10
   

It's hard not to think of guns these days . . .

 
 
Ceili
 
  3  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 11:36 am
Then there is the whole equal force thing... If you shoot someone coming at you with a fist, you deserve to go to jail.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 11:38 am
@Ceili,
Ceili wrote:
Then there is the whole equal force thing...
If you shoot someone coming at you with a fist, you deserve to go to jail.
Better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.

There have been some well known victims
who have never recovered from injuries
inflicted by fist, before the victim shot the predator
(e.g., loss of hearing, loss of an eye, permanent spinal damage, with pain. . . . )
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 11:45 am
@Ceili,
Ceili wrote:
Then there is the whole equal force thing...
If you shoot someone coming at you with a fist, you deserve to go to jail.
In America, in 24 of the 50 States (so far)
thay have Castle Doctrine that legally protects the victim who applies self defense,
including defense with lethal effect.

I can t comment about the law of your country.





David
0 Replies
 
Mame
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:07 pm
In Canada, there have been cases where burglars have hurt themselves breaking in to a home and they have successfully sued the homeowner. How 'bout that? Kerazy.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:21 pm
@Mame,
Mame wrote:
I agree with Chai in principle except I don't like guns so I'd prefer a trained German Shepherd or two. I wish we could put up electric wire or top our fences with broken glass - that might help keep the buggers out. We really should be able to defend our family and property. One of the homes I owned was burglarized 5 times. I got kind of tired of it. If I'd had a dog, the perp would have paid for it. One time a neighbour saw legs sticking out of our cat door and called the cops. I don't know how but the cop and dog got in that way, too, and chased the little **** into the attic. There the dog got a hold of him and the **** required 4 hours of stitching. Smile
Mame, if u don 't feel comfortable around guns, and u prefer not to try them,
then we just have to accept that as a life choice and deal with your burglary problem differently.
Big dogs are a fine idea. Put up conspicuous signs saying "BEWARE OF DOG"

A simple, easy tactic is leave some electric lights on in your house.
When I go out in my naborhood at nite, I see that ALL of my nabors
are a bunch of stingy cheapskates (some of whom have complained of burglaries);
i.e., my naborhood consists of DARK houses at nite, except mine.
I am generous with lights, and I have them on security timers
that automatically turn on and off at irregular short intervals
to give the discernable appearance of conscious activity.


Therefore: MY abode stands in contrast to all of the houses
whose occupants appear either to be absent, or to be asleep.
I have advised my tenants in my other houses to be generous with electric lights at nite
and I have encouraged harboring of Big Dogs. I have never had a burglary in any of my houses.





David
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:31 pm
@Mame,
Mame wrote:
In Canada, there have been cases where burglars have hurt themselves breaking in to a home
and they have successfully sued the homeowner. How 'bout that? Kerazy.
Its a horrible thing. U need to apply democracy as well as possible
to dump the friends of criminals and to replace them with friends of future victims. No joke.

U have the freedom to consider
whether u wanna import American defensive philosophy
as manifested in Castle Doctrine; (i.e., civil and criminal immunity of victims).
Additionally:
remember that problem when u go to sit on a jury, civil or criminal.

Do unto the defendants as u woud have them do unto u, if u were the defendant.





David
0 Replies
 
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:37 pm
@Ceili,
Ceili wrote:

Then there is the whole equal force thing... If you shoot someone coming at you with a fist, you deserve to go to jail.

How about shooting two guys breaking into your home at night, or two guys trying to rob you at knifepoint on a city street? Are those actions sins in your universe?
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:41 pm
@Brandon9000,
so you see a guy running from your bedroom window carrying a t.v., should you shoot him in the back?
chai2
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:44 pm
@dyslexia,
No, but if you wake up and he's in your house, you have no way of knowing if he just wanted the TV.

anyways, I have a flat screen that connected to the wall.
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:50 pm
@Mame,
Mame wrote:
In Canada, there have been cases where burglars have hurt themselves breaking in to a home and they have successfully sued the homeowner. How 'bout that? Kerazy.


So bizarre...but it's happened here, too:
http://www.wisn.com/news/9950016/detail.html

Doctor woke up to find intruder...told him to leave, guy wouldn't, so doctor shot him in the back. Intruder sued from jail!
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 12:58 pm
@chai2,
Quote:
No, but if you wake up and he's in your house,
agreed.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:13 pm
@Irishk,
Mame wrote:
In Canada, there have been cases where burglars have hurt themselves breaking in
to a home and they have successfully sued the homeowner. How 'bout that? Kerazy.
Irishk wrote:
So bizarre...but it's happened here, too:
http://www.wisn.com/news/9950016/detail.html

Doctor woke up to find intruder...told him to leave, guy wouldn't, so doctor shot him in the back. Intruder sued from jail!

That is the reason that we need CASTLE DOCTRINE = both civil and criminal immunity, by statute, to protect the victim.
Demand it of your State legislators. Thay are supposed to be on YOUR side, not on the criminals' side.





David
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:15 pm
David...does the Castle Doctrine include baseball bats? Mr.Irish probably would have given that intruder a concussion...we could still be sued in most states.
Linkat
 
  2  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:20 pm
@Mame,
Nice - I like that!

We had a dog growing up - he was a great watch dog and everyone in the neighborhood was frightened of him - not that he would attack you if one of us was out walking him, but he was extremely protective of the house (he was part German Shepard). Although he wasn't very big (mom was a cocker spaniel), he had a big bark and postman, paperboy all were frightened of his bark.

Not sure if it was still when he was around or he had just been put down (poor thing could barely get up) - my parents kept the danger dog sign up - neighbors on both sides of my parents' house was broken into, but they bypassed their house. Something to be said for a protective dog.

Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:21 pm
@Ceili,
Good then no one should bother me.
0 Replies
 
Irishk
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:21 pm
@Irishk,
Irishk wrote:
David...does the Castle Doctrine include baseball bats? Mr.Irish probably would have given that intruder a concussion...we could still be sued in most states.


Never mind Smile I looked it up...bats are covered:

Quote:
A Castle Doctrine (also known as a Castle Law or a Defense of Habitation Law) is an American legal doctrine that arose from English Common Law[1] that designates one's place of residence (or, in some states, any place legally occupied, such as one's car or place of work) as a place in which one enjoys protection from illegal trespassing and violent attack. It then goes on to give a person the legal right to use deadly force to defend that place (his/her "castle"), and/or any other innocent persons legally inside it, from violent attack or an intrusion which may lead to violent attack. In a legal context, therefore, use of deadly force which actually results in death may be defended as justifiable homicide under the Castle Doctrine.

plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:46 pm
@Linkat,
I can imagine a shark is dangerous . . . those teeth. Although they need to keep moving to breathe and I am not certain they can breathe long out of water.

A friend lived in northern NH for a year and said that hunting was a necessity for many families. She just made certain that she wore bright orange or red when she walked, whether along the road or in the woods.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:46 pm
@Irishk,
Irishk wrote:
David...does the Castle Doctrine include baseball bats?
It does. It contemplates the use of violence in defense of the victim, regardless of lethal effect upon the predator,
and it repeals any (liberal) legal duty to retreat.
The philosophy is that when a citizen becomes the victim of predatory violence,
that is BAD ENUF already, and government shoud not make it even worse
by threatening the victim nor plaguing him with tortious nor criminal litigation,
costing the victim more for his lawyer's fees that the criminal woud have stolen.



Irishk wrote:
Mr.Irish probably would have given that intruder a concussion...
we could still be sued in most states.
Yes. Meritless litigation abounds. If u DON 'T give him any concussion,
nor even threaten to do so, he can still sue u anyway,
telling any number of lies against u. Not all criminals are honest.
A concussion, of itself without more, is not necessarily a horrible effect.
If Mr. Irish or u merely shake your fist at him,
in the law of torts that is an assault,
whose definition at common law was putting a man
of ordinary bravery in fear of an imminent battery.
To batter him is to hit him. If u swing your fist or your bat at him
and u miss him, that is an assault, if he saw the gesture or movement.





David
0 Replies
 
plainoldme
 
  0  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:50 pm
@Brandon9000,
No, but I disagree with the nature of the threat that so many people represent. BTW, my former home was broken into by vandals, but it was a former friend of my son who had an ax to grind. When I lived in Detroit, my car was stolen several times but owning a gun would not have prevented the thefts unless I stayed up and at the window all night. My parents were robbed by two men who broke into their house wearing stocking masks and carrying sharpened screw drivers. They tied my father up and took my step mother upstairs, claiming they had been to the bank that day and withdrew $800. My parents were shaken but unhurt.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 01:50 pm
@Irishk,
Irishk wrote:
David...does the Castle Doctrine include baseball bats?
Mr.Irish probably would have given that intruder a concussion...
we could still be sued in most states.


Irishk wrote:
Never mind Smile I looked it up...bats are covered:
I 'm sorry, K; I 'm not too fast with typing this stuff out.

Anyway, u found the correct result.





David
0 Replies
 
 

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