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britains stupid legal system strikes again

 
 
kev
 
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 12:12 am
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 2,882 • Replies: 39
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Montana
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 01:33 am
Unbelievable!
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 01:40 am
Well, the most importatnt here is

Quote:
Home Office lawyers admit failing to follow procedures and making errors when opposing a plea for bail.


That's how law works.



Btw, kev, could you give the source for this article?
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 01:45 am
There are quite some wrongly convicted asylum seekers in the UK.

Here's another case:

Couple with forged passports win £130,600 for wrongful jailing:Asylum error to cost UK millions
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kev
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 02:23 am
The man in this story below served twenty seven years for a crime he didn't commit, it has been suggested that HIS compensation be £200,000.

http://www.innocent.org.uk/cases/stephendowning/

£130,000 for serving 3 months and two months respectively, whilst entering the country illegally, £200,000 for serving 27 years, but of course the odds are stacked against Mr. Downing, because he was born here, and he's white.

This at a time when the government are pushing for the retirement age to be raised to 70 because there isn't enough money in the kitty to pay for British lifelong workers a pension. This country makes me f******g ill.

If someone had told me that one day I would vote for the British National Party, I would have dismissed them out of hand, but I give in they've got my vote, and no I'm not racist in any shape or form whatever, but enough is enough

perhaps if enough BNP councellors are elected, the idiots who run this country might start to take notice.
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Coaan
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 02:23 am
Whereas there might be cases of this in britain....a failing legal system is well shown in America...where even a criminal can get 'criminal damages' if the people they attack/mug/whatever defend themselves....the sad thing is these people can often take advantage of the victims.
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kev
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 05:37 am
Re: britains stupid legal system strikes again
kev wrote:


Tory Home Affairs spokesman Humfrey Malins said: "He's made a total mockery of our legal system.



No Humfrey, he hasn't, the British legal system is the biggest farce in the world, it always has been and it always will be whilst tossers like you are in charge
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 09:30 am
Kev
It is no different here in the US. Our liberal and permissive society has more compassion for the criminal than the victim. Oddly enough there are many laws to protect the criminals rights but very few to protect those of the victim.
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 09:37 am
I believe that's because we traditionaly prosecute the criminal. As the trend grows to counter prosecute. there will be more victims' rights.

And,au, it's a far FAR stretch to say our criminal justice system has more compassion for criminals.
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au1929
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 09:47 am
littlek
Not a stretch at all. It is my understanding that when a criminal is prosecuted for a crime against you. You as thre victim have no rights other than to testify. The crime now becomes one against the state to dispose of in any way they see fit.
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littlek
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 10:08 am
and that has what to do with compassion?
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 10:43 am
kev wrote:
If someone had told me that one day I would vote for the British National Party, I would have dismissed them out of hand, but I give in they've got my vote, and no I'm not racist in any shape or form whatever, but enough is enough

perhaps if enough BNP councellors are elected, the idiots who run this country might start to take notice.


Well, that's what NSDAP-supporters said here in in the 20's of last century as well.

From the 'Jewish Bulletin' (by Andrew Morris, April 25, 2003)

Quote:
"Jewish officials say the BNP is run and supported by people who have made virulently anti-Semitic and racist comments, and at least one party leader has been convicted for attacking a Jewish teacher. Some party activists are known Holocaust deniers, and they generally blame nonwhites for Britain's economic and social ills."
[...]
"The BNP play on fear. They want people to think they are the only force that will stand up for them against asylum seekers, high crime, lack of housing and the failure of the major parties to address these issues," Ryan said. "But what the protest voters often don't realize is that underlying this all is the race card. A vote for the BNP is above all else a vote against black people, Asians and, of course, Jews."
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Laeknir Scrat
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 12:20 pm
I'm with Walter.

Such kind of suicidal "protest" votes brought down democracies and caused much pain to millions.

Not that yours will, kev, but it's as morally wrong. Crying or Very sad
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Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 02:27 pm
You deny being a racist Kev, but I get the impression that for you, the law is subordinate to ethnicity.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 7 Oct, 2003 02:46 pm
Adolf Hitler and his Nazi Party came to power in Germany by promising a better life than democracy seemed to have provided and by playing on people's fears. A majority of Germans were persuaded to trade democracy for dictatorship.

The National Socialists, under Adolf Hitler, gained office in 1933. When the Reichstag was burnt down they seized the opportunity to pass the Enabling Act, which effectively created a one-party state. Once in power, the Nazis imposed a totalitarian regime upon the nation. The democratic experiment of the Weimar Republic was destroyed. The Nazis' use of repression and terror, their policies of rapid economic development and their fervent nationalism satisfied supporters and won over those who wavered, while targeted minorities - especially communists and socialists, and Jews and gypsies - were destroyed.

We all can learn lessons about safeguarding our own democracy from this past experience, and not just watch, how democracy is tried to be destroyed!
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kev
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Oct, 2003 02:32 am
Let me make my position crystal clear I am not a racist my angry comments are not directed at people from other countries, they are directed at the neverending stupidity of successive British governments who allow people from all over the world (obviously in the main that is from third world countries) to arrive here, often illegally, and who then from minute one get "rights" that British people can only dream about.

This is not the rantings of one englishman, this is the #1 story in Europe.


http://pws.prserv.net/mpjr/mp/dm200103.htm







http://pws.prserv.net/mpjr/mp/dm200103.htm
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Grand Duke
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Oct, 2003 03:05 am
I'd like to see statistics about the number of immigrants arriving in various European countries, and see if Britain does indeed take 'more than our fair share'. If we do, then I'm with Kev, and it is time to close the gates (like the Aussies). If we take less (as % of GDP or population or whatever) then we should do our bit and carry on letting them in until we are full.

One thing is for certain: it's easier for the average immigrant from wherever to get residency in Britain than it is for me (educated, experienced, solvent) to emmigrate to Australia or New Zealand (former colonies & fellow Commonwealth members). Go figure...
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kev
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Oct, 2003 04:28 am
Grand Duke, I wish I could find the source but I cant, not long ago the EU admitted that Britain was taking way over it's share of immigrants, and that of course is the legal ones christ knows what the final tally represent.
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Steve 41oo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Oct, 2003 05:26 am
OK Kev if you say you are not a racist, I accept that. But you have to admit that a lot of people who put forward some of the complaints and arguments that you have done most certainly are. Nick Griffin is a clever chap. The NF know they will find it difficult to make headway if they give vent to their true feelings, so they pull together some of the more absurd abuses and examples of our asylum/immigration laws and proceedures, and hope enough people take the bait. And it seems to be working. Extreme right wing fringe parties in the UK are getting more support. In my view this is potentially dangerous, especially with the virtual collapse of the established centre right party (Conservatives) and the power vacuum that creates.


There is no doubt asylum/immigration is a major issue. It stirs up strong emotions, its open to abuse, and its not easy to solve. (Except of course if you adopt the Conservative solution of a far away island--where might that be Mr Letwin?---oh I don't know but big enough to take them all and far far away. I'm still laughing). Asylum policy needs to be handled very carefully.

[But having said that there is a simple solution to stop millions of people drifting around the continent of Europe. Its achieved by giving them peace and security at home. However as that appears to be quite outside the boundaries of what is possible, we will have to accept that thousands of people will want to get out of war torn/poverty stricken/dangerous places on Europe's fringes]

You blame British governments for
Quote:
"allowing people from all over the world to arrive here"
. I'm not sure if you can blame the govt for "allowing" them to arrive. No one gave permission for them to arrive, they just turned up. There is an argument we should be pleased they want to live here. I'd find it rather worrrying with all the displaced persons around the world, if no one applied for asylum in Britain, doesn't that say something about us in Britain?

You say
Quote:
"from minute one get "rights" that British people can only dream about".
There's no real response to that but laughter. You mean someone who aspires to British citizenship, when he achieves it, is envious of the rights that applicants for citizenship receive the moment they arrive? I think there is an element of circular logic here. In fact your statement is just ludicrous. I wonder why you would say such a thing. Its not based on fact, and it makes me suspicious of your motives. However you are not a racist, so lets talk about that nice Jewish lady Melanie Philips, who's article you quoted.

I actually agree with quite a lot she says. She tries to clearly delineate the distinction between libertarian and liberal and shows how liberal values have been perverted and corrupted by libertarianism. Liberal values have to be protected sometimes by authoritarian measures. I think thats fair comment. The problem for poor Melanie was that having established a reputation as a liberal on the Guardian, she got some nasty things said about her from fanatics who thought her a traitor. So she ran away and now sits in the Daily Mail offices where she is happier sniping at the Govt, the Liberal Establishment, Tony Blair and all the other false progressives who have so grievously wounded her. And of course the Daily Mail is delighted. And if you're reading this Melanie, do try and cheer up a bit.

Just a note on the old Grand Duke's comment

Quote:
One thing is for certain: it's easier for the average immigrant from wherever to get residency in Britain than it is for me (educated, experienced, solvent) to emmigrate to Australia or New Zealand (former colonies & fellow Commonwealth members)



Is it? Can you give evidence to support your assertion?
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Grand Duke
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Oct, 2003 05:31 am
No. Sorry. I got carried away. I withdraw that comment completely and apologise.
0 Replies
 
 

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