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Religion in abundence

 
 
Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 01:18 pm
max,

If relevance were a requisite my birth would have been pretty useless. ;-)

No offense taken, but I did wonder a bit. I admit to having a chip on my shoulder about age.
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Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 02:00 pm
Craven -- why do you have a chip on your shoulder about your age? Surely you don't wish you were older, do you? I hope we all treat you with the utmost respect and biting sarcasm just as we would someone of more advanced years. If you want to be older (I cannot imagine why), give it time -- it will surely come!
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 03:24 pm
I have no qualm with my age, and my age is less of a factor on forums than in the brick and mortar world.
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Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 03:52 pm
Is that the same as F2F or are you thinking of something different?

I have neither a chip nor a qualm, but you said you had the chip so I was inquiring. (Nosy beast.) It is best to give someone the same respect whatever his or her age.

And anyway, you could be just giving us the business and really be a 57 year old man who likes to put people on.... HOW would we know?

Perhaps Maxdadeo inherited those ties....
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 03:58 pm
Oh my chip is that age is often played as an attempt a a trump card.

Here is a quote Hazlitt posted (from Robert Louis Stevenson):

"It is held to be a good taunt, and somehow or other to clinch the question logically, when and old gentleman waggles his head and says: 'Ah, so I thought when I was your age.' It is not thought an answer at all, if the young man retorts: 'My venerable sir, so I shall most probably think when I am yours.'"

I am probably too sensitive toward percieved discrimination against youth.
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Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:05 pm
Oh, I see. Good quote. Was Maxsdadeo trying to clinch the argument? Maybe he was!... nope... Just checked. I think he was marveling at you, but not arguing.
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Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:07 pm
Craven- As a older person, I have developed a modicum of wisdom, and of course, hindsight. One of the most important things that I have learned is to listen to the words of young people.

I may have experience, but the young look at life with fresh eyes. They are not bogged down with routine, and their ways of approaching a problem are not carved in cememt. They are the risk takers, and the innovators.

I think that older people, interacting with younger folks, will help to keep the older person's mind agile.

IMO any person who puts you down because of your age is an inflexible old fart!
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:08 pm
Although i agree in the main with what you've written, Phoenix, i would point out that in their rigidly held beliefs, the young can as inflexible, or even more so, than the old . . .
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:15 pm
Piffka,

I agree, max wasn't playing the age card and that's why I said I was being too sensitive about that.

Phoenix and Setanta,

I think many of the stereotypes about youth are justified, that's why they rankle me so.
I have to respect the wisdom my elders have piled up but in some cases (like once when a physics and mathematics debate truned into an age debate) it's just a cheap shot.

And I agree that youth can be as narrow minded as any, the proverbial youthful know-it-all arrogance and all that.
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Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:18 pm
Sentana- You may have something there. I think that because of inexperience, SOME young people may cling to dogma, although not necessarily in the religious sense.

As they mature from their teens to twenties, life experience, and hopefully, self confidence takes over, and clinging ridgidly is no longer necessary. Unfortunately some people NEVER develop that healthy sense of self. Those are the folks who are OLD at 22.
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:21 pm
Phoenix,
You must be a diplomat. ;-)
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Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:32 pm
Craven- Let's look at the physics and math debate in another way. At some point the person or persons with whom you were debating had nothing more to add to the discussion, so they played the "age" card.

That really was a sign to you that you had won the argument. Instead of being gratified, you found yourself on the defensive, so that you were incapable of realizing that you had beaten them.

I had seen people do this all the time on Abuzz political threads- not the age thing, but some other issue to take a person's attention away from the issue at hand, and cause them to become defensive. Anyway that you slice it, they are playing "dirty pool".
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:35 pm
Oh I didn't become defensive. I was just irked at their smugness and I wanted to both win and have them be visibly aware of it. ;-)

Chalk it up to my arrogance (I don't think it's youthful, it will be around for a while).
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Phoenix32890
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:38 pm
Craven- One thing that I have learned- Some things, (and some people) just don't have to matter!
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Nov, 2002 04:45 pm
I know the lesson but am still learning to heed it. "You can lead a man to wisdom, but you can't make him think" and "a man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still".

But knowing this just means I usually try to make the person join the fold while thinking it was his/her idea and this indicates that I still have to work on curbing the urge to want to convince them.

But I'm getting better at it.

I'm reminded of a anecdote where a man confronted by a drunk on the street who slurred (while obstructing his passage) "I never get out of my way for a fool" stepped into the gutter and replied, "But I always do". I don't remember who it was but I do think that the more foolish obstructions I meet the more likely I am to waste no time on them.
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Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Nov, 2002 07:11 am
Damned young whippersnapper . . .
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Piffka
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Nov, 2002 07:33 am
I fear for his life and soul in boot camp.
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babsatamelia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 27 Nov, 2002 11:55 pm
I had no idea that there is a discrimination
toward youth with respect towards AGE?
I felt/thought this was the land where only
youth is valuable - only the young are
beautiful, worthy, sexy, desirable, etc etc
I felt that there is discrimination towards
the elderly, for people assume you are a
doddering old fool....physicians do not seem
quite as interested in the final outcome WRT
your health, because, after all, you have less
time left here so are not as vitally important
as the young and healthy are.
Phoenix speaks so eloquently
We do NEED each other,
In The Prophet, Gibran speaks of us old parents
that we can never, ever know, learn or understand
what our children will know and
that they will travel far, far beyond
where we could ever hope to go
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Craven de Kere
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Nov, 2002 12:11 am
I'd rather be ugly than dumb.

This doesn't mean I think old people are ugly, and I don't believe that youth are dumb.
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williamhenry3
 
  1  
Reply Thu 28 Nov, 2002 12:59 pm
Even in our new century, we still see wars being waged in the name of religion. This obvious irony has always troubled me.
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