the mentality of the mob

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Some say that two heads are better than one. I dissagree. I feel, that in this day in age, with education as it is, and the individual drive for knowledge as low as ever (thanks to TV), that it seems that one head is better than one hundred.

Now granted that an educated organized group of people moving toward a predecided and commnon goal can and do get much done. But it seems that today either the education of the mob or the oranization of it is always lacking. And often times it is both that need attention.

To support this statement i cite the endless cases of dead and trampled parents. They died in the valliant effort and srtuggle for the aquisition of the newest and hottest christmas toy. I cite the riots and deaths and destruction associoated with the victory of a sports team.

Why is it that people in groups are so often unforgiviably stupid?

Thanks

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@vajrasattva,

I don't think anyone here would argue that, for example, truth was determined by a show of hands, or that a multitude was de facto smarter or wiser than a few select individuals. "A million times zero is still---zero" as Nietzsche wrote.
In politics, looking at the problem from a slightly different way, the rule of the majority is usually limited by law to secure the rights of minorities, history being full of examples of the "tyranny of the majority."

But one of the crises of the times seems to be the enshrinement of mediocrity and ignorance hand-in-hand with the concept that "everyone has a right to his opinions" and "all opinions are valid."

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@jgweed,

I think blaming TV is unfair- there is no reason why it shouldn't be an intelligent medium, and it sometimes is, but it is full of so much meingless garbage because it reflects society, not the other way round. Sure it helps propogate that society, but it is a harmful symptom, rather than a deadly cause.

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@avatar6v7,

Groups provide companionship, safety, comfort, and assistance. Many people prefer these attributes to independent thinking. How much of this vs. how much of that, do we each want. I personally prefer my individuality. However, most of the people I know, readily accept and assimilate the tenets of groups, in order to part of them.

I hope the trampled people enjoyed the moments when they were part of that group and craze.

Rich

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@vajrasattva,

vajrasattva;67349 wrote:

Some say that two heads are better than one. I dissagree.

same here.
In my opinion only groups of economical origin may make really added value.

vajrasattva wrote:

Why is it that people in groups are so often unforgiviably stupid?

I think, that's another question. There are many groups, where members are involved in them, because they're intelligent.
Please read my point of view in my blog.

1 Reply

@sneer,

I see the devaluation of intelligent thought expressed in "the mob mentality" in so many ways, too. Yes, TV guides people to "think" in terms of soundbites and visual clips. This could work, if as much forethought went into the brief "thought bite" as went into the contrived version we get. That's the deception of it, and what induces the "dumbing down".
I see the things that people are caught up in, and I feel sorry for them individually, and for society as a whole, because deliberate thought about important matters is rare indeed.
What are "important matters"? I assert that there is no reason for life but to attain Self knowledge, in the course of Self actualization. In short, "Know Thyself". In a well ordered society, everything would be geared to facilitating every individual in that effort. This is how it should be. Instead, our society is set up entirely opposite from that. It's all about catering to the ego, with short-term gratification; celebrity worship, and political correctness (at whatever level) as the end-all/be-all. This model is neither credible nor sustainable. This is why most, if not all friendships are transient. We find agreement with others only for as long as a particular ego goal is shared (sports; professional pursuits; clubbing; etc...) When I do find that rare other who shares my conviction about life, the friendship is limited by worldly events and involvements.
I suspect that the mob mentality is augmented by our misguided perceptions of what constitutes social conformity. So many people just accept social moorings, like organized religion, materialism; cultural identity, and so many other things that appear to be "larger than the individual". These herd trained animals are afraid of any concept of Self knowledge. This results in "mob mentality", which is one way of saying "herd mentality".

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@avatar6v7,

avatar6v7;67943 wrote:

I think blaming TV is unfair- there is no reason why it shouldn't be an intelligent medium, and it sometimes is, but it is full of so much meingless garbage because it reflects society, not the other way round. Sure it helps propogate that society, but it is a harmful symptom, rather than a deadly cause.

I agree with this. Shows like the British 'Big Brother' and it's international equivalents along with various other reality TV shows aren't even reflecting society; they are simply presenting it to an audience!

That said, the BBC broadcast investigative documentaries such as 'Horizon', which I feel I have learnt quite a lot from. One particular episode which sticks in my mind investigated the nature of human violence; speculating upon its origin and various proposed reasons for its presence. Another looked at the use of mathematics in order to reflect and analyse everyday life, which focused quite a lot on probability. Other documentaries that I have found incredibly interesting are presented by Louis Theroux. These are usually incredibly informative, and, like 'Horizon', encourage the audience to think about these subjects. Some are also rather enlightening, particularly one Louis Theroux documentary entitled: 'The Most Hated Family in America', which focused on presenting the everyday lives of people involved within and around the Westboro Baptist Church, if I can remember correctly.

These programs brought up many questions in my mind, some of which I have no doubt led to thoughts I have posted here. I like seeing this sort of material on television, because it shows that there is still a thirst for exploration of knowledge, and I hope that such shows encourage people to do some exploration of their own, as they have done for me.

On top of this, there is the occasional thoughtful drama, or even clever comedy, that floats along, and these can be just as thought provoking as the documentaries mentioned above.

Sorry to stray off subject, but TV definitely reflects society, and it's a shame that the thought-provoking type of programme doesn't quite balance out with the other, less intellectually able rubbish that fills our screens.

A mob, I would have thought, works distinctly by majority, and therefore I agree with vajrasattva. As an example, if TV was run by a 'mob', the more intellectual stuff would be drowned out, and then the media would just become one big mirror we could hold up to a non-diverse society.

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@vajrasattva,

The majority may be fine for making political or economic decisions given the plurality that makes it up; but it has never been qualified to become the arbiter of truth or beauty or spiritual values. Given the decline in our educational institutions, the trend to ignore the traditional values of civilisation, and the demands from all directions for entertainment, the majority may not even be suitable for making political and economic decisions.

1 Reply

@jgweed,

jgweed;79966 wrote:

The majority may be fine for making political or economic decisions given the plurality that makes it up; but it has never been qualified to become the arbiter of truth or beauty or spiritual values.

I'd say more, mob decisions are usually worse or suboptimal in best case.
See my blog entry (please stay with discussion here, don't want to break this interesting thread).

1 Reply

@sneer,

It's not just tv, it's also the social stigma attached to nerds and geeks that reinforces the dumbing down effect, especially those vulnerable to peer pressure. It can also be added to by your parents while growing up. I remember constantly being asked by my parents growing up if I ever go out and play, or do I just sit home in study. I was asked that even when going inside from playing football with a bunch of freinds, they sometimes associate smart people with being anti-social.

We aren't anti-social, we just don't need a huge crowd of friends. Though the blame for us becoming stupider can be spread around.

1 Reply

@hadad,

Quote:

It's not just tv, it's also the social stigma attached to nerds and geeks that reinforces the dumbing down effect, especially those vulnerable to peer pressure. It can also be added to by your parents while growing up. I remember constantly being asked by my parents growing up if I ever go out and play, or do I just sit home in study. I was asked that even when going inside from playing football with a bunch of freinds, they sometimes associate smart people with being anti-social.

We aren't anti-social, we just don't need a huge crowd of friends. Though the blame for us becoming stupider can be spread around.

so true man. When i make new friends and they find out that im smart, i always get the response 'you're pretty cool for a nerd'
people imagine intelligence as a scrawny, short, glassesed crewcutted individual with an overbite who can't say a word without a stuter.

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@jchai6,

jchai6;82474 wrote:

so true man. When i make new friends and they find out that im smart, i always get the response 'you're pretty cool for a nerd'
people imagine intelligence as a scrawny, short, glassesed crewcutted individual with an overbite who can't say a word without a stuter.

Lol. I play basketball with friends, every now and then there will be a new competitor. And when they find out I am a nerd they find it impossible that I am athletic, have perfect vision (no glasses), and am social.

it's so stupid, most nerds I know are just like me. I am not unconventional, there are plenty of athletic nerds like me i am sure :shifty:

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@vajrasattva,

vajrasattva;67349 wrote:

Some say that two heads are better than one. I dissagree. I feel, that in this day in age, with education as it is, and the individual drive for knowledge as low as ever (thanks to TV), that it seems that one head is better than one hundred.

Now granted that an educated organized group of people moving toward a predecided and commnon goal can and do get much done. But it seems that today either the education of the mob or the oranization of it is always lacking. And often times it is both that need attention.

To support this statement i cite the endless cases of dead and trampled parents. They died in the valliant effort and srtuggle for the aquisition of the newest and hottest christmas toy. I cite the riots and deaths and destruction associoated with the victory of a sports team.

Why is it that people in groups are so often unforgiviably stupid?

Thanks

i have to agree that among crowds hysteria and panic seem to rule, and they are extremely contagious. the problem is that once that happens they are so loud that the quiet voice of reason, even if spoken to them, would never be heard. if i went to the bazaar and said someone had slaughtered a cow, i would be able to get a crowd with a rope to follow me without even asking.

my question is, why is the voice of reason or peace and love not capable of mobilizing people to the same extent? i mean ok, there have been crowds following avatars-jesus, gandhiji...but mentioning what they stood for will not mobilize a crowd today, they were more a phenomenon of personal charisma i would say.

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@vajrasattva,

vajrasattva;67349 wrote:

They died in the valliant effort and srtuggle for the aquisition of the newest and hottest christmas toy. I cite the riots and deaths and destruction associoated with the victory of a sports team.
Why is it that people in groups are so often unforgiviably stupid?

In the case of the trampled parents it was the fear of being dis advantaged especially since they are in physical competition for the prize.

The mob mentality at any event is the extention of our natures to be included, with the thought of consequence spread over the heads of many and not the individual. A comforting thought as opposed to a one man riot, we push boundaries that we normally would not given the chance of retribution is slim.

Whatever the input source, information is information, there is no detremental form of communication, the messages may be suspect but the transmission source is irrelevant.

1 Reply

@Psycobabble,

The mentality of the mob is probably more apparent today than it has ever been. Our modern day media driven culture is made of tools, all specially designed to drive the nail in the head. Sure these mediums can be positive, but more often than not they make many into entertainment junkies, with ever increasing senseless programs that tend to stupefy one's curiosity and mitigate one's ability to focus.

The highly social nature of the human animal logically includes the pack mentality. We adapt to our environments by observing the behavior of others within it. Even so, there are always those within the mob who choose to challenge the social and ideological conventions of the day. We call these men and women free spirits, who are simultaneously admired and loathed by those who pretend not to think outside the box. Free spirits are more numerous in democracies, if only because democracy tends to make a brave soul out of the thinker.

1 Reply

@hue-man,

hue-man;83837 wrote:

The mentality of the mob is probably more apparent today than it has ever been.

Hue, a solid statement that we can all rationalize to be factual, but is it.
The mob mentality may be more apparent in our modern societies because of life pace and the number of gatherings available to the modern man, so it may be a numbers thing.

Quote:

Our modern day media driven culture is made of tools, all specially designed to drive the nail in the head.

Product advertisers and governments employ psychologists to advise on psychological techniques called "persuasive communication" to mine your mind. These guys do it by the book, the message, the source,the channel and the audience are all considered and manipulated, and we are presented with the end product looking looking like gold but smelling like excrement if you scratch the surface.

Quote:

Sure these mediums can be positive, but more often than not they make many into entertainment junkies, with ever increasing senseless programs that tend to stupefy one's curiosity and mitigate one's ability to focus.

I don't believe that there are any long term problems associated with the input of garbage as opposed to quality input for our brains. The brain works as hard digesting and directing response to the garbage as it does the quality, but we do loose something, and as you said it is curiosity, the ability to wonder as opposed to the force feeding of the plot, the theme , and the epilogue. Perhaps that is why it entertains us, we do not think we just watch it unfold with the knowledge that we do not control the outcome, the total observer.

The amount of time we have available to be stupefied is the problem, man has never had as much leisure time available as at present, and he gotta do something between sleep and sleep.

1 Reply

@Psycobabble,

This subject of the mob mentality has been coming back to me lately, as I observe the way it manifests in the crowds in Las Vegas.

One reason why it has become more apparent in more recent times is indeed because this mob has been provided with ever more refined choices in gathering places. Las Vegas provides quite a theme for them all to flock to, much like various spectator sports, and other, more localized theme parks.

At the bottom of it all, I believe, is that we just plain are not very evolved as of yet. Not in our social structures, or any of the other aspects that comprise civil development, and not as individuals. We are predisposed to this development, but all mankind has been at it for only about 6,000 years or so.

Look at competition and war making (aggression in general). I should think that these traits would eventually fade from civilization. Right now though, aggression plays a huge part in mob mentality. A small group of people will most likely stand and wait for a light to change before they cross the street. As the number increases, the willingness to just move en mass increases also.

Mankind has a very long way to go before civil decency matters more than the will of the perceived majority.

Mod - Please space your paragraphs!

1 Reply

@sparrowminded,

sparrowminded;83974 wrote:

Look at competition and war making (aggression in general). I should think that these traits would eventually fade from civilization.

Sparrow, I think not. We are at the top of the predation tree on earth, and as such the attitude that drives us to impose our will and use aggression to achieve the ends we desire is a staple psychological character of our top of the food chain position. We are here because of it, not in spite of it. The altruistic society you speak of is achievable on a generation to generation basis, if our creature comforts and psychological needs are satiated. But should either of these two components to an altruistic society go missing, we would immediately revert to dog eat dog, it's what got us here and it's in us. We subjugate it because we have a conscience, but it still lives.

1 Reply

@Psycobabble,

It appears that you assume that humankind will not further evolve. Homo Sapiens divided from the apes only a relatively short time ago, and we have established the rudiments of civilization in just the past 6,000 or so years. We are still in the first iteration from the apes, so of course, your statements are true, for now. "Mob mentality" is still in us, and it naturally over-rides personal identity. If the village was invaded by a rogue Mastadon, we would revert to that mob mentality by necessity, to rid ourselves of the collective threat. That is indeed still in us.

Now, let's just hitch a ride on the asteroid hooshy-booshy, which passes near earth orbit only once every 250k years. Take a nap. On the next pass, wouldn't we hope to find that mankind had become more peaceful, benevolent and spiritually advanced?

Actually, I am more inclined to believe that we have a whole bunch yet to work through. There could well be a period where the folks who run things will attempt to engineer different human types. Soldiers; physical laborers; aristocrats; scientists, and so on. You know, it won't be really bad, if these tests are done on clones. The donor has a "normal" life, right? How long would it take for these guys to get tired of messing with the prototypical homo sapiens, and attempt to synthesize the next evolutionary step? Can they nullify the mob instinct, to keep ver. 2 from taking over? There are a lot of traits that I would like to see worked out. Greed and corruption, at the very top. This tinkering could go on for a very long time, before "they" realize that we need a real next version.

1 Reply

@sparrowminded,

How does one define nerd, as opposed to intellectual? They certainly overlap, but they also differ greatly.

One can be an intellectual and be very charming and social. They can host parties and socialize with the guests without problems. A friend of mine has very little problem with maintain a near perfect GPA in hard science while publishing research papers and hosting parties. He engages with a wide variety of people from artists to typical frat guys (who often times are easier to get along with than you might think). I have heard him referred to as a 'really smart guy', but never a nerd. One can pursue intellectual activities and still be adventurous and social, it is all about balance. The problem is that 'nerds' are often escapists, they escape into whatever discipline to get away from an aspect of life that they fear or do not understand.

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