When did Mexican become a "dirty" word?

It's ok. Sglass knows.

Boomer wrote


Of course it has the opposite effect. When we assign any kind of negative connotation to an identifying label, we diminish the people that such label refers to. Living in a border state, we have a sizable population of formerly Mexican citizens and to them (and those of us who are not Mexican) and they describe their heritage as Mexican distinct from descendants of the Spanish who originally conquered this area and have lived here ever since. So Mexican is certainly not a 'dirty word' here, and when we go out to dinner we order Mexican food.

I think the only ones who might attach a negative connotation to the word "Mexican" would be somebody who considers the Mexican people to be inferior. And that would make the person something of an ignoramous if not an a-hole.

To fbaezer, I love Speedy too. I think when we become so self conscious or overly sensitove that we can't have fun with who we are, we lose something special. (As a child, most of us had the children's book "Little Black Sambo" that was later removed from the library shelves and branded racist. I don't think it was racist at all. Sambo was smart and innovative and figured out how to solve a serious problem. I don't think identifying him as black put him down in any way. But because some racists mockingly used the term "Sambo" to refer to some black people, it became a derogatory term. I think that is unfortunate.

I hope we don't let racists do that with the word "Mexican".

Foxy, I think I basically agree with your post... but this quote is a bit confusing.

Aren't you living in a place that was formally part of Mexico, and wouldn't this mean that the descendants of the Spanish who originally conquered this area be Mexican? Mexico (an area which includes the place you are now living) was a Spanish colony. I don't get the distinction.

The distinction are descendants of the Spaniards who came from Spain and settled into the area that became the United States and stayed vs those who trace their geneology not to Spain but to the indigenous peoples of the land that became Mexico and/or those who were born citizens of Mexico. There are differences both in the cultures and in the food I might add. Mexican and Spanish are not synonymous though in this area both might refer to themselves as Hispanic. I'm sure there are Spanish descendents living in Mexico too though who refer to themselves as Mexican.

So the lines can be blurred, but there are distinctions.

I find it odd that any Americans of "Spanish" descent would make this distinction-- surely their ancestors would not. It was the Mexican American war (and the resultant Gadsen purchase) that made them Americans. Before that, their ancestors would have called themselves Mexicans.

It is also strange to separate the "Spaniards" from the "indigenous peoples". The residents of Mexico (including those people you are referring to as "original Spaniards) are really a mix... resulting from hundreds of years of Spanish colonial rule.

There is very no significant difference between the "Spaniards" where you live and the "Mexicans" just south of that relatively recent border.

The only cultural difference is between the two is from the past 150 years.

Your Spanish friends are really of Mexican descent... and they should be proud of that. Perhaps that is the point of the thread.

Though all Americans now, I have relatives who refer to themselves as being Mexican and are proud of it. And I have relatives who call themselves Spanish and are proud of it. Though they get along together very well, they see themselves as different from one another. The Mexicans do not wish to be called Spanish, and the Spanish do not wish to be called Mexican. (And neither want to be called gringo. )

I think I'll just keep taking my cue from them.

Taking offense has risen to the status of heroics.

You are a Salvadoran and someone refers to you a Mexican
You are a Swede and someone refers to you as a Norwegian.
You are Korean and someone refers to you as Chinese.

Unless they know your real nationality and are confusing it to irritate you, what is the big damned deal?

It's, more often than not, nonsense to suggest that person is disrespecting you by somehow not finding out precisely what country your ancestors hail from.

Only under very limited circumstances is it reasonable to expect someone to understand that the Welsh and Scottish are not actually English.

If your Welsh and someone refers to you as English, out of ignorance, you may want to politely correct them, but getting pissed off?

Even if the clown is trying to get a rise out of you, isn't preferable to ignore him then raise a big stink of offense?

There are, of course, times when offensive words or behavior should not be tolerated and it may even be heroic demonstrably "take offense," but such times do occur all that often in someone's life.

Most of the time, people are taking offense where noe is intended, or where the intention is obvious an trivial.

You're not lucky if you have a "thick skin," you're rational

Unfortunately, "thin skin" is being encouraged

That's for sure, but we all live in North America.

I didn't see this thread as dealing with who takes offense though. My previous post was just to clarify to another member my understanding/experience of the differences in the way people perceive themselves and my opinion that it is not up to any of us to dictate that.

I took the thesis of the thread to relate to those who attach a belittling or demeaning connotation to what some people call themselves. In this case, that term happened to be "Mexican" which apparently some are avoiding in referring to Mexican people. The reference was not to Mexican people taking offense, but rather others seeming to want it to be an offensive term.

The concern is not allowing a few narrow minded or misinformed people to make the designation "Mexican" into a derogatory or insulting term in American vernacular.

Porque a nadie esta diciendo el nombre: Mestizo? El Mestizo es una mezcla de los de Espana y los indios de Mejico. Mucha gente en Mejico en actualidad son Mestizos. Si?

I know some people who might - mentioned by dys in an old thread, people from very many centuries old families in new mexico, who turned out to be converso.
Their ancestors might have presaged Mexico as a country. Not that I intend to chase that down. Me, I don't care. I don't really believe in borders, but I like hearing about families.

Not that I'm a fan of powerful families or mafias either.

I know the people dys was talking about too. Link later.

Es vero. Yoi lo creo.

The other day I heard someone say "pinche gringo." What in the world did he mean by that?

as yer bud on the street, JL...

In Mexico, it's an all-purpose insult enhancer, which would be roughly equivalent to the use of ********* in English. If Jay (Silent Bob's hetero life mate) spoke Spanish, he would say *pinche* A LOT.

Gringo is self explanatory, no?

(next time scowl like you know what they are up to...)

Cool. We'll have JLN up to speed with the language in no time.

Meanwhile I wonder what JLN did to get called "pinche gringo"?

Foofie talking Spanglish again.

De hecho, la mayoria de los Mexicanos son mestizos.

Yeah, there are those who say that 'gringo' is only half a word. Needs a prefix. Just like below the Mason/Dixon line 'Yankee' is only half a word, also needing a prefix.

Actually, I get called "pinche gringo" quite a bit... usually it is jokingly.

The irony of this thread is that Mexicans culturally not hung up about language much at all.

I (born and bred American) had to get used to people referring to each other as "Gorda" (meaning fat and used to refer to a chubby woman). If you referred to anyone in my family by anything that had to do with weight, you would be slapped. Then I know a "Negro" (called that because of his dark complexion") and a "China" (because long ago someone thought she looked Chinese). All of these took me aback when I first heard them-- and I still don't use the nicknames "Negro" or "China". But, no one means or takes any offense. It is part of everyday culture.

(Sadly my other nickname is "Pelon" (which refers to the lack of hair on my head)).

This thread may be about how Mexicans are feeling uncomfortable with the anti-immigrant sentiment that is present in society. The other terms "Anchor Baby", "illegal", "invader" are far much more sinister.