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Philadelphia Transit Union Strike

 
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 08:19 am
@ehBeth,
Please, help me understand.
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 08:22 am
@Gala,
No Gala, I think you've missed the point. The Union is not helping the little guy, they are only helping themselves.

I hope Philly fires all these clowns for walking out on their jobs in this economy, after the Federal government had to send millions of dollars to their city to keep them all employed in the first place.
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 08:30 am
@Gala,
I know they make more than cops do in Philadelphia.

http://www.ppdonline.org/career/career_benefits.php
Quote:

The current yearly salary for a Police Officer Recruit in the Police Academy is $39,251 ($1,503.87 bi-weekly). After graduating the academy as a Police Officer, you receive a pay increase to $41,974 ($1,608.20 bi-weekly). There are scheduled increases in pay to the present maximum of $54,513 a year (2,088.62 bi-weekly).


I know they make more than our Soldiers do, fighting for our very freedoms.

I know they make more than many nurses.
I know they make more than many teachers.
I know they make more than many, many, many, many Americans.

And now they're striking, so that they can make even more. AND they're making it even harder for people to trust and support mass-transit in our cities. Which IS a big deal. Which IS what is needed to combat CO2 emissions. Which IS what is needed to help combat poverty.


Just doesn't seem right.
Green Witch
 
  3  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 08:36 am
In our pursuit of what we perceive as not wanting to pay more, Americans will continue to support the lowest common denominator of wages and benefits. The standard of living continues to decline for the majority of Americans, but it is those very same Americans who make the choices that create the collapse. Why pay a little more to help a fellow countryman, and in the process help the country's standard of living as a whole, when it could save you a dollar to two? Years ago we chose to pay $15 dollars for a sweatshirt made in Asia instead of $18 for a sweatshirt made in America because we didn't want to pay for union standards. Now we don't have to worry about it because Americans don't make sweatshirts anymore and the former garment workers are cashiers at Walmart. And so it goes - penny wise and pound foolish America will eventually have the same economic system as India and China- a handful of very rich supported by a mass of drones barely getting by.
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 08:39 am
@Green Witch,
Please; you're telling me that making only 70k/year in total benefits is akin to working in sweatshops in Malaysia?

If I think they should only be making 50k/year in total benefits then I'm a slave-labor supporter?

It's not about me saving a dollar or two; it's about me supporting improved and increased mass-transit programs, which are severly hampered by these Union wages and strikes.
0 Replies
 
Gala
 
  2  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 08:56 am
@maporsche,
Quote:
No Gala, I think you've missed the point. The Union is not helping the little guy, they are only helping themselves.

I hope Philly fires all these clowns for walking out on their jobs in this economy, after the Federal government had to send millions of dollars to their city to keep them all employed in the first place.

I believe all the clowns on Wall Street are the people you are talking about helping themselves. What about this economy? Don't scapegoat the transit workers for Wall Street not being able to regulate itself.
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 08:58 am
@Gala,
Those wall street clowns should all be fired too. I've opposed TARP and the stimulus since DAY 1. Banks should have failed, bankers should have lost their jobs.

Don't try to muddy this issue with something un-related. There are other theads for that.
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  3  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:07 am
@maporsche,
I have to agree with beth.
If you think driving a city bus isnt skilled labor, then you really dont have a clue as to what you are talking about.

A bus is on average about 40 feet long, with some of them being articulated (they bend in the middle) and that makes them as much as 70 feet long.

A driver must be able to manuever them in city traffic safely.
That means he must watch every corner when he makes turns, he must watch traffic, he must be able to judge distances for stopping, turning, pulling away from bus stops, etc.
Of course while he is doing this he is also responsible for the safety of his passengers, so he must watch them to.
He must be able to recognize all of the blind spots in his mirrors, and know when there is a person or an object in those blind spots.

He must also have a working knowledge of the bus operating systems.
He must be familiar with how the air brakes work, how his fuel system works, and all of the other systems.
He does a "walkaround" inspection before he leaves the garage at the start of his shift, and reports any problems he finds to maintenance to get them fixed.

Driving a city transit bus is skilled labor.

Oh, and lets not forget that he also must know how tall his bus is so that he knows if he can clear any tunnels or overhangs on his route.
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:12 am
@maporsche,
Quote:

I know they make more than many nurses.
I know they make more than many teachers.
I know they make more than many, many, many, many Americans.


I bet the nurses union is supporting these workers.
I bet the teachers union is supporting these workers.

There is no union in my job (I am a white collar worker) I strongly support the role the unions play in leveling the playing field between employers and employees.

Given the growing gap between rich and poor in the US (where the richest small percentage is grabbing a ridiculous percentage of wealth) there is no question that we need pressure to raise wages for the people (teachers, drivers, policemen, builders) who keep this country running.

It is funny that Maporsche complains that the salaries of workers (at $50K) are high-- and then says the unions don't do anything for their members.
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:12 am
@mysteryman,
Well see, that was helpful.


Regardless, I still think that's too much money (see comment about nurses, teachers, police officers, etc).
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:13 am
@ebrown p,
ebrown p wrote:

It is funny that Maporsche complains that the salaries of workers (at $50K) are high-- and then says the unions don't do anything for their members.


I think it's sad that you've resorted to LYING to make a jab at a me.
Please quote where I've said that?
0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:15 am
@maporsche,
I agree, they are asking for to much money, but it is skilled labor.
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:18 am
@ebrown p,
What do you think their salary should be?

If you are concerned about the growing gap between rich and poor in the US and if you truly think we need pressure to raise wages for the people (teachers, drivers, policemen, builders) who keep this country running, then would you support an increase in the minimum wage to $50/hr?

After all, wouldnt that help everyone?
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:21 am
@mysteryman,
I stand corrected. I appreciate you taking the time to detail out your objection, as opposed to simply 'telling' me how wrong I am.
Gala
 
  2  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:55 am
@maporsche,
Quote:
I stand corrected. I appreciate you taking the time to detail out your objection, as opposed to simply 'telling' me how wrong I am.

You have a good point here--about getting an explanation instead of being told you're wrong.

I'm curious, what do you do for a living? What do your parents do?
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:57 am
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

What do you think their salary should be?

If you are concerned about the growing gap between rich and poor in the US and if you truly think we need pressure to raise wages for the people (teachers, drivers, policemen, builders) who keep this country running, then would you support an increase in the minimum wage to $50/hr?

After all, wouldnt that help everyone?



Better to cap max salaries. Right now we have no incentive to pay larger amounts of money to people who actually help others... our entire system is set up to pay ever-increasing amounts to people who act only for their own gain. It's completely backwards from the way it should be.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 09:58 am
@maporsche,
mysteryman's covered it quite nicely. it's a tough job in many ways - technical, as well as social. Harder than any desk job out there. Worth more, in my estimation.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 10:02 am
@Gala,
Gala wrote:

I'm curious, what do you do for a living? What do your parents do?


I currently manage techincal projects related to telephony equipment for a financial services company. Basically, when you dial a 800 number to when you reach an customer service representitive, I am responsible for your experience in between those 2 points in time (the VRU, the hold music you hear, where you call gets routed, the data transfers, the call recording sytem, etc).

I'm the oldest of 6 children, grew up in poverty, family on food stamps, father is a short order cook at a breakfast joint, mother is a grocery store clerk, brothers and sisters are all in lower paying jobs than myself and have less education.

I'm currently still in school, which is being paid for by student loans and meager tuition reimbursement from my employer. I'm hoping that next fall I will be accepted to a local nursing program where I hope to become an RN.


Why do you ask?
roger
 
  2  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 10:14 am
@maporsche,
So long as the bus system is showing a profit, they might as well share it. Uh, Philadelphia is making a profit from their labor, aren't they?
maporsche
 
  1  
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 10:19 am
@roger,
roger wrote:

So long as the bus system is showing a profit, they might as well share it. Uh, Philadelphia is making a profit from their labor, aren't they?


Unlikely; most mass-transit is heavily subsidized by the local government. I do not know the details on Philly's specific system, but I'd be completly shocked if they were entirely self-sufficient.
0 Replies
 
 

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