what is "consciousness"?

(I been takin' lessons . . . )

'Consciousness' is nothing more than a collection of characteristics which attempt to represent 'Be'-ing. It is an attempt to 'capture' 'Be'-ing and predict it's behavior, i.e., control it.

'Spirit' and 'soul' are also a collection of characteristics which attempt to represent 'Be'-ing.

'Consciousness', 'spirit', and 'soul' are futile attempts to imprison who you are into a concept. Even after 'capturing' all of the characteristics you can 'think through', you are still left with the experience of "I'm more than that, at least I think I must be" - 1968, The Moody Blues

'Consciousness', 'spirit', and 'soul' don't exist. You do!!!

"You" without any kind of measure or reference does n´t exist either...you just don´t have the brains to figure something as basic as that...(and for the purpose of asserting a measure it does n´t matter much how much that measure is changing from point A to point B)

...in fact there´s no "you" without a relation...and there´s no relation if nothing to relate with..."you" is just as precarious as anything else !...

Come back and talk to me when you've developed a sense of humor.

Silly Rabbit! There is no "kind of measure or reference" and there is no point A to point B! They are fictitious representations of space and time as seen in the 'reflection in the glass'. They have nothing to do with who you are.

Come back and talk to me when you've developed a sense of humor.

To say what there is, and what there is not, we are always in a relative construction of perspective patterns of reference in between the relation of other patterns ! (and on and on and on...)

You think you know it all, but you don´t get the basics for a start...the "you" you speak of is no exception.

...you just pathetically try to kill an "object" with another "object"...how sad and pitiful is that for a man of your age, eh ?

...the "rabbit " insult attempt won´t save you from your intrinsic dumbness...

So if we are not each a consciousness, then what are we?

What do you mean by "Be"-ing?

What is there beyond concepts that can actually be identified beyond the use of concepts?

Ah, the cleverness of the elementary school playground.

Can we try and transcend the playground banter and become more than school kids?

...rather the problem always was that some kids are bigger then others...

(...I often have my "fights" with Setanta but geee... he is in an all different league ! I can learn something with him. )

I was showing you that I do have a sense of humor. Instead of seeing it, you judged it. Your loss! You only go around once in life.

...it must be the square root type of sense of humour...!

I assure you that i've lost nothing, and that you displayed puerile petulance, rather than humor. Keep trying, though, i'm sure you can muddle your way to a rationalizationwhich sounds plausible . . . given enough time . . .

First thing you should notice is that you asked "what are we?" You are not a "what". You are not an entity, an identity, or a thing. You exist and you have already determined your own existence.

I was looking for information on prehistoric man and found the following in Wikipedia. “Humans are noted for their desire to understand and influence their environment, seeking to explain and manipulate phenomena through science, philosophy, mythology, and religion.”

"Desire to understand and influence", "seeking to explain and manipulate". What? The phenomenon, the butterfly if you will. We can't just “Let It Be” - John Lennon.

By the way, not only are we the source of the "desire to understand and influence" and the "seeking to explain and manipulate". We are also the source of “science, philosophy, mythology, and religion.” We are the 'source' of it all and instead of uncovering the 'source', we refuse to dis-cover the 'source'. The world is full of naked people lying about being naked.

'Existence' or 'Phenomenon' (that which shows itself in itself) is the closest you will come to a 'what'.

If you are looking for something "beyond concepts", you are moving in the wrong direction.

'You' come before the concepts. The combination of characteristics (concepts) are acquired from observing 'you', 'Be'-ing.

However, instead of deconstructing the concepts we subjugate our questioning to tradition. When tradition becomes master what it transmits becomes concealed. Tradition takes what has been handed down to us and delivers it over to self-evidence which blocks our access to the 'sources' of the concepts we use day-to-day. It makes us forget that the concepts we use had such an origin and nullifies the necessity of going back to these 'sources'.

These 'sources' are who you are. If you don't do the work of uncovering these 'sources' life is nothing more than comparing the 'reflection in the glass' you see with others.

You've proven to me that anybody can be right about anything. What a waste.

Actually, that's the only cogent comment on the drivel that's been posted in this thread. And yes, i agree that talking shops such as this are a waste. However, they can be redeemed through self-amuse . . .

Because you call what's been posted in this thread 'drivel' says that you came in with and are leaving with your own pre-conceived notions. You could have done that without all of the typing. Again, what a waste and I'm not talking about "talking shops such as this".

Actually, you don't know the first thing about it. I've followed this thread since it began, but with little interest because it has been mostly a talking shop. The people here talk past one another, and show no apparent interest in reaching an agreement on the topic, or even basic terms which would lead them there. It seems that, apart from the OP, they're only interested in displaying the excellence of their perception--at least according to themselves.

No, i didn't come here with any "pre-conceived notions." I came here and posted for the first time with a bit a humor which was referential to another member and another thread. I don't expect you to understand that, though, as it appears that you're just as lost in the contemplation of what you probably consider your incisive mind as are far too many of the philosophy forum refugees.

What's really hilarious, though, is contemplating your last post in the light of your accusation against me that i had been judgmental.

Pot, meet kettle.

"You" comes not before but with the concepts...a nuance out of grasp to your kind of linear reasoning...