11
   

I Love Boobies

 
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 04:20 pm
@JTT,
Quote:
I think that there are likely teachers who are of Black ancestry or Chinese or Japanese who would feel uncomfortable talking of the past.


It depends on how it is talked about. There are certainly jokes that many teachers would find inappropriate in the classroom.

I am not saying that there is anything, including breast cancer, that shouldn't be respectfully discussed.


ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 04:25 pm
Let's look at this from a teacher's perspective.

What if people at your work started wearing these bracelets-- not as a respectful act toward a meaningful issue, but as a immature prank? What if the phrase starts getting whispered, used in a harassing way with tittering behind your back.

At what point would you go to your boss, or to human resources and demand that this stop?

You can stop inappropriate behavior at your place of employment (assuming, of course, you are not a teacher).
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 04:27 pm
@ebrown p,
I asked, and you failed to answer for this particular situation, which really is crucial if we don't want to go around in circles for forever.

Do you believe that the group who put this slogan together did it as a juvenile joke? Did the 16 year old girl who was interviewed in the article wear it to school as a juvenile joke?
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 04:33 pm
@ebrown p,
Nothing that I read points to your what if. Let's not waste our time on these. No one is suggesting that the subject be turned into a vaudeville/standup comic routine.

The suggestion has been advanced that it is better to deal with these serious issues with a degree of levity. I think that it works.
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 04:36 pm
@JTT,
The group did not do it as a juvenile joke. The 16 year old girl very likely did not do it as a juvenile joke. I don't believe that this is a very crucial point at all.

What about the other side- do you think the teacher's and faculty of this school oppose breast cancer awareness?

My understanding of what happened is that some kids were tittering in the classroom to the point that teachers and students found it annoying-- not because they were opposed to the original message, but because it became a sexual joke.

Again, if this happened at my place of employment, there is a process in place to stop it. My employer has a legal responsibility to provide a workplace that is free from sexual harassment. The school has a similar responsibility.

The point is that you can have a serious discussion about breast cancer as a serious issue without this.

JTT
 
  3  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 04:47 pm
@ebrown p,
Quote:
My understanding of what happened is that some kids were tittering in the classroom to the point that teachers and students found it annoying-- not because they were opposed to the original message, but because it became a sexual joke.


That may be but it may also be that yet another principal kneejerked and then spoke the standard line for why he thought it necessary to stop this great moral outrage from infecting his school.

Once this was stopped, there would be no dirty jokes, no sexual innuendo, no gestures from any students anywhere in the school.

Instead, why couldn't he, or the teachers, have pointed out that this bit of language whimsy has something very serious at its core. Let's enjoy the joke, the use of language and then let's focus on the important issues.
ebrown p
 
  0  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 05:32 pm
@JTT,
It is very simple for you to second guess the decisions of educators. I suspect that if you had any idea about what it took to run a school, or even a classroom, your simplistic solutions might seem a bit silly (it would be interesting to hear other teachers chime in).

I will note that educators, that is teachers and principals, don't seem to get very much respect or understanding in these discussions of classroom issues. People with no clue on how to run a classroom seem to have awfully strong opinions about it.

I will also note that sexual innuendo would not be tolerated as "language whimsy" in any professional workplace outside of a school (nor should they be).



ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 05:45 pm
@ebrown p,
Really? We used to have a lot of language whimsy flying around at the lab and that sometimes included innuendo, not usually, as it was more free association. Innuendo, that sounds so evil. Bright people play with language, or some of them do. Harassment was poor form, by popular consent, but whimsy was welcome. You are starting to remind me of my mother, who never mentioned the word 'sex'.

ebrown p
 
  0  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 05:54 pm
@ossobuco,
Quote:
Really? We used to have a lot of language whimsy flying around at the lab and that sometimes included innuendo.


Osso, if anyone was offended by something said in your lab, would you have persisted? Generally in a workplace, the rules are set by consensus where anyone can stop a joke that they feel crosses the line.

In a classroom, if teachers feel a joke is crossing the line (either becoming offensive, or just educationally distracting) they should have the same ability to stop it.

The issue here is that educators need be able to manage the classroom.

(I hate to break it to you Osso, but your mother did have sex)
engineer
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 06:12 pm
@ebrown p,
ebrown p wrote:

I will note that educators, that is teachers and principals, don't seem to get very much respect or understanding in these discussions of classroom issues. People with no clue on how to run a classroom seem to have awfully strong opinions about it.

Exactly. A teacher has an hour to an hour and a half to cover the material and help his students understand it. But on this day, some student has brought a distraction into the class and doesn't put it away when asked. So the solution is for the teacher to scrap his lesson plan and teach about a subject he is unprepared to teach about? I don't understand why some think the students should decide the topic of discussion during math class should be breast cancer. Who speaks for the students who need time to understand math? Should they wear a math bracelet to English class? As for the principal, from the original article: "The school is telling students to either turn them around or take them off." That's the tremendous sin here, asking the students to take them off or turn them around. That seems like a fair request once it's clear there is an issue. I doubt the students intended to create a disturbance, but once it was obvious that they were, I can't understand why they wouldn't honor a simple request or why I should support their insistence on deciding what gets taught when by the school.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 07:29 pm
@ebrown p,
Quote:
I will also note that sexual innuendo would not be tolerated as "language whimsy" in any professional workplace outside of a school (nor should they be).


Please stop flying off onto silly tangents, Mr Brown. We are talking about a campaign to fight breast cancer. I really can't imagine anyone being offended by such a slogan and I must say once more, I'm gobsmacked to hear it come from you.
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 08:12 pm
@JTT,
Quote:
We are talking about a campaign to fight breast cancer.


No we are not talking about a campaign to fight breast cancer. If this particular slogan is any part of a serious campaign to fight breast cancer... it is a pretty insignificant one.

I happen to know what a serious campaign to fight breast cancer looks like. There is one at my workplace. There is an organized walk to raise money that has tacit support from my corporation and there are pink ribbons that many people wear and everyone understands. There is widespread support for addressing breast cancer without the use of the phrase "I love boobies".

The fact is I have never heard the phrase at my workplace. If people started using the phrase, it would probably be considered inappropriate by some. But, even if it wasn't, it certainly wouldn't add anything to a serious campaign.

If you feel this phrase is so important that it is worth offending someone, then go ahead... why don't you use this phrase at work tomorrow? Tell me what happens.
ossobuco
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 08:32 pm
@ebrown p,
Yes, I know that. Who do you take me for?

I see your point on educators needing to control the classroom. I think a smart educator could use the moment. But, as you will point out, I've not been a teacher. Lecturer once in a while. I get that the classroom hour needs to be maintained. This circumstance seems like a teaching moment.

0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  3  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 09:17 pm
@ebrown p,
ebrown p wrote:
But, even if it wasn't, it certainly wouldn't add anything to a serious campaign.


and maybe a not so ******* serious approach to a campaign would work better

jesus ******* christ, people with cancer have senses of humour - humour isn't removed with the diagnosis or treatment. there's nothing flipping wrong with jokes about body parts and cancer in a campaign to fight the group of diseases. Most of the cancer support groups I've had involvement with (primarily through the dragon-boat racing community) are bawdy and raucous, and the breast cancer gang uses plenty of humourous boob and tit references.

Don't be so afraid of humour. It'll be easier on you than always having to be so earnest.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 09:18 pm
@ebrown p,
Quote:
If you feel this phrase is so important that it is worth offending someone, then go ahead... why don't you use this phrase at work tomorrow? Tell me what happens.


I Love Boobies. Keep-a-breast.

Should earn me a whole raft of vote downs as the average A2Ker steams over such an odious set of words.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  2  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 09:19 pm
@ebrown p,
ebrown p wrote:
If you feel this phrase is so important that it is worth offending someone


what is offensive about loving boobies or boobs or tits?
JTT
 
  1  
Reply Wed 12 May, 2010 09:20 pm
@ehBeth,
I see what you mean, E Brown. I get blasted from the very next poster.
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Sat 15 May, 2010 08:34 am
All they had to do was have a quick 40 min lesson on breast cancer and the charity work behind such catch phrases and how they work in the modern economy .....most would have said, Oh God No.....school work... and that would have ended the matter.
0 Replies
 
 

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