.au/2012/09/12/3627986/leunig-trawler-september-12-600x400.gif
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 04:35 pm
Petty on Malcolm Turnbull's lament about question time in federal parliament.
Is Abbott's contribution too narrow (say nothing of too aggressive?) in focus? Wink

http://images.theage.com.au/2012/09/10/3623079/Petty-Abbott-10-Sept-600x400.gif

Turnbull's plaintive cry not all that questionable:
http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/turnbulls-plaintive-cry-not-all-that-questionable-20120910-25orb.html
msolga
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 04:38 pm
@msolga,
Cath Wilcox on Turnbull's speech:

http://images.theage.com.au/2012/09/08/3619721/port-Wilcox-600x400.jpg
0 Replies
 
 

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